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Question about P85D Insane Mode

Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by kirkbauer, Jun 26, 2015.

  1. kirkbauer

    kirkbauer Member

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    Obviously heavy acceleration with Insane Mode enabled will burn more energy, but what about normal driving with Insane Mode enabled? Or what if I accelerate slowly with Insane Mode enabled?

    Basically, is there value in turning it on or off, or can you just leave it on and accelerate as appropriate for each situation?

    PS - picking my car up today!
     
  2. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    Leaving it on effectively disables "torque sleep".

    What that means in actual kwh, I don't know. But if you're driving for max range I'd definitely leave it off. If you're bombing around town...meh, whatever.
     
  3. ra-san

    ra-san Member

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    Are you sure about the torque sleep comment? Seems contradicted on other threads and thought the conclusion was range mode on or off changes the aggressiveness of how much torque sleep is used, but that it was on whether or not range mode was on, and that normal vs. insane didn't change it at all.
     
  4. kirkbauer

    kirkbauer Member

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    Anybody know what "torque sleep" means?
     
  5. stevezzzz

    stevezzzz R;SigS;P85D;SigX

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    I have to disagree with Sandpiper on this: I've got a P85D with over 12,000 miles on it. Unless there's a compelling reason to do otherwise, I always have both Range mode and Insane mode enabled at the same time. My driving style tends to be somewhat conservative and I'm a fairly effective hypermiler, but my inner Andretti comes out from time to time and it's very satisfying to have all that power available at the drop of a hat.

    My lifetime Wh/mi consumption is....wait for it....309 Wh/mi. Does that answer your question? :wink:

    So, my educated guess is that Insane mode has no effect on your consumption unless you call for Insane levels of power output, and the most aggressive use of torque sleep appears to be tied to having Range mode enabled. Which is as it should be: the choice is yours.

    Now, if only Tesla would break out the choice to use full-powered climate control even when Range mode is enabled, I'd really have the best of both worlds: an Insane-ly cool and comfortable economobile...
     
  6. sorka

    sorka Active Member

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    Turning on insane does not disable torque sleep.
     
  7. Todd Burch

    Todd Burch Electron Pilot

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    Also, while flooring it does use more energy than driving conservatively, flooring it to go from 0-60 MPH only uses a little bit more energy than gradually accelerating from 0-60. At least it doesn't burn nearly as much extra energy as flooring it in an ICE would.

    Motors operate more efficiently under high torque load, although other losses (friction, resistance) counteract this benefit.

    In other words, I don't feel like I'm wasting nearly as much energy flooring it as I do in a gas car, and the numbers seem to back that up.
     
  8. NSX1992

    NSX1992 Member

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    With Insane on will I get the same maximum acceleration with Range mode on rather than off?
     
  9. stevezzzz

    stevezzzz R;SigS;P85D;SigX

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    I don't have any proof, but my sense is, Yes: Range mode has no effect on max acceleration.
     
  10. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    There's a lot of discussion about this in the forums from several months ago. Basically, Tesla is shutting the rear motor down on dual motor cars while driving at moderate speeds and low power demands because this reduces the energy consumption. If you floor it, both motor will be on again in a fraction of a second.

    The forum believes range mode makes the car more aggressive about engaging torque sleep, as well as reducing maximum fan speeds, decreasing HVAC power and reducing TMS activity (at least battery heating in the cold.)
    Walter
     
  11. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    Is "torque sleep" a phrase that someone on TMC made up and then it was adopted by many when discussing the issue of how the Model S firmware possibly manages the dual motors, or is it a phrase that Tesla has used in an official statement or document?
     
  12. andrewket

    andrewket 2014 S P85DL, 2016 X P90DL (soon 100)

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    Tesla introduced it. Don't recall who. Might have been Elon.
     
  13. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    I haven't gone back to check, but my vague recollection is that the term started with an Elon tweet promising to improve range with a firmware update.
     
  14. Andyw2100

    Andyw2100 Well-Known Member

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    I don't know whether or not Musk introduced the term before this, but it was used by JB Straubel in the following blog post:

    Driving Range for the Model S Family | Tesla Motors

    An excerpt:

    --
    Despite this aerodynamic challenge, highway cruising is where the unique benefit of the dual motor cars, to torque sleep one of the drive units when not in use, is most apparent. Much like a modern computer that can actually sleep in between keystrokes, the dual motor Model S will quickly torque sleep a drive unit when torque is not needed and instantly wake it up as the accelerator is pressed to command more torque. It continues spinning while asleep and the digital torque wake up is so fast that the driver can’t perceive it. It is far superior to the slow and awkward engine startup on stop-start hybrid vehicles.

    The software update to implement torque sleep will be downloaded to the dual motor fleet by the end of January 2015 and will substantially improve the range of dual motor vehicles by roughly 10%. All tables and graphs in this paper are shown including the benefits of torque sleep.
    --
     
  15. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    Hmmm... perhaps my memory is failing. I wan 95% sure that I had read in some official document that insane mode killed some aspects of the "range mode" function. But I can't find it now. So perhaps I have to retract.
     
  16. bp1000

    bp1000 Member

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    I just got my p85d and I was curious to try out range mode.

    I vaguely recall reading that insane mode killed torque sleep and that torque sleep was tied to range mode only.

    I didn't buy a p85d to not use insane mode but I did try turning on range mode. Didn't notice any difference.

    So just curious, what's the deal with range mode and insane mode used together? Any clarification on this? I'm leaving range mode off for now as I understand it stops battery temp management which I'd rather have. But does it torque sleep fully with range mode off?
     
  17. Andyw2100

    Andyw2100 Well-Known Member

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    Range mode does not affect insane mode. With range mode off you do not get the full benefits of torque sleep, as per Jerome Guillen.
     

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