Question for any electricians out there...

[CoolColo]

So hear my (self inflicted) tale of woe...
A few years ago I installed a Gen 1 wall charger at a vacation property. Yes, I did it myself and without a permit...shame on me. It's all done properly and to code, or so I thought. This year we installed solar on the same property, and riiight as the inspector passed the final inspection, he says, "great, you've passed, but I'm not releasing the final to the utility company until you get that EV charger permitted and inspected." Yes, he has us by the short hairs and he's holding a $28k solar install hostage. But OK - my fault.

Now here's my question: The inspector says that since the EVSE can be set to 100 amps, it must be wired for 100 amps (2 gauge wire!), despite the fact that we have it set to 50 amps and are using a 50 amp breaker and 4 gauge wire (which is overkill for 50 amps). He says since the setting can change, you must wire for max possible amperage the EVSE can handle. I think he's full of it because otherwise every Gen 1 or Gen 2 charger wired to run on a NEMA 14-50 would be illegal. I know ultimately what he says goes here, but what does code say?
Thx

 

[Favguy]

So hear my (self inflicted) tale of woe...
A few years ago I installed a Gen 1 wall charger at a vacation property. Yes, I did it myself and without a permit...shame on me. It's all done properly and to code, or so I thought. This year we installed solar on the same property, and riiight as the inspector passed the final inspection, he says, "great, you've passed, but I'm not releasing the final to the utility company until you get that EV charger permitted and inspected." Yes, he has us by the short hairs and he's holding a $28k solar install hostage. But OK - my fault.

Now here's my question: The inspector says that since the EVSE can be set to 100 amps, it must be wired for 100 amps (2 gauge wire!), despite the fact that we have it set to 50 amps and are using a 50 amp breaker and 4 gauge wire (which is overkill for 50 amps). He says since the setting can change, you must wire for max possible amperage the EVSE can handle. I think he's full of it because otherwise every Gen 1 or Gen 2 charger wired to run on a NEMA 14-50 would be illegal. I know ultimately what he says goes here, but what does code say?

It sounds like his interpretation of the rules might be suspect, as your breaker protects the cable and the settings can't be accidentally changed with a simple external switch, requiring disassembly to do so. I can't advise further as I'm in the UK and don't know your regs. It would be OK here (assuming all other protection requirement had been met) I run a GEN2 at 25A on a 25A breaker as that's the maximum my supply cable can be rated to in our installation situation and it was signed off.

I've a concern regarding your breaker though. My understanding is that US breakers are only rated at 80% for continuous use, so if you are running at 50A, a US 50A breaker is getting overloaded, so you need to run at 40A, or increase the breaker size. Do you have 60A? and then check the cable limits to ensure this is supported.

 

[CoolColo]

I've a concern regarding your breaker though. My understanding is that US breakers are only rated at 80% for continuous use, so if you are running at 50A, a US 50A breaker is getting overloaded, so you need to run at 40A, or increase the breaker size. Do you have 60A? and then check the cable limits to ensure this is supported.

Thanks for the reply - you are correct about the breakers in the US. The charger takes that into account. The setting in the charger is for the amperage of the breaker, so in the 50A setting, the charger will supply 42A.

 

[mswlogo]

Thanks for the reply - you are correct about the breakers in the US. The charger takes that into account. The setting in the charger is for the amperage of the breaker, so in the 50A setting, the charger will supply 42A.

It’s the car that regulates the load. Not the wall connector. The wall connector just sends a message to the car what it’s set at. And that’s all.

It would also be 40A load on 50A circuit. Not 42A.

 

[Rocky_H]

@CoolColo That inspector is definitely wrong. But I had this problem with teachers in school, where even if you can show and prove that they are wrong, they are the ones holding the authority, and only a few will have the humility to admit it when they are proven wrong. Otherwise, the Napoleon complex kicks in, and they get mad and try to abuse you and make you miserable. I hope you don't have to deal with that.

Fortunately you are in Colorado. When I said the inspector was wrong, it used to be not that absolute, because they only updated the language in section 625.42 in explicit detail in the 2020 revision of NEC. Colorado has adopted the 2020 version, so you should be Golden. (Coors pun intended)

Map showing Colorado is on NEC 2020

https://www.esfi.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Full-sized-adoption-Map-October-2021.pdf

And this page explains and shows the language of 625.42, showing the extra language that was added into the 2020 version versus the 2017 version to cover this exact issue:

625.42 Rating.

Some manufacturers have EV chargers that can be adjusted to a lower setting to accommodate limited remaining load capabilities of an electric service.

www.electricallicenserenewal.com

Here is the key wording that explains why he is wrong:
"Sizing the service and feeder to match the adjusting means shall be permitted."

This directly states that it is permitted to have the wiring and breaker rating of the circuit sized to match what the device is set to use for its amp rating. You don't have to have the wire and breaker sized to the maximum possible configuration of the device.

This was harder to prove in states that were still on 2014 or 2017 versions of NEC, because it was more like you had to squint and accept that it was how it should work, without having the exact language to say so.

So I think you should be able to just print out the page of that second link I gave you and show it to him, and it explains this fully. And be nice, to maybe acknowledge that it wasn't very clear through previous versions, and this is new in the 2020 update to specifically allow it, so maybe he wasn't familiar with this yet. A lot of inspectors and electricians are still catching up on some of the newer EV-specific code updates.

 

[davewill]

So I think you should be able to just print out the page of that second link I gave you and show it to him, and it explains this fully. And be nice, to maybe acknowledge that it wasn't very clear through previous versions, and this is new in the 2020 update to specifically allow it, so maybe he wasn't familiar with this yet. A lot of inspectors and electricians are still catching up on some of the newer EV-specific code updates.

You might consider paying the electrician to represent you with the inspector (assuming he agrees with you) if you feel that the inspector doesn't want to listen to you. If all that doesn't work, then find out what the appeal process is in your jurisdiction and try there.

 

[Lasttoy]

Whiskey,tango,foxtrot. He's inspecting roof system. Pulls record on house? To see if u got permit? He's on a stop order mission of his own.
No matter what u do he will not approve it.
I would go to his supervisor. Did you admit u did it??
In Florida if u do it we don't need permit. Home owner insurance might balk if it burned house down, with no permit.
I hate county inspections.

 

[davewill]

I had another idea after thinking about this problem. One other thing you can do short of rewiring for 100a is to trade up to a Gen3 Wall Connector. They max out at 48a, and the existing 4ga wire would be no issue, even for this inspector. There is probably a market for a lightly used Gen1 for someone who actually wants one that can go higher than 48a, so it shouldn't be too big a financial hit.