Quote - too good to be true?

[Vham]

I had my site survey completed earlier this week, and was presented today with a proposal for an 8.24kW system, with a gross price of $18K, minus upfront incentives/rebates of $9K (I am in IL), minus the fed tax credit of $5K (which I will take), thus yielding a net system cost of $4K (all figures are rounded). Will offset 62% of energy usage. Is this a no-brainer at this price?

I am in IL too and waiting for site survey. I understand installer buying your SREC’s for next 15 years, but still 50% of cost seems too high. What prices did it show on Website, before the house visit?

 

[dotbombjoe]

The 30% federal tax credit is based on the total cost of what you PAY. Simple example, I paid $50,000 for my 16.1 kw system, so my 30% tax credit reduced my federal taxes owed by $15,000.

I'd want to double check with an accountant on that interpretation. Certain rebates you are entitled to may need to be factored into the computation. In CA, we have a state rebate program for batteries/energy storage. Everything I've read and been told states that we have to exclude the rebate amount from the value we claim re: the 30% federal tax credit. Again, not saying this applies in this circumstance, but I'm pretty confident if you were audited and claimed the full amount (ie, without excluding rebates), they would come after that money and win, plus penalties.

It seems dubious to get a tax credit on payments that were basically refunded to you (ie, rebates). If that weren't the case, my batteries would have actually netted me $600 because I received a $9k refund from the state and then could have generated another $3.6k deduction (they cost $12-13k)...that is definitely not how its supposed to work.

 

[2012MS85]

I'd want to double check with an accountant on that interpretation. Certain rebates you are entitled to may need to be factored into the computation. In CA, we have a state rebate program for batteries/energy storage. Everything I've read and been told states that we have to exclude the rebate amount from the value we claim re: the 30% federal tax credit. Again, not saying this applies in this circumstance, but I'm pretty confident if you were audited and claimed the full amount (ie, without excluding rebates), they would come after that money and win, plus penalties.

It seems dubious to get a tax credit on payments that were basically refunded to you (ie, rebates). If that weren't the case, my batteries would have actually netted me $600 because I received a $9k refund from the state and then could have generated another $3.6k deduction (they cost $12-13k)...that is definitely not how its supposed to work.

My apologies, as I totally agree with your post. To be accurate for other’s potential situation, I should have stated that in my case - in Iowa with no rebates - the tax credits were based on the amount I paid. I qualified for both the federal 30% tax credit, plus Iowa’s state tax credit (lower of 50% of federal credit or $5k limit). So my credits were $15k (off US tax bill) plus $5k (off IA tax bill); thus my net cost of solar was $30k. I was trying to say the same thing (one can’t benefit from amounts one got in rebates), but my words and example was poor in accomplishing that

 

[ssq]

Check if you are getting refurbished panels, heard something like that when the pricing is too low (not able to confirm myself, so plz take it with a grain of salt). Also check if this is post rebate pricing.

 

[ordel]

Well, I can now answer the question that I asked in the thread title. It was indeed too good to be true. After revising the design a couple times, I told them that I would just take the original offer. When it went to their "contracts" department for review, the response (at least according to my Las Vegas-based rep, who replaced my now-terminated initial local rep) was that "the pricing was wrong." They have sent a new contract with a price about $3500 higher, which works out to a total of $2.64/kw. Given the substantial delay in responding to my requests, the elimination of the local sales staff and the relatively low price, my sense is that Tesla Solar is on shaky ground. I believe that their 20 year warranty should be viewed in that context. Although, the truth is that I don't know that any of today's solar players are on financial footing that is any more solid, so maybe it is not a differentiating factor.

 

[Benihect]

Good luck getting anything installed in IL from Tesla Energy. They got signed contracts from me in July of 2018. Haven’t managed to make any progress now they want to run credit again. end of month if no result will probably look for local installer. They are blaming iL politics.

 

[2012MS85]

Well, I can now answer the question that I asked in the thread title. It was indeed too good to be true. After revising the design a couple times, I told them that I would just take the original offer. When it went to their "contracts" department for review, the response (at least according to my Las Vegas-based rep, who replaced my now-terminated initial local rep) was that "the pricing was wrong." They have sent a new contract with a price about $3500 higher, which works out to a total of $2.64/kw. Given the substantial delay in responding to my requests, the elimination of the local sales staff and the relatively low price, my sense is that Tesla Solar is on shaky ground. I believe that their 20 year warranty should be viewed in that context. Although, the truth is that I don't know that any of today's solar players are on financial footing that is any more solid, so maybe it is not a differentiating factor.

Sorry to hear about Tesla admitting to their bad quote. Seems so sketchy when they really need to be selling a massive quantity of solar panels to keep their Gigafactory2 running at high output (to bring down the incremental price of each solar panel, as promised by Solar City...now Tesla...when the State of NY gave them $750 million to build this new facility just a few years ago).

As a real time footnote, I drove my new 3 from Iowa to the East Coast this week for a work trip, and swung by Gigafactory2 in Buffalo. Not many cars in the parking lot (so that means not enough employees inside making US solar panels), which was quite disappointing.

 

[TheTalkingMule]

Buying in IL is probably similar to buying in PA. Two very corrupt state legislatures where priorities fluctuate and trying to work a series of very complex financial and tax maneuvers is challenging for Tesla. I suspect they're being "honest" with you in that the problem is local politics combined with utilities no doubt used to making simple phone calls to legislators they own. You sign a contract with Tesla, then the utility(with legislators/regulators behind them) stall your interconnect long enough for Tesla's pricing to expire. It's a filthy battle. Exelon is based in IL so I'm sure they run the show.

That being said.....all the very recent news out of IL is absurdly positive for residential solar. You seem to have turned the corner into reliable state support, so expect the market to improve quite rapidly as it has here in PA over the last 18 months.

In that kind of environment it's going to take Tesla a good long while to get their act together. Their products are much more complex, so you might be better served reaching out to local installers for your solar. You can always circle back to Tesla in 2-4 years for any Powerwall or other service you might need. Pay no more than $3/W minus any state or local subsidy/rebate.

I work with a guy who's doing research on the Chicago area options for solar installs. I'll reach out if he gets this list and reviews together.

 

[Benihect]

I just wish they conducted business in a much more respectable manner.

Setting proper expectations at the beginning would have been key to my understanding and patience. Initially they said up and running by October 2018.

I got some excuse early on that the electrical license their electricians had was equivalent to that needed for elevator technians. Not sure I believed this. A Tesla Nevada employee told me this over the phone.

Now they want to run credit again and pull a new contract and pricing. I said absolutely not until they can prove they have the necessary permits pulled for my address and project.

Buying in IL is probably similar to buying in PA. Two very corrupt state legislatures where priorities fluctuate and trying to work a series of very complex financial and tax maneuvers is challenging for Tesla. I suspect they're being "honest" with you in that the problem is local politics combined with utilities no doubt used to making simple phone calls to legislators they own. You sign a contract with Tesla, then the utility(with legislators/regulators behind them) stall your interconnect long enough for Tesla's pricing to expire. It's a filthy battle. Exelon is based in IL so I'm sure they run the show.

That being said.....all the very recent news out of IL is absurdly positive for residential solar. You seem to have turned the corner into reliable state support, so expect the market to improve quite rapidly as it has here in PA over the last 18 months.

In that kind of environment it's going to take Tesla a good long while to get their act together. Their products are much more complex, so you might be better served reaching out to local installers for your solar. You can always circle back to Tesla in 2-4 years for any Powerwall or other service you might need. Pay no more than $3/W minus any state or local subsidy/rebate.

I work with a guy who's doing research on the Chicago area options for solar installs. I'll reach out if he gets this list and reviews together.

 

[TheTalkingMule]

Everything needs to be more transparent up front, that's the problem with having a sales org run the show. The very front end needs non-commissioned employees.