Racism lawsuit will go ahead

[Sunvalleylaw]

Marked to read more closely later when I don’t need to focus on work. Some good thoughts I saw already. I am fighting cringey feelings on this purchase, but recognize no company is all that great, and that we are stuck with a socio-economic system that is very flawed. Will read more to consider how I want to move forward. This order was the result of being down at a concert at Dana point to raise money to save the coasts, and then there was an oil spill the next day damaging the very beaches we were enjoying. And Tesla’s network of chargers made me feel ok in the middle of Idaho to pull the trigger now rather than wait for others to catch up. So, will read more and consider how I feel now. But later. Have to work now.

 

[Tam]

...recognize no company is all that great...

True, but once pointed out by regulators, most would try to comply with the law rather than fight against the law.

Tesla is in a whole new dimension: It seems to blame the non-compliance due to "Exactly" conspiracy theory including lack of advertisement.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1492184293115940864

To apply that conspiracy theory, it would not be in legal trouble if it advertise that "Come on in contracted workers, we won't keep records of your racial and sexual harassment".

That's one of the charges spelled out by the lawsuit "Deflect and evade responsibility" in racial and sexual harassment reporting and keeping records which is a violation of the law (page 5, under subsection 11).

So instead of trying to comply with the law by keeping records of all incidences happening on its ground, it's trying to get out of the trouble by conspiracy theory of not paying for ads!

 

[Nolakai]

True, but once pointed out by regulators, most would try to comply with the law rather than fight against the law.

Tesla is in a whole new dimension: It seems to blame the non-compliance due to "Exactly" conspiracy theory including lack of advertisement.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1492184293115940864

To apply that conspiracy theory, it would not be in legal trouble if it advertise that "Come on in contracted workers, we won't keep records of your racial and sexual harassment".

That's one of the charges spelled out by the lawsuit "Deflect and evade responsibility" in racial and sexual harassment reporting and keeping records which is a violation of the law (page 5, under subsection 11).

So instead of trying to comply with the law by keeping records of all incidences happening on its ground, it's trying to get out of the trouble by conspiracy theory of not paying for ads!

When we first started test-driving EVs, we were dead set against buying a Tesla because of Musk and his offensive antics. But after we test drove the only cars available that weren't Tesla, we decided to test drive the Y because it seemed foolish not to, and like so many other people, we bought the Tesla because it was superior (and the supercharging network mattered too). I reminded myself that the company was more than its CEO (they're publicly traded!) and that every car company has greedy, unethical leadership. But the incidents detailed in this lawsuit are so grotesque, and the company's hiring of contract workers rather than addressing the racism in their factory just adds to the moral bankruptcy, that I'm not sure I'd get one now. Though still, when I think of what EV I'd get instead, I run into the same questions and dilemmas, since car manufacturers aren't ethical. Some might speak a good game sometimes ("thank you for contributing to a sustainable future"), but in the end, they're all about profit over people. Regardless of where I jump on the train, I always end up at the same place: what can I do right now to help alleviate suffering in my community? What can I do to help build a more just and equitable society? I don't think selling my Tesla would help others or alleviate any suffering. It would just make me feel a little bit less embarrassed.

I wonder if, as owners and potential owners, there is some action we can take to demand that Tesla treat their employees with respect and dignity? Or rally major shareholders into taking action, like this group of investors did to Microsoft recently?

Microsoft shareholders vote to force company to better report sexual harassment data

Microsoft Corp. shareholders voted to force the company to more transparently address sexual harassment claims via independent investigations and public reporting.

abcnews.go.com

 

[Barklikeadog]

When we first started test-driving EVs, we were dead set against buying a Tesla because of Musk and his offensive antics. But after we test drove the only cars available that weren't Tesla, we decided to test drive the Y because it seemed foolish not to, and like so many other people, we bought the Tesla because it was superior (and the supercharging network mattered too). I reminded myself that the company was more than its CEO (they're publicly traded!) and that every car company has greedy, unethical leadership. But the incidents detailed in this lawsuit are so grotesque, and the company's hiring of contract workers rather than addressing the racism in their factory just adds to the moral bankruptcy, that I'm not sure I'd get one now. Though still, when I think of what EV I'd get instead, I run into the same questions and dilemmas, since car manufacturers aren't ethical. Some might speak a good game sometimes ("thank you for contributing to a sustainable future"), but in the end, they're all about profit over people. Regardless of where I jump on the train, I always end up at the same place: what can I do right now to help alleviate suffering in my community? What can I do to help build a more just and equitable society? I don't think selling my Tesla would help others or alleviate any suffering. It would just make me feel a little bit less embarrassed.

I wonder if, as owners and potential owners, there is some action we can take to demand that Tesla treat their employees with respect and dignity? Or rally major shareholders into taking action, like this group of investors did to Microsoft recently?

Microsoft shareholders vote to force company to better report sexual harassment data

Microsoft Corp. shareholders voted to force the company to more transparently address sexual harassment claims via independent investigations and public reporting.

abcnews.go.com

Good link, I was thinking about Microsoft, or the Washington Football team... or of course Apple, who (along with nike and coca cola) actively lobby AGAINST anti-forced labor
bills in Congress. People roll their eyes and think Congress (who, like most, I am no fan of) wastes time and money by calling these business leaders before their committee for
questioning. Well, there is a legislative purpose. Major corporations are covering up serious workplace issues. People get paid off, sign NDAs, or whatever, but they are doing
everything they can to NOT properly report what is going on. Who cares if some senator gets to be in the spotlight if they're actually going to address something horrific like this.
Course they get some money in their PAC and it's all for nothing. Best way to speak is with our wallets.

China Labor Watch : Shining Light on Labor Practices Kept in The Dark

China Labor Watch is an independent not-for-profit organization that advocates for workers’ rights, and supports the Chinese labor movement.

chinalaborwatch.org

I don't see major shareholders or board members doing anything. Musk's benefits currently outweigh his liabilities. And besides, sometimes it's good to have a bad guy in charge.
People despise Emmert(ncaa) or Goodell or Musk, but they take all the heat and attention off the activities of college commissioners, nfl owners, board members, etc etc so they
are worth keeping around.

 

[Nolakai]

Good link, I was thinking about Microsoft, or the Washington Football team... or of course Apple, who (along with nike and coca cola) actively lobby AGAINST anti-forced labor
bills in Congress. People roll their eyes and think Congress (who, like most, I am no fan of) wastes time and money by calling these business leaders before their committee for
questioning. Well, there is a legislative purpose. Major corporations are covering up serious workplace issues. People get paid off, sign NDAs, or whatever, but they are doing
everything they can to NOT properly report what is going on. Who cares if some senator gets to be in the spotlight if they're actually going to address something horrific like this.
Course they get some money in their PAC and it's all for nothing. Best way to speak is with our wallets.

China Labor Watch : Shining Light on Labor Practices Kept in The Dark

China Labor Watch is an independent not-for-profit organization that advocates for workers’ rights, and supports the Chinese labor movement.

chinalaborwatch.org

I don't see major shareholders or board members doing anything. Musk's benefits currently outweigh his liabilities. And besides, sometimes it's good to have a bad guy in charge.
People despise Emmert(ncaa) or Goodell or Musk, but they take all the heat and attention off the activities of college commissioners, nfl owners, board members, etc etc so they
are worth keeping around.

Certainly musk is a “no publicity is bad publicity” asset to the company in the eyes of many. He gets Tesla in the news all the time, and they’re counting on the cars being so superior that people who are offended by him will buy Tesla anyway (like we did). This lawsuit is something else though. It’s about way more than Musk. It’s clearly a corporate culture based on abuse.

I’m reminded of Upton Sinclair’s reaction after The Jungle was released. He said something like “I aimed for the heart but hit them in the stomach,” when the reading public demanded food safety changes, not labor changes, after reading his book. Most readers didn’t care about the plight of the workers. They only cared about the uncleanliness of the factories where their sausages were made!

 

[mtndrew1]

Tesla has become less palatable to me in the recent past for a variety of reasons but if these allegations are true it’s yet another demerit.

Car factories everywhere have a long history of this kind of crap but that doesn’t provide any excuse. Ignorance of the problem under the guise of advancing clean energy is just as bad as actively participating, as far as I’m concerned.

Didn’t their head of HR (or similar role) just depart?

 

[Nolakai]

Tesla has become less palatable to me in the recent past for a variety of reasons but if these allegations are true it’s yet another demerit.

Car factories everywhere have a long history of this kind of crap but that doesn’t provide any excuse. Ignorance of the problem under the guise of advancing clean energy is just as bad as actively participating, as far as I’m concerned.

Didn’t their head of HR (or similar role) just depart?

Yes, Valerie Workman just left. And sadly, it seems that Tesla wasn’t just ignorant of the problem, but basically encouraged and shielded the abusers.

 

[mtndrew1]

Yes, Valerie Workman just left. And sadly, it seems that Tesla wasn’t just ignorant of the problem, but basically encouraged and shielded the abusers.

I’ve been around Tesla long enough to wait for the investigation to play out. I’ll wait for the results from the suit before passing judgement.

 

[Sunvalleylaw]

When we first started test-driving EVs, we were dead set against buying a Tesla because of Musk and his offensive antics. But after we test drove the only cars available that weren't Tesla, we decided to test drive the Y because it seemed foolish not to, and like so many other people, we bought the Tesla because it was superior (and the supercharging network mattered too). I reminded myself that the company was more than its CEO (they're publicly traded!) and that every car company has greedy, unethical leadership. But the incidents detailed in this lawsuit are so grotesque, and the company's hiring of contract workers rather than addressing the racism in their factory just adds to the moral bankruptcy, that I'm not sure I'd get one now. Though still, when I think of what EV I'd get instead, I run into the same questions and dilemmas, since car manufacturers aren't ethical. Some might speak a good game sometimes ("thank you for contributing to a sustainable future"), but in the end, they're all about profit over people. Regardless of where I jump on the train, I always end up at the same place: what can I do right now to help alleviate suffering in my community? What can I do to help build a more just and equitable society? I don't think selling my Tesla would help others or alleviate any suffering. It would just make me feel a little bit less embarrassed.

I wonder if, as owners and potential owners, there is some action we can take to demand that Tesla treat their employees with respect and dignity? Or rally major shareholders into taking action, like this group of investors did to Microsoft recently?

Microsoft shareholders vote to force company to better report sexual harassment data

Microsoft Corp. shareholders voted to force the company to more transparently address sexual harassment claims via independent investigations and public reporting.

abcnews.go.com

Read through this the rest of the way. Thinking about it, and thinking that continuing with my plans, as it is the way I can get off oil for transportation as well as possible, AND demanding change, may be the way to go. Might just buy a couple shares of stock too, so I can also demand change as a stock holder. Not has a huge investment, as I don’t do individual stocks. But just a couple shares so i can write and demand with that status. And perhaps there COULD be some sort of organized effort from vehicle and/or stock owners to demand change. And if they DID finally start to make changes, demand faster reaction to such situations.

 

[RSpanner]

A real sad stae of affairs. And yes, I do blame Musk..he is responsible for letting the racial tensions/segregation problems to get to the point that warranted a legal case. I wish Musk was put someplace out of sight to work his genius on whatever project he wants, but he has soured many people and this is just the latest. Too bad, love the cars, love my Model 3, and Tesla needs to own this problem and work to resolve this issues in a real Just way and move on to perfect its cars and batteries, etc. Will his ego get in the way..

 

[Tam]

I’ve been around Tesla long enough to wait for the investigation to play out. I’ll wait for the results from the suit before passing judgement.

A verdict from a similar case (individual instead of governmental) came in last October in case you are not aware of:

Tesla must pay $137 million to a Black employee who sued for racial discrimination

Owen Diaz, an elevator operator from 2015 to 2016, said in his lawsuit that he and others were called the N-word by Tesla employees and that he was told to "go back to Africa."

www.npr.org

In case you thought the verdict changed Tesla, read again: The Human Resource vice president issued the Tesla blog: the fact that although the N-word was not appropriate but it was used in a "friendly" manner.

Regarding Today’s Jury Verdict | Tesla

www.tesla.com

Thanks to the upper management, who sincerely defend funny and friendly racial jokes, cost Tesla $137 million

 

[patrick42h]

Transport Evolved just released their video about this situation.

 

[Barklikeadog]

Transport Evolved just released their video about this situation.

Fair and nicely done

 

[30seconds]

Leadership is clear when it exists and also clear when it doesn't

 

[Sunvalleylaw]

I have done some more reading and considering, and figure I will stick with this decision to get the car, and also demand change at the complany. It appears to me that none of the major manufacturers and/or their owners or heads are all that great. Henry Ford was an ass, and the Mach E is probably currently the closest competitor, though I still liked the Y better. Plus though they talk nicer, not sure Ford’s board is all THAT friendly to labor even now, leaving aside history. Toyota was opposing climate efforts. VW was cheating on mileage. Seems like the best thing for me to do is to go with the best, cleanest vehicle for my needs, and separately work for the change I want to see in the world.

And Musk is still an ass and if someone talks to me about it if they see my car or whatever, I will gladly agree with them on that, and come up with a short sentence to say regarding the above, unless a longer conversation would be productive.