Doreheel
Member
What, if anything, has been announced for use of the Radar in cars manufactured before April 27? Will Tesla continue to leverage the data these radars provide or will they just disable the radars through a software release?
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Radar deleted on all new Model Y and Model 3. Is FSD worth it?
- Thread starter walkrunflyy
- Start date
I don’t think anything has been said about us yet. But I’m sure someone will tell you, without citing a source, just like lots of the other “info” here.
Well, if it is so good to NOT have radar, I would think according to Elon's vision, they would deprecate it ASAP. Or do it anyway, even if having radar is better, just to keep the party line intact so to speak.
From a development and testing perspective, they would want minimal variants to deal with anyway. Or maybe it will come back as an extra cost option in the future...
From a development and testing perspective, they would want minimal variants to deal with anyway. Or maybe it will come back as an extra cost option in the future...
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
Note IIHS is only removing it because they have not tested the new version. They say they will update the rating after they do so. It's not the same as for example them testing it already and saying the version without radar is less safe. NHTSA will also being testing next week according to Elon. People will need to have some patience while this is being sorted out.
Just read that too. We'll see how it pans out. Maybe under ideal conditions, it is the same, or maybe better. I still want to see how it performs in less than optimal conditions, rain, snow, fog, dust, etc.
I'd like to see what the testing regime is for this. What scenarios are tested. Also, we've all seen that Elon has his own sense of time. I'll believe it when I see it. I have always been a fan of redundant systems, with no single point of failure. At least with the vision/radar combo, you had two so hopefully, if you had one fail, the other could step in.
I hope it all gets sorted out. Nowhere when this was reported, nor did I see any Tesla comments, that it would be tested soon. I think once the manure hit the rotating air mover that Tesla realized they needed to limit the fall out. If this was all planned all along, who was the dipshit that didn't factor in the testing and completing it before announcing it. Again, it all seems a reaction to a logistics problem or cost reduction. Now that Humpty Dumpty is broken they are scrambling to put all the pieces back together again.
I'd like to see what the testing regime is for this. What scenarios are tested. Also, we've all seen that Elon has his own sense of time. I'll believe it when I see it. I have always been a fan of redundant systems, with no single point of failure. At least with the vision/radar combo, you had two so hopefully, if you had one fail, the other could step in.
I hope it all gets sorted out. Nowhere when this was reported, nor did I see any Tesla comments, that it would be tested soon. I think once the manure hit the rotating air mover that Tesla realized they needed to limit the fall out. If this was all planned all along, who was the dipshit that didn't factor in the testing and completing it before announcing it. Again, it all seems a reaction to a logistics problem or cost reduction. Now that Humpty Dumpty is broken they are scrambling to put all the pieces back together again.
CowherPower
Member
I ordered a MY in April and have been anxiously awaiting my delivery date, but this news has given me significant pause, and now I'm considering cancelling my order. Unless they have years of data to back their claim, you'll never get me to believe that a vision-based system will outperform a system that incorporates radar (especially in bad weather and blinding sun). It seems that Tesla also believes this new system isn't trustworthy since they are capping Autosteer at 75mph, disabling emergency lane departure, and increasing the following distance. I don't want to be their safety testing guinea pig!
My nephew has a PhD in computer vision and he's also seriously concerned about this decision. The technology just isn't there yet, so this clearly seems like a cost-cutting move by Tesla (at the expense of driver and pedestrian safety).
I placed my order on March 24th and I see that Tesla is saying that any cars manufactured after March 27th will not have radar. Since I placed my order before this date, do you think my vehicle will have radar? And if so, will that continue to work, or will they eventually disable the radar with a software "downgrade"?
My nephew has a PhD in computer vision and he's also seriously concerned about this decision. The technology just isn't there yet, so this clearly seems like a cost-cutting move by Tesla (at the expense of driver and pedestrian safety).
I placed my order on March 24th and I see that Tesla is saying that any cars manufactured after March 27th will not have radar. Since I placed my order before this date, do you think my vehicle will have radar? And if so, will that continue to work, or will they eventually disable the radar with a software "downgrade"?
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
That's incorrect. Any car manufactured after April 27th will not have radar. So unless you buy a car from inventory made before then, it's guaranteed your car will not have radar.
If you don't have a delivery date yet so far, by the time you do (or you can choose to postpone) I imagine at least the NHTSA rating will be sorted out (don't know about IIHS as they didn't say explicitly how soon they will do a retest and how long that takes before they announce results). Although Tesla may not necessarily have brought the Autosteer limitations to "parity" yet.
steve841
Active Member
Just makes me happy I never bothered to spring for FSD on any of my Teslas .... Technology keeps changing and in the end your current FSD is obsolete in no time.
I think of the options, and depending price, I would definitely be most interested in a subscription so I'd have a try before buy at a minimum. I still don't think it is worth the money as is. Calling it FSD is practically a scam. I love the concept, and it if truly was full self driving, I'd pay the 10k.
It seems like the timing of radar removal was accelerated uncomfortably to avoid shutting down production for lack of parts. That said, it was also clear that they were going to do it eventually. I expect the end result to be a better system than with radar, even if it takes a few weeks or months.
Updated info. Looks like some clearer communications from Tesla - and better reporting by Reuters - might have not have resulted in much of the reactions seen in this thread. Tesla vehicles without radar still have Autopilot safety features despite what the media is saying - Electrek
I read this article, and it does give a clear accounting of how the story may have unfolded. But I don’t see any changes factually. It still appears the NHTSA removed its certification of some safety features after Tesla briefed them on the change to non radar, and they plan to test the new system performance before recertification. This seems perfectly normal and expected to me, and I can understand CR and others dropping their highest safety ratings based on this as well since, well, the new system isn’t certified yet. So why didn’t Tesla get it tested sooner? Musk claimed they will be testing next week. Why not wait until the new radarless system is certified before delivering it?
Last edited:
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
Hard to tell because this situation rarely happens (where there is a major hardware change within the same model that affects these safety features, but not a change that requires new full crash test), so not a lot of examples to go by on how this is usually done or if it's even possible to have a "seamless" procedure. CR mentioned that this isn't common in the industry, although Tesla did the same in the past. Looking through NHTSA ratings, they are likely talking about the AP2 transition, where some checkmarks were also lost (although the media didn't catch on at the time in the same way).
For 2016 there was also a "later release" where FCW/LDW check mark was removed (and never added back, even though Tesla added it back with software update). Back then NHTSA did not rate AEB (CIB/DBS) yet (MY2018 was first year) so that was not present in the first place.
Vehicle Detail Search | NHTSA
Vehicle Detail Search | NHTSA
No radar units available. It was either ship fewer cars to customers, hurting both the company and the customers who want the cars, or push forward at Tesla speed and let the certification and 100% feature parity come later.
Seems based on some realy reports outside the "missing" things, most of autopilot is working just fine so thats a good sign. I do think this is lack of parts resulting in an accelerated release of tesla vision. Of course right when Im getting my Y this weekend lol
I am not as concerned how it performs in good visibility. How is it when you might really need it; rain, fog, dust, etc. I would hope it would work well under ideal conditions. How about the corner cases so to speak that are high risk? Again it doesn't look like they upgraded the hardware. So they de-contented the car, even will significant price increases to the consumer over the last 2 months. Win/win for Tesla, not so good for the consumer.
Last night driving near my home, the rain was so intense that I was driving 55 mph in a 75 mph zone, and nobody other than a few pickup trucks was passing me... I don't see camera only AP being functional in that situation... but I am unsure how radar based would be much better since there were two main concerns... visibility and hydroplaning. Radar my work for the visibility of surrounding traffic, but how does Tesla AP (radar based, or camera based) handle hydroplaning risk?
Keith
You can still drive as fast as you want. Just have to do it the old fashioned way using the steering wheel and pedals over 75.I just hope they up the top speed for AP before I take delivery. 75 mph is the speed limit on the highways around here... I don't want to be hanging out in the slow lane all the time
Keith
I can do that in my Bolt
I know that you can accelerate using the go pedal while using AP... if it is set to 75 and I accelerate using the go pedal will it kick me out of AP with this new nerfed setup?
Keith
Similar threads
