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Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by brianstorms, Sep 9, 2013.
I did the exact same trip as you, only I went up to Washington. My trip didn't take as long as your's since Hawthorne wasn't cluttered with construction. Once the San Diego SC opens and all SC's are upgraded to 120kW you can bypass Hawthorne and go directly to Lebec. You could in theory do it now in good weather at reasonable speeds. And I would agree that the extended rest stops are more relaxing and pleasant.
Well you made that an entertaining read with your sarcastic/fun poke at the whole experience. Also good to know how jammed up the chargers are down there too. That will not be an easy one to solve... tho I could see monitoring/limiting frequent vehicle usage coming in the future.
Thanks for sharing.
Fwiw, I was able to drive from Fremont to north San Diego, in 9 hours in what I would call a no compromise trip. Lunch stop, nature break, dinner stop, another pee stop and home. I had no issues with my superchargers. The SJC supercharger is desperately needed though, which will allow you to bypass Hawthorne with ease.
Folks, if you plan on doing a lot of road trips, get dual chargers!
Was thinking I'd use the Hawthorne charger as an option on a trip down to LA in a couple weeks, but this note makes me think I should instead try to avoid that one. No way I can avoid Harris Ranch or Tejon Ranch for the trip, but those should be ok (I hope).
Regarding varying amounts from the superchargers -- I recall seeing some labeled "90Kw" and some labeled "30Kw". I don't think people really notice the labels, but the 90s are the ones to get if in a hurry. :smile:
The whole free supercharging concept goes really haywire with CA electric rates. Can you imagine when a $40k Tesla comes out? Not just the greater numbers, but more people who have less money so the "free" supercharging makes a difference. I suppose there was not a promise to GenIII buyers for free supercharging.
Free rarely works. It is anti-capitalistic. I'm not sure what Elon's plan is. I think it might be worth identifying people's location and allowing only 10 charges per year within 50 miles of home. Then charge a realistic fee after 10. It should only catch the abusers.
For those outside of CA, I don't anticipate a huge problem. I was talking to someone who I work with who never uses the free charger at work. His reasoning was that it is a J1772 and it so slow. Pretty stupid since he works 10 hours and would leave with a full battery but the reality is, the electricity charge is inconsequential for him (we pay either $.10 or $.05 if on a peak pricing plan). I must be a cheap bastard because I have a Leaf and always get there with less than 20% charge on purpose and I pay $.05 per kwh.....
Sounds to me like you learned a lot. And with a bit more patience, planning and infrastructure growth the issues you encountered won't really be one.
So to me, the tl;dr; version of your story:
1. Drive straight from La Jolla to Tejon Ranch and skip Hawthorne. Too many Model Ss and too few Superchargers.
2. Anticipate and plan for slow public charging stations.
3. Get dual-chargers installed. They're worth their weight in gold when you need them.
It's not free anymore than making calls on a prepaid phone is free.
Good thing that they're charging thousands of dollars for it then...
But dual chargers only help with high amp public charging or HPWC, superchargers bypass them. I haven't seen any public charging above 30amp? Maybe there are more in CA?
Canada is covered with 70A chargers... Washington State is beginning to get blanketed with high amp J1772's by Sun Country Highway. I think that these will only continue to spread. Ordering a Model S without dual chargers is crazy (unless you never plan on going on any sort of roadtrip).
As I've understood the single charger can take 11kW and twin can take 22kW. At least in EU the Type-II connector can feed 3-phase either 16A or 32A (11kW or 22kW) so if the chargers are around for 22kW as they are in most locations I think, then you do get a higher rate from it. But yes, the charger has to be able to pump out over 11kW to make use of the twin charger.
If I can have the floor ....
If you want to do your 1300 mile roadtrip in 7 hours, please do so in an ICE. your compromise (if you have an Armada, like my wife) is that you get 15 mpg at ~3.75 gal ... $325. (All numbers approximates) - also, we are negating environmental issues as well. If your focus is the time, take the ICE and you can covet the time saved. Again, your choice.
I chose to drive from McKinney to Bastrop to San Marcos to McKinney (~700 miles) in BadA** because:
(1) I paid zero in petrol, and (let's say) $5 in the electricity I needed before I made the first SC stop.
(2) Di is high on her mileage on the Armada lease
(3) BadA** is comfortable and elegant
(4) The Armada is loud.
Plus my company is reimbursing me $.51/mile as this was business - so you can see that a few SC stops saved me X, made me Y and the X+Y is certainly nothing to sneer about.
I agree that SC is not as convenient as ICE travel (in terms of time) but we also should be honest with ourselves and say "I knew when I bought this thing that I was going to have to be flexible and compromise with certain metrics - one of which is time and distance"
Again, I am simply disseminating my two cents worth.
Thank you for the floor.
Nice write up. Interesting to hear a real world example in the S for a trip.
Think Tesla does need to look into adding more charging stations in such mass markets like CA. 2 hours waiting is not acceptable--they should double the amount available for use.
Tesla's are going to continue to grow in popularity (we hope) and Superchargers should be a convenience rather than a hindrance. They should be able to take those busy locations and load balance the number of chargers. Also, I think putting them just outside of a major metro area would help in this 'overuse' by locals. Kinda hard in CA though I would imagine.
I agree, and that's why I ordered the dual chargers. Problem is now they can only be had in conjunction with the HPWC. In my case, I don't have circuit capacity for a HPWC (sure, could connect at a lower amperage) and didn't want one. Seems unfortunate that Tesla has bundled the offering.
And as I have mentioned before what happens when I want to trade my P85 for a P120+ AWD in a few years?
I already have a HPWC.
There is a lot to like about CA but, in this case, I'm glad I'm on the East Coast. We will see the congestion you face but not for a few years. The MS population density is lower here so the SC roll out will remain ahead of the usage curve for some time.
Tesla has use data from their SC locations and I can not imagine they would let one of their shining star ideas give them a black eye for long. Here is to hoping for West Coast SC upgrades soon.....
That certainly hasn't been Tesla's sales pitch when it comes to super charging. Elon has consistently states a 3-1 ratio of driving to charging is reasonable and the OP got nowhere close to that. I'm holding Tesla and Elon to their statements about the compromise that should be expected.
Some of the OP's issues were bad luck (construction) and the dearth of SCs, which will get better over time. The bit that disturbs me the most is the failure for the SC's to deliver a solid charging rate.
I'm working with a few others and hope to have 240V/70A J1772 chargers in Salida, CO and Pagosa Springs, CO this fall. We are working to fill in the "4-Corners Black Hole"
Even though the 4-Corners Region looks covered, the realities of mountain roads mean that you need more charging options to drive this region in an MS.
These 70A chargers will give you a 50 mph charge rate, but only if you have twin chargers. In my opinion, twin chargers are a necessity for road tripping even when the SC network is built out.
It is unfortunate, but if I were buying a Model S I would still buy the option.
There are several options if you don't want the HPWC...
a) try and get Tesla to buy it back (I saw some posts about this, not sure if it's possible)
b) sell it on here or ebay
c) donate it to a business for charging on the road
I've heard this as well. I'm very happy that I purchased twin chargers.