Random Thoughts on SuperCharging an S85 after a 1300-mile roadtrip

[Mayhemm]

Regarding the problem of local leeches, I wonder if Tesla could institute a roaming system (similar to that used by cellular carriers) that would disable supercharger capability of a car while it is inside its "local zone"? This way no fee would ever be required and Tesla should have the telemetry data to implement this (though the supercharging module may not be remotely controllable).

 

[ckessel]

Regarding the problem of local leeches, I wonder if Tesla could institute a roaming system (similar to that used by cellular carriers) that would disable supercharger capability of a car while it is inside its "local zone"? This way no fee would ever be required and Tesla should have the telemetry data to implement this (though the supercharging module may not be remotely controllable).

This is rife with issues. What about the guy that got a Model S due to the supercharging and is in an apartment that doesn't allow charging? He was banking on the promise of "free, forever". What about the guy whose house is being remodeled and can't charge at home for a week?

The answer is simply to build out the superchargers anytime demand shows it's needed, regardless of the demand source.

 

[hans]

Regarding the problem of local leeches, I wonder if Tesla could institute a roaming system (similar to that used by cellular carriers) that would disable supercharger capability of a car while it is inside its "local zone"? This way no fee would ever be required and Tesla should have the telemetry data to implement this (though the supercharging module may not be remotely controllable).

Here is my problem with this idea.

I drive from my home in Menlo Park to a location in the central valley and use up 55% of my battery. I then try and return home but I can't make it all the way back. I limp into the Fremont supercharger with 1 mile left on my battery for a quick extra 20 mile charge so I can make it the rest of the way home.

Am I a leech because I am using a supercharger within 20 miles of my home? Should I be denied supercharging access?

Again, not looking for a full charge 'cause it's free. Just looking for a fast charge in order to get to my destination (home).

 

[liuping]

Here is my problem with this idea.

I drive from my home in Menlo Park to a location in the central valley and use up 55% of my battery. I then try and return home but I can't make it all the way back. I limp into the Fremont supercharger with 1 mile left on my battery for a quick extra 20 mile charge so I can make it the rest of the way home.

Am I a leech because I am using a supercharger within 20 miles of my home? Should I be denied supercharging access?

Again, not looking for a full charge 'cause it's free. Just looking for a fast charge in order to get to my destination (home).

They could limit locals to one 20-30 mile charge per day. That would make it not worth the hassle for day to day charging, but helpful in situation like you mentioned.

 

[vfx]

.... I suppose there was not a promise to GenIII buyers for free supercharging.......

Actually Elon said all cars would have it. They will need to put a limited on SC per year. say 50 uses in a caldar year. and or the SC must be 50 miles from home. This would limit local abuse.

If this trip was a $350 gas trip then after seven trips it is free. Kinda like solar.

- - - Updated - - -

...

I'm with ckessel - on a road trip even 70A is too slow. I am of the mindset, if I have to sit 2 hours for a charge that otherwise wasn't a planned stop, I'd rather take an ICE or fly....

And to think it was only a short year ago when 7A0 was the fastest way to charge and we Tesla owners were the envy of all the other EVs.

- - - Updated - - -

Here is my problem with this idea.

I drive from my home in Menlo Park to a location in the central valley and use up 55% of my battery. I then try and return home but I can't make it all the way back. I limp into the Fremont supercharger with 1 mile left on my battery for a quick extra 20 mile charge so I can make it the rest of the way home.

Am I a leech because I am using a supercharger within 20 miles of my home? Should I be denied supercharging access?

Again, not looking for a full charge 'cause it's free. Just looking for a fast charge in order to get to my destination (home).

Free forever for 500,000 Model E's will simply not scale. I have been proposing a 50 50 plan. Either or 50 Supercharges a year and or no Supercharging within 50 miles of home. Yes Hans you scenario might be a pain but it's not like there will not be other charging 30A options in the area along a route. People can just choose to not buy the Model E. 50 uses a year will quell limo drivers and delivery services with E's and X's from hogging the SC'rs.

 

[deonb]

Free forever for 500,000 Model E's will simply not scale.

I wish Tesla will change the word "free" to "prepaid" just so that TMC will stop calling it free...

500'000 cars will pay for 3333 SuperCharger stations. It scales. That's a SuperCharger every 50 miles across the entire U.S.

Or are you making an argument that the prepaid fee should be more on the Model E? (e.g. $3000, which pays for 5000 stations, will allow concurrent usage of 10% of the entire fleet).

 

[rlang59]

...This would limit local abuse....

There is no such thing as "local abuse" everyone who can use Supercharging has paid to use it. Just because it doesn't fit into what you believe is the proper usage of supercharging does not make it abuse. Supercharging is not free it is paid for in advance, just like deonb has been saying, whether it is the 2k adder for the 60 or included in the cost of the 85.

 

[ckessel]

Free forever for 500,000 Model E's will simply not scale.

That sort of statement requires you provide at least rudimentary due diligence to back it up.

Filling with gas takes maybe 1/4-1/5 the time of an SC, but there are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more than 4x ICE cars on the road and somehow their refueling stations have scaled up. There's no technical reason I can see why EV infrastructure can't scale and no reason Tesla's plan to make charging free by way of solar feeding into the grid won't scale either.

 

[brianman]

I suppose there was not a promise to GenIII buyers for free supercharging

Actually Elon said all cars would have it.

What you quoted from David -- Elon did not say that. At least not to my recollection.

His comments thus far have been on hardware capability in future models, not on cost (at purchase or per use).

 

[SFOTurtle]

There is no such thing as "local abuse" everyone who can use Supercharging has paid to use it. Just because it doesn't fit into what you believe is the proper usage of supercharging does not make it abuse. Supercharging is not free it is paid for in advance, just like deonb has been saying, whether it is the 2k adder for the 60 or included in the cost of the 85.

Well, I would say that someone who drives 10-15 miles from home to get a charge, and then parks their car at the supercharger to go shopping or go to a movie for hours, that would be an abuse. I don't have a problem with being on the charger for the whole 5-10 mins it takes to charge their car, but the abuse comes from tying up the SC for hours on end while people who are passing through and need the charger to continue with their journey are shut out. This seems pretty clearly abuse to me.

 

[David_Cary]

I am guilty of using free instead of prepaid but everyone knows what I was talking about - ie not having a per use charge for using an SC. Whether you call it free as a marketing tool or prepaid to be more accurate, the problem is that not having a per use charge has people using it when they are not on a road trip. Since the point of SCs is road trips (IMO maybe), then using it for local charging is "abuse". This wouldn't matter if people weren't waiting to charge who actually need it.

I could see a time when there was an SC on my commute and I stop by for a "free" fill. Hopefully I would step out of the way when a line formed.

I suppose the GenIII will definitely have SC access but probably limited in some way. I agree that in someways SC can't scale for 500,000 numbers. The analogy with gas stations fails on 2 big issues - gas stations make money to keep up with ongoing costs and they can be used by nearly everyone (obviously not EVs). I think the costs people throw around for SCs is crazy low and doesn't account for the real estate at times. Sure - a mall might help with some space in a small scale but that may not scale to have 50 spots for GenIIIs.

 

[earlyretirement]

I'm sitting here at Hawthorne now. 2 other cars here. I got here at 8:50 AM and only 1 car was here. I started out charging at a rate of 265 MPH but down to 176 with 3 cars. I will post a YouTube video tonight once I get back.

 

[gaswalla]

Sounds like the regular tapering with superchargers, not really the fact more cars showed up.

 

[rsquared99]

I would argue that what has been prepaid is the use of the supercharging structure for its stated intent. That intent is to enable long range travel. Those who use the superchargers for their daily electricity fill up are simply gaming the system and if this becomes too widespread, will required Tesla to restrict usage in some way. We seem to live in a society that feels very entitled to push the limits on everything. I'll get "free" electricity because I can; I'll break into this software because I can; I'll use a supercharger station for parking, not just for charging, because I can. Pretty selfish beasts, us humans, huh?

 

[brianman]

I would argue that what has been prepaid is the use of the supercharging structure for its stated intent. That intent is to enable long range travel. Those who use the superchargers for their daily electricity fill up are simply gaming the system and if this becomes too widespread, will required Tesla to restrict usage in some way. We seem to live in a society that feels very entitled to push the limits on everything. I'll get "free" electricity because I can; I'll break into this software because I can; I'll use a supercharger station for parking, not just for charging, because I can. Pretty selfish beasts, us humans, huh?

"This just in:
Tesla has installed factory robots at each station to spraypaint 'I'm a jerk' on the front hood of any Tesla that has been in an individual stall of a supercharger for more than 2 hours."

 

[Cosmacelf]

Is Hawthorne construction finished yet?

 

[earlyretirement]

Is Hawthorne construction finished yet?

I just got back a few hours ago. I hit Hawthorne this morning. I made a "video trip report" that is uploading to YouTube now. I'll post it here in an hour or so when it's ready. I figured a video starting from San Diego to Los Angeles back to San Diego including while I was at Hawthorne would be helpful to some owners. It will go up shortly but here are a few photos until then below.

They are done with the construction but several of the Bays don't have any actual chargers on them. Not sure when they will go in. I pulled in at around 8:50 AM and there was one lady there charging. I only wanted to charge about 25 minutes before a meeting I had at 10 AM. She was still there while I left. And another guy pulled in as well around 9 AM. So the 3 of us.

 

[earlyretirement]

OK.... Video finally up. Here is the Video Trip Report:

Tesla Hawthorne Supercharger - YouTube

 

[ACDriveMotor]

OK.... Video finally up. Here is the Video Trip Report:

Tesla Hawthorne Supercharger - YouTube

Nice video. Is your car fully wrapped?

 

[TsRocket]

Regarding the problem of local leeches, I wonder if Tesla could institute a roaming system (similar to that used by cellular carriers) that would disable supercharger capability of a car while it is inside its "local zone"? This way no fee would ever be required and Tesla should have the telemetry data to implement this (though the supercharging module may not be remotely controllable).

Now how local is local?. Since i always charge at the SC in burlington WA on my way to whistler, and cannot get there easily without it. I,d be mad if my 85 was dsabled from using it. I do think the SC,s should be on freeways, for us long-haulers, not in shopping centers in small towns. Thanks tesla for considering people who want to TRAVEL in their cars, not just commute to work.