Range anxiety after almost 5 yrs??

[DaveFite]

I've owned my Model S since March 2013. P85+ with 135K miles. The range estimates have always been accurate, and I've driven into my garage to charge with 1 or 2 miles showing on the display many times. Any range anxiety dissipated after a few weeks of ownership... UNTIL last Friday.

I was returning home, driving 65 mph on the highway. Home was 8.9 miles away. Range display showed 20 miles remaining. My model S seemed to be operating normally. The yellow dashed line indicators showing the max available kwh had appeared. Normal, since it was cold outside and the battery was getting low. Without any other warning the display flashed "pull over", "car shutting down". After coming to a stop, 3 hazard display warning would cycle. "Battery Power Too Low - Charge Battery", "12V Power Low - Car May Shut Down Unexpectedly" and cabin overheat protect disabled. After about 25 minutes all of the screens powered down.

I called the Telsa Service Center in my area and spoke to a service guy. He told me to call Tesla roadside assistance and gave me their phone number. This was the first time I've needed roadside assistance with my Model S and the first time I've ever called Telsa Roadside Assistance. I explained my situation. The woman told me that she was looking at the cars information and verified that (1) the battery was exhausted and (2) the range indicator did indeed show 19 miles remaining.
She told me that my car was out of warranty but maybe they could extend a one time courtesy tow. She needed to speak with her supervisor. When she returned, the answer was NO. They would however arrange a tow if I'd pay for the service but couldn't quote a price. AAA was my next call.

The next several hours waiting were spent watching youtube videos. I learned how to remove the nosecone to access the 12V battery terminals. How to release the parking break. Towing procedures etc. 5hrs later my Model S was in my driveway. The car wouldn't connect to my High Speed Wall Charger until the 12V battery had been on the trickle charger for an hour or so. Couple hours later, the car was fully charged and everything was back to business as usual.

EXCEPT now I don't trust the range indicator. It's like I have a broken fuel gauge in an ICE vehicle but the miles per tank of gas varies. Is 20 miles my new 0 miles?

Has anyone experienced this? Thoughts? Ideas? Comments?

 

[DaveFite]

 

[DOCAL]

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I'm sure a lot of people will say that the range displayed is only an estimate, and of course it is, especially in cold weather or with high power use. However, I think if the car tells you it's got 19 miles left, and it shuts down, Tesla should pay for the tow, regardless of warranty.

The car should present accurate info, and if it can't be sure it's accurate, then it should underestimate. Being that far off and leaving you stranded is unacceptable.

 

[Duke-U]

Ouch, not good for trusting the car. Did you charge to 100% and discharge to close to 0% in the last couple of weeks? The balancing of cells start above 94% SoC and the range calculation is done based on estimations using calibration of 0% and 100%. You by now have calibrated 0% I would expect.

My wife has been in a similar sudden drop situation and it freaked her out, she was calling me in total panic and crying. No fun.

 

[Gen3]

Bjorn did a video a few months ago. Same thing happened with his x just a few miles from a supercharger.

 

[ChadS]

Not good no matter how it happened, obviously. A "miles remaining" indicator is necessarily an estimate in any car, gas or electric; but usually is set to be fairly conservative so it shouldn't conk out that early.

I am curious about the 12V error. If the HV battery died (for whatever reason) and you used 12V systems for an hour or two, you would expect that error. But it displayed the 12V error as soon as the car stopped, is that correct?

I wonder if an issue with 12V battery (and/or its charging system) could have somehow caused the discrepancy between displayed miles remaining and the ability to use them.

 

[roblab]

5 years driving Tesla here, too. But I don't recall much range anxiety, except once, when I had six miles of range left and 6 miles to the nearest charger. I learned my lesson. I don't drive it down to the bone any more. I usually arrive with 30 miles left or more.

What's wrong with managing your trip so you arrive with more spare battery? What's wrong with slowing down, or watching your battery usage, especially in the cold and mountains and headwinds? I can't understand why you still trust your range indicator, since most of us know it's a guess-ti-mator. When I drive a long leg, I make sure I have extra battery, and I don't try to do eighty up hill. Ah, but that's just me.

 

[TLej]

Curious, what % did the car show with 19 RM remaining? I only drive with the % meter display, and I’m wondering if it still indicated anything above 0%.

 

[Tam]

...What's wrong with managing your trip so you arrive with more spare battery...

Nothing is wrong with distrusting the battery gauge as long as we are educated that we should not trust the battery meter and we should know that 19 miles on the battery gauge means 0 miles.

 

[SarahsDad]

I've driven down to < 5 miles many, many times in the last 4 years and never been stranded. In fact I've been surprised at how accurate the "miles remaining" has been. If I had 20 miles remaining with less than 10 actual miles, I'd say no problem. The situation described by the OP is very unusual. I suspect there's a problem with the main battery or at least with the 12V battery. I'd get the SC to investigate.

 

[David29]

Nothing is wrong with not trusting the battery gauge as long as we are educated that we should not trust the battery meter and we should know that 19 miles on the battery gauge means 0 miles.

I agree. Since the OP is apparently a new member, he may not be the type who spends a lot of time on Tesla forums and thus has not acquired all of the "folklore" that surrounds these cars (such as the comment above about balancing the cells, about which Tesla says absolutely nothing in the owner's manual). And regardless of the OP's experience in his nearly 5 years of ownership, Tesla's customers should certainly be able to trust the car to more accurately portray its ability to get them and their family safely home on a cold winter night (and it was indeed very cold last Friday, if memory serves).

I do wonder what the energy application was showing as projected range at the time the car shut down, though. Possibly the use of the energy app together with the navigation would have been a prudent way to track the remaining range, especially if there were any significant elevation change along the route.

 

[tnt1971]

The car does warn you when you go below 20% in cold weather to charge. The NE has been brutally cold. I would imagine that NH has been in the single digits and that caused the shutdown. Curious what the ambient temperature was.

 

[Electricfan]

I'm sorry I don't have much to add, but I did want to say I hope you will update this thread with more info as you go forward. I'm very interested to know if 19 is your new zero, or if your 12V fails and needs replacement. Have you ever had the 12V battery replaced? I agree what happened to you is very unsettling. I don't know your daily commute miles - is it near 80% of your car's range (a very long commute)? Or could you charge 10% more every day and give yourself more cushion? Do you make it a target to get home with as few miles remaining as you can? If so I recommend against that - from all the articles I"ve read on care and maintenance of our Tesla 18650 based batteries you don't want to drain it below 10% regularly, or charge it above 90% regularly (which I'm sure you've heard before). Thanks for this thread and please keep us up to date.

 

[fcharland]

I drive a somewhat "old" model S 85 2014, and last week I did Montreal to Niagara Falls. That is a ~700km / 434 miles drive. Brace yourselves, it was -25c or -13F if you prefer (!). It gets worse, wind chill was at -37c or -34f.

My 0 % was indeed a 0, even with that extreme temperature.

So I would say that the OP's BMS is out of wack. I would bring it back to 100% in order to re-calibrate the BMS ASAP !

 

[SMSMD]

Scary situation..sorry to hear you had to face that.. .I had close calls but never stalled. Since then i never continue on to my trip even when Tesla navigation says i have enough charge to move on. 10 to 15 minutes extra time at the charger has saved us so many times especially in our high energy consumption winters.
Even for my short daily trips iam overcharged than needed.
Was in a situation where the road was blocked for 4hours due to a fatality which can happen anytime anywhere , it's no fun in winter, luckliy I had enough buffer .

 

[fcharland]

Scary situation..sorry to hear you had to face that.. .I had close calls but never stalled. Since then i never continue on to my trip even when Tesla navigation says i have enough charge to move on. 10 to 15 minutes extra time at the charger has saved us so many times especially in our high energy consumption winters.
Even for my short daily trips iam overcharged than needed.
Was in a situation where the road was blocked for 4hours due to a fatality which can happen anytime anywhere , it's no fun in winter, luckliy I had enough buffer .

I can tell you... Tesla navigation isn't programmed (or badly programmed) to estimate properly at cold temperatures. It's doing fine at normal temperatures though. I learned it the hard way.

 

[ICUDoc]

I've driven down to < 5 miles many, many times in the last 4 years and never been stranded. In fact I've been surprised at how accurate the "miles remaining" has been. If I had 20 miles remaining with less than 10 actual miles, I'd say no problem. The situation described by the OP is very unusual. I suspect there's a problem with the main battery or at least with the 12V battery. I'd get the SC to investigate.

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Interesting story, but prompts me to say: I want THAT display back!

 

[Naonak]

Ouch, not good for trusting the car. Did you charge to 100% and discharge to close to 0% in the last couple of weeks? The balancing of cells start above 94% SoC and the range calculation is done based on estimations using calibration of 0% and 100%. You by now have calibrated 0% I would expect.

My wife has been in a similar sudden drop situation and it freaked her out, she was calling me in total panic and crying. No fun.

This highlights the problem of displaying range in any vehicle. Tesla would disable and not allow any mile range gauges in the car without a complicated procedure to activate it. It should DEFAULT to percentage and be difficult to change. No other electrical device really tells you how many minutes of charge you have remaining. They all give a percentage. Your phone doesn't say "10 minutes of charge remaining," it says "15% battery remaining." The car is no different.

The first thing I do when I get in an EV is change it to display the percentage. Displaying miles is just folly and should not be allowed for new people to an EV, it should be an explicit setting that someone has to work to enable.

 

[SMSMD]

I can tell you... Tesla navigation isn't programmed (or badly programmed) to estimate properly at cold temperatures. It's doing fine at normal temperatures though. I learned it the hard way.

Agree..I always have a back up.

 

[Duke-U]

Fully agree @Naonak We always have it on percentage. The miles/kms display gives a rather false suggestion on range. Besides a 3% indication is more alarming than a 12 km displayed, the number is lower and causes more alarm, with me at last.