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Range Anxiety Woes (or, how do we do some of this with the navigation?)

IamGaryGnu

Endless IBS
Supporting Member
Jun 16, 2021
1,420
4,557
Central New Jersey
Hi all,
I'm knee deep into range anxiety. Not my commute, or even romps. I did drive about 400 miles on Sunday, my first "big boy" trip with the car. Early in the day, i did a 100 mile round trip, that used up about 40%, so i think 80% to 40%. the car was preconditioned, there were 4 of us (2 kids) and it was like 20 out, so yeah, the car had some heating up to do for us for the drive. not much elevation, and not much wind.
For the bigger drive later, the navigation said I'd reach my destination (in some mountains, 146 or so miles away) with 30%. I didn't believe it. i also didn't know I was going to do the drive, or I'd have charged to 90%. If i didn't know there were superchargers all over, i might have pushed to 100%, but no need.
so, 1st question -
Is there a way to have the navigation continue to show the amount remaining at end of the trip, without taking up the whole left of the display?
Does that estimated amount remaining update during the drive?
Can we trust it, or give a 10% or whatever leeway, and by that, I mean 10% of the value it says, say, 3% if it says 30%, versus it saying 30% and it could be 40% or 20%?

anyway, i managed to luck out and hit a supercharger when I had a good amount left, maybe 45%, i don't remember.
I forgot what I had when I got to my destination. Again, if my trip out was supposed to be about 80% to 30% (so, 50% of capacity) I know that the trip back should also have been about 50% of the full capacity, give or take (maybe do a little better coming down from the mountains).
I was able to add superchargers to the display (um, wasn't hard) and then added one as a waypoint. that did allow preconditioning for supercharging
Is that any different than just driving there for an hour or so - I figure that would warm the batteries anyway, though it was about 20 degrees out

Is there any way to easily just add a supercharger to your route if the car doesn't think you need to? I did it as a waypoint, and i think I did it correctly, but I'm not sure I could do it correctly 10 out of 10 times.

basically, I appreciate any input anyone can give on how to be more efficient and "Better' with this stuff. I may also use ABRP and anything else recommended.
FWIW, I had about 80% when I left my home, and yeah, stopped at a supercharger each way. I made it home with like 50% left, so that was overkill, but then I wasn't sweating it out (It drives me nuts when I see i lose 1% really quickly early on - i get it, cold batteries, whatever) but still, it scares me.

I also believe that the "pros" use percentages, and newbies like me use miles (i actually use percentage, but them simply multiply by 400) - is that the "right" way to go?
thanks for any and all help!!!!!
 
To answer your first question, yes the range estimate updates as you proceed - so if you are using extra power or less power it's reflected in the estimate upon arrival.

A little background: So here's my experience in an 85 with about 8 years under my belt. The range estimate is pretty good- except for when using the heater. Of course the new S has a Heat Pump so that is probably no longer a problem. We rarely take the car below 15% range ( about 40 miles predicted) and I wouldn't hesitate to take a new S down to 10% (also around 40 miles ) We usually charge the car to 90% at home and on road trips charge it enough to reach the next superchargers with that 15% buffer. We've had no issues with that in the 150,000 miles we've driven over 3 different Model S's Just finished a 1600 mile trip in our 2015 85D, following this advice: Charge to the next station with a 15% buffer. We typically drive just about the speed limit unless there is traffic, then we drive the same speed as the prevailing traffic, which is sometime above the speed limit and other times below it.

Our experience is that the range estimator does indeed take into account elevation changes and assumes you are driving about the speed limit, It doesn't factor in either Temperature or wind- and in the West, Wind can be a major factor, So much so that I actually look at the windy.com maps before departing on a road trip and if we are going to have a head wind over 10MPH, I actually add extra charge .

The nav as far as I know, only gives the option of deleting supercharger stops. It will warn you not to exceed a certain speed if you haven't enough range in the tank to make it unless you slow down. To add a stop, I just plug in the next charger along the way as a destination. In the early days of road tripping with many fewer superchargers, we would charge to nearly 100% and then go slow for the first 1/3 of a trip I particularly remember doing this trying to make it across MO before there was a supercharger in Columbia MO.



YMMV, but that has been our experience.
 
Few tips for you to manage your anxiety ( reduce battery consumption).
1) Speed has big impact on battery consumption - once you go over 60 mph it starts impacting range
2) Weight of cargo- remove any unwanted weight or cargo in the car- weight affects consumption
3) Heating or cooling : use the best option for comfort- remember everything runs off the battery. Use car seat heaters if you have it. it is more efficient in heating the cabin. in winter use cabin preconditioning prior to departure
4) elevation climb consumes more battery
5) Wind resistance ( specially strong head wind)with consume more battery charge
6) the range in miles is based on % battery and all the above 5 factors - there is not set formula to multiply % battery with a fixed number. That may be possible in ideal conditions , but ideal conditions seldom exist. The cr's
The car's trip planner is also very useful in getting the prediction on the battery% on arrival
Hope this helps
 
Last edited:
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1: Don’t base anything on 400 miles of range. The car won’t go that far on a charge in the real world.
2: Always navigate to Superchargers for optimum battery temperature and charging speed. In cold temperatures especially, it takes far longer than you probably realize to pre-heat the battery and only the car knows how long.
3. The aforementioned “charge to your next charging stop plus 15%” is an excellent rule of thumb.
4: In very cold temperatures or at speeds 15-20% higher than the speed limit you may need to increase that to 20-25% more.
5: When possible, charge to 95-100% before heading out for any longer road trip. Presuming that you’re charging overnight, this is no inconvenience and gives you more options along your route.
5: Use ABRP to check out your trip beforehand. Plug in the actual temperatures, wind and weather conditions, speed over the speed limit and extra weight for extremely accurate results and then use those to double-check the car’s NAV suggestions.
6: Enjoy the adventure and don’t sweat it/focus on range. You’ll get there.
 

IamGaryGnu

Endless IBS
Supporting Member
Jun 16, 2021
1,420
4,557
Central New Jersey
To answer your first question, yes the range estimate updates as you proceed - so if you are using extra power or less power it's reflected in the estimate upon arrival.

A little background: So here's my experience in an 85 with about 8 years under my belt. The range estimate is pretty good- except for when using the heater. Of course the new S has a Heat Pump so that is probably no longer a problem. We rarely take the car below 15% range ( about 40 miles predicted) and I wouldn't hesitate to take a new S down to 10% (also around 40 miles ) We usually charge the car to 90% at home and on road trips charge it enough to reach the next superchargers with that 15% buffer. We've had no issues with that in the 150,000 miles we've driven over 3 different Model S's Just finished a 1600 mile trip in our 2015 85D, following this advice: Charge to the next station with a 15% buffer. We typically drive just about the speed limit unless there is traffic, then we drive the same speed as the prevailing traffic, which is sometime above the speed limit and other times below it.

Our experience is that the range estimator does indeed take into account elevation changes and assumes you are driving about the speed limit, It doesn't factor in either Temperature or wind- and in the West, Wind can be a major factor, So much so that I actually look at the windy.com maps before departing on a road trip and if we are going to have a head wind over 10MPH, I actually add extra charge .

The nav as far as I know, only gives the option of deleting supercharger stops. It will warn you not to exceed a certain speed if you haven't enough range in the tank to make it unless you slow down. To add a stop, I just plug in the next charger along the way as a destination. In the early days of road tripping with many fewer superchargers, we would charge to nearly 100% and then go slow for the first 1/3 of a trip I particularly remember doing this trying to make it across MO before there was a supercharger in Columbia MO.



YMMV, but that has been our experience.
thank you - that was great and i'll re-read it a couple of times. I felt when it showed I should have 30%, i'd be lucky to have that and that falls well within your 10% lower limit.
i think in the warmer weather i'll do much better (actually less dense air, and more happiness for the batteries) but then flip it around and now the AC and cooler may have to work more.
I'll continue to try to figure out how best to put in the superchargers - i know if i want a say, 600 mile trip, it will do it for me, but if i'm going only 200 and i want to top off, i have to manually do that - i'm just not adept as yet.
i read about wind having a greater effect than i think temperature, so that's a great point - i never heard of windy.com but i guess that makes a lot of sense.
it would be awesome if the trip planner can consider altitude changes (i think it does) and wind conditions (i think it doesn't). throw in some temperature for good luck, and maybe some AI to analyze my driving habits, and we may have better accuracy.
i'd still LOVE the option to see the estimated range at the desination all the time. I think it's great it gives you estimated time and distance, where some cars make you choose between the two.
thank you again!
 

IamGaryGnu

Endless IBS
Supporting Member
Jun 16, 2021
1,420
4,557
Central New Jersey
Few tips for you to manage your anxiety ( reduce battery consumption).
1) Speed has big impact on battery consumption - once you go over 60 mph it starts impacting range
2) Weight of cargo- remove any unwanted weight or cargo in the car- weight affects consumption
3) Heating or cooling : use the best option for comfort- remember everything runs off the battery. Use car seat heaters if you have it. it is more efficient in heating the cabin. in winter use cabin preconditioning prior to departure
4) elevation climb consumes more battery
5) Wind resistance ( specially strong head wind)with consume more battery charge
6) the range in miles is based on % battery and all the above 5 factors - there is not set formula to multiply % battery with a fixed number. That may be possible in ideal conditions , but ideal conditions seldom exist. The cr's
The car's trip planner is also very useful in getting the prediction on the battery% on arrival
Hope this helps
thanks, that was great, though your avatar just made me hungry!
6) was very helpful - i'd been doing a simplified version of multiplying charge percentage by 405 (maximum range) and then not believing it anyway - so a 10% charge should be about 40 miles - but yeah, that doesn't account for speed, elevation, wind, etc. - i have less than 1,000 miles on the car so i'm still learning.
thanks again!
 
thank you - that was great and i'll re-read it a couple of times. I felt when it showed I should have 30%, i'd be lucky to have that and that falls well within your 10% lower limit.
i think in the warmer weather i'll do much better (actually less dense air, and more happiness for the batteries) but then flip it around and now the AC and cooler may have to work more.
I'll continue to try to figure out how best to put in the superchargers - i know if i want a say, 600 mile trip, it will do it for me, but if i'm going only 200 and i want to top off, i have to manually do that - i'm just not adept as yet.
i read about wind having a greater effect than i think temperature, so that's a great point - i never heard of windy.com but i guess that makes a lot of sense.
it would be awesome if the trip planner can consider altitude changes (i think it does) and wind conditions (i think it doesn't). throw in some temperature for good luck, and maybe some AI to analyze my driving habits, and we may have better accuracy.
i'd still LOVE the option to see the estimated range at the desination all the time. I think it's great it gives you estimated time and distance, where some cars make you choose between the two.
thank you again!
you are welcome,

In our experience, the AC uses far less energy, to the point we don't worry about it. ( and we live in AZ most of the time!)

Like Zcd1 said, ABR is a good tool to pre-plan the trip- spend a few min with it and it will give you good feeling about the range you can reasonably expect if you are honest about wind, temp and speed. Also, the advice to navigate to the next supercharger is spot on, especially in the winter when it's cold enough that the battery needs to pre-condition to maximize the charge rate. We experienced that it did that quite well on this last trip where the temps were in the 50s most of the way
 
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IamGaryGnu

Endless IBS
Supporting Member
Jun 16, 2021
1,420
4,557
Central New Jersey
you are welcome,

In our experience, the AC uses far less energy, to the point we don't worry about it. ( and we live in AZ most of the time!)

Like Zcd1 said, ABR is a good tool to pre-plan the trip- spend a few min with it and it will give you good feeling about the range you can reasonably expect if you are honest about wind, temp and speed. Also, the advice to navigate to the next supercharger is spot on, especially in the winter when it's cold enough that the battery needs to pre-condition to maximize the charge rate. We experienced that it did that quite well on this last trip where the temps were in the 50s most of the way
thanks, but your cold 50s is like my warm days! it was 16 to 20 so that was pretty cold - today is going up to 47, and tomorrow 54, which is like crazy warm in february out here :)
 

Hayseed_MS

Spreader of "Endless Non Sequitur"
Jan 19, 2021
2,859
12,306
Strongbadia
This is my first EV and have had 23k miles on it since June.

Several temp ranges (-10 ~ +105F). Drive a lot of highway. Found very low temps suck 10-20% out. Speeds over 70mph suck the life out of it.

Only % for me.

The waypoints update was a Godsend. I plug in the entire trip with all stops. Arrange and add/subtract as I go. Found it to be very accurate and it adjusts to the climate/speed/environment. Found that unless the weather turned real nasty or I was going fast, the % stayed throughout the trip very accurate,

I thought I would have tremendous range anxiety. At first I did but learned to relax and enjoy the drive. I do not really care - I drive the way I want to drive and stop when needed. Enjoy the journey. The car is smart - so listen to it.
 

Hayseed_MS

Spreader of "Endless Non Sequitur"
Jan 19, 2021
2,859
12,306
Strongbadia
Most of us charge to 100% before most any long road trip. While charging to 100% and leaving your car sit, is not recommended, charging to 100% just before leaving is fine.

Agreed. On normal local days, I charge to 85% (use the scheduled charging/preconditioning). On trip days, I raise to 95%. While getting ready, I set to add the last 5% so battery is nice charged and warmed for the trip.
 

cwanja

Active Member
Jun 14, 2021
3,676
10,906
Houston, Texas
I thought I would have tremendous range anxiety. At first I did but learned to relax and enjoy the drive. I do not really care - I drive the way I want to drive and stop when needed. Enjoy the journey. The car is smart - so listen to it.
The last part of this it literally all the advice that is needed.

Listen to what the car is telling you. If it is saying "Slow down to 70 to reach destination" then act accordingly. It is a hell of a lot better at predicting range than we are.
 
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I'm still wondering if they'll ever bother putting the Energy App back in the Model S. Can't think of why they'd remove it, because it was very helpful. At least helpful in alleviating range anxiety for me! Lol!
have they removed it in Model S ? meaning it was there before and now they have removed it? I don't have MS so I am just checking - as it may happen to other models as well down the line.
 
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cwanja

Active Member
Jun 14, 2021
3,676
10,906
Houston, Texas
have they removed it in Model S ? meaning it was there before and now they have removed it? I don't have MS so I am just checking - as it may happen to other models as well down the line.
The refreshed Model S, deliveries started in June 2021, does not have the energy graph since inception. Nor does it have the ability to customize the instrument cluster.
 
If you are planning a long trip you should check out the App ABTP, America's est trip planner. It works great and lets you modify the data to check different scenarios suck as ow much range you want when arriving, or using different super chargers from what the car nav. wants. Really worked well on my last few long trips.
 
If you are planning a long trip you should check out the App ABTP, America's est trip planner. It works great and lets you modify the data to check different scenarios suck as ow much range you want when arriving, or using different super chargers from what the car nav. wants. Really worked well on my last few long trips.
Probably ABRP is what you meant rather than ABTP which is the Association of Black Travel Professionals.
 
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