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Range depletion due to low temperature

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While the temp when leaving is 10C, what was the temp for most of the night? Because, the temp of the battery slowly changes based upon the ambient. By morning, when you are ready to go, the battery is likely colder than the current ambient. I see this all the time, when I leave in the morning at 60F, the regen dots appear, because the temps were much colder for much of the night. Even if you prep the car, unless you prep it for a good while, the battery may still show that it's colder with regen dots.

Also, try ABRP and put in as much detail as possible. It uses real-world data to give you your estimates. Also, calibrate ABRP for you vehicle, to find out what your specific car's efficiency is at highway speeds. Here in the US, it calibrates at 65mph, not sure what it uses for metric, 105? Through using ABRP, you can do sensitivity testing, to better estimate what affects your car's range. The more you know, the more confidence you'll gain in what trips your car can and can't do.

You don't only need to use a supercharger, any DC fast charger will work, or were you using that term generically? It's a shame that there aren't more stations, if that's the case. I couldn't buy a Tesla where I live until they put more than 2 superchargers in my state, a few years ago.

During the first two trips of the six in total the temperature was about 8C before I left. The latest four had slightly colder temperatures. Lots of tricks available to make the situation slightly better in the coming months, but has anyone actually confronted Tesla about this? What is their response? I anticipated a drop in rate from the advertised to 400km to around 300km, even though Tesla did not mention it anywhere, but below 200km just seems like a bad joke. Luckily, even below 200km is enough for me on almost all days, but something still feels wrong about a drop that is this significant.

I tried driving with the seat warmers on instead of the climate control, and to be honest, it sucks. Recirculating the air is a good idea, I'll give it a try on my next longer trip. There are superchargers in four directions from Helsinki and for me reaching them should hopefully not be a problem. I'm sure there's other fast chargers available as well, but have not checked yet.

The speed we are allowed to drive on most decent highways is 75mph and 63mph in the winter. Naturally, there are situations where driving slightly faster is perfectly fine and a ticket is a rare event.
 
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During the first two trips of the six in total the temperature was about 8C before I left. The latest four had slightly colder temperatures. Lots of tricks available to make the situation slightly better in the coming months, but has anyone actually confronted Tesla about this? What is their response? I anticipated a drop in rate from the advertised to 400km to around 300km, even though Tesla did not mention it anywhere, but below 200km just seems like a bad joke. Luckily, even below 200km is enough for me on almost all days, but something still feels wrong about a drop that is this significant.

I tried driving with the seat warmers on instead of the climate control, and to be honest, it sucks. Recirculating the air is a good idea, I'll give it a try on my next longer trip. There are superchargers in four directions from Helsinki and for me reaching them should hopefully not be a problem. I'm sure there's other fast chargers available as well, but have not checked yet.

The speed we are allowed to drive on most decent highways is 75mph and 63mph in the winter. Naturally, there are situations where driving slightly faster is perfectly fine and a ticket is a rare event.

Short trips use more energy than long trips. Expect up to 50% range loss in extreme winter weather or if you’re doing lots of short trips in ~freezing weather. There are numerous threads in the Model 3 forum discussing winter energy consumption and range. New heat pump-equipped cars should see a significant improvement in winter efficiency (until it gets too cold for the heat pump to be effective).
 
These charts (and the info below them) may prove useful:
Teslike.com

Thanks!

Short trips use more energy than long trips. Expect up to 50% range loss in extreme winter weather or if you’re doing lots of short trips in ~freezing weather. There are numerous threads in the Model 3 forum discussing winter energy consumption and range. New heat pump-equipped cars should see a significant improvement in winter efficiency (until it gets too cold for the heat pump to be effective).

It's funny how everyone just seems to accept the fact that in certain conditions you lose 50% of the range as something totally natural. So the assumption is that before you buy a Tesla you spend dozens of hours researching online and talking to Tesla drivers. Don't get me wrong, I'm not mad at all. I did some research and am only surprised about at how this unfortunate trend already starts at temperatures that are not particularly cold in my opinion (5-10C) and that Tesla does not warn customers in any way, especially in states/countries where the weather is cold for half of the year. It's also not just about range. The money used on charging the car doubles as well. Despite still being by far less than what gas costs, it's something that should be mentioned by Tesla. They even tell people on their website about how much a Tesla really costs when you consider the savings of electricity vs. gas. No asterisk to clarify that savings are much less for people outside of CA and FL.

I live in Finland, went for two test drivers before ordering my M3 (which I love) and asked tons of questions while at the store, and this issue with range loss was not mentioned even once.
 
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... I did some research and am only surprised about at how this unfortunate trend already starts at temperatures that are not particularly cold in my opinion (5-10C) and that Tesla does not warn customers in any way, especially in states/countries where the weather is cold for half of the year.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but do ICE vehicles sold in Finland include information about their lower fuel efficiency in colder temperatures, or about the fact that running the air conditioning also affects efficiency?

If you were to measure an ICE vehicle's efficiency in cold temperatures over short trips the results would also be much lower than official ratings.

All of that said, I did ask my Tesla advisor about this specific issue - he suggested than the results would be perhaps 20% worse than in warmer temps. Granted this was in late 2018 and all of the data we have now wasn't yet available because few or no Model 3s had gone through a full winter yet...
 
I'm not trying to be argumentative, but do ICE vehicles sold in Finland include information about their lower fuel efficiency in colder temperatures, or about the fact that running the air conditioning also affects efficiency?

If you were to measure an ICE vehicle's efficiency in cold temperatures over short trips the results would also be much lower than official ratings.

All of that said, I did ask my Tesla advisor about this specific issue - he suggested than the results would be perhaps 20% worse than in warmer temps. Granted this was in late 2018 and all of the data we have now wasn't yet available because few or no Model 3s had gone through a full winter yet...

If they do, I totally missed it. I might have discussed the issue with the Tesla representative among other issues, but was not told anything as significant as what is discussed in this thread. He/she probably said something like "cold temperatures slightly affect range in a negative way" and a quickly moved on to topics that I worried more about.
 
If they do, I totally missed it. I might have discussed the issue with the Tesla representative among other issues, but was not told anything as significant as what is discussed in this thread. He/she probably said something like "cold temperatures slightly affect range in a negative way" and a quickly moved on to topics that I worried more about.
Do you have winter gas in Finland? When the gas chemistry is changed to winter gas here in the cold parts of Canada, ICEv mileage goes down 10% before the effects of low temperatures is added.
 
It depends on if I can take the train into work or not, really. I'm usually looking at 50 m/day or 80 m/day depending.

That's no problem. A commuter rail station I can use most days offers free EV charging.

Thanks, MBTA.

I have charging at work at least!

So you will survive ONLY because of you outside of the home charging abilities. If you were only charging at home you wouldn't survive on 120V in the winter in the NorthEast. 120V just can't keep up with cold weather, <30degF even in a garage.

And not trying to go down the rabbit hole here cause I know there are all kinds of situations that can cause there not to be home charging available, but you might want to think about it a bit more and see if you can think of a way to get around what ever reasons there are for not having home charging.
 
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