Range differences with Pilot Sport All Season 4 or CrossClimate2 vs Primacy MXM4

[Zoomit]

Doubtful that the difference will be meaningful.

True and hard to measure, but it also depends on the wheels not just the tires. An 18” wheel can be less efficient than a 20”. People replacing their heavy Uberturbines with 18” forged wheels, specifically to get more highway range, have wasted their money.

 

[dfwatt]

True and hard to measure, but it also depends on the wheels not just the tires. An 18” wheel can be less efficient than a 20”. People replacing their heavy Uberturbines with 18” forged wheels, specifically to get more highway range, have wasted their money.

Most of the efficiency difference is favoring smaller Wheels because of less aerodynamic/drag loss. At least that's the general expert opinion from people who know

 

[coleAK]

Smaller wheels = more sidewall. Sidewall is more aerodynamic then rim. So yes all else equal 18” will me more efficient then 20”. Will that difference be noticeable? Possibly, more like to be noticeable the faster you drive.

 

[DarkNightP3D]

After several bent rims on my 20" performance rims and hating my efficiency, averaging over 300wh/mi, I pulled the trigger and ordered a set of 18" TST wheels. I wasn't sure of the tire, but went ahead yesterday and ordered a set of Pilot Sport All Season 4 tires... I have DWS06 on the 20" wheels now and I have never liked them. They always had a lot of vibration even after being road force balanced several times. I had the bent rims fixed and it made no difference. So anyway, I am really hoping there will be an improvement going from DWS06 245/35R20 to PSAS4 in 235/45R18... The wheels are much lighter, the tires are skinnier, and the smaller overall diameter I am hoping will all lead to improvement in range. I almost just put MXM4 to maximize range but didn't want to lose all my performance goodness.

Also hoping the AS4 will be better than OE PS4S about throwing stuff onto the side of the car. My rocker panels look like they went into a sandblaster from the first 25K miles I had the PS4S on the car. The DWS06 did not throw stuff against the car, that was the one positive about the tire and also were slightly more efficient than the PS4S. They also haven't worn almost any in 15K miles.

 

[dropgems]

After several bent rims on my 20" performance rims and hating my efficiency, averaging over 300wh/mi, I pulled the trigger and ordered a set of 18" TST wheels. I wasn't sure of the tire, but went ahead yesterday and ordered a set of Pilot Sport All Season 4 tires... I have DWS06 on the 20" wheels now and I have never liked them. They always had a lot of vibration even after being road force balanced several times. I had the bent rims fixed and it made no difference. So anyway, I am really hoping there will be an improvement going from DWS06 245/35R20 to PSAS4 in 235/45R18... The wheels are much lighter, the tires are skinnier, and the smaller overall diameter I am hoping will all lead to improvement in range. I almost just put MXM4 to maximize range but didn't want to lose all my performance goodness.

Also hoping the AS4 will be better than OE PS4S about throwing stuff onto the side of the car. My rocker panels look like they went into a sandblaster from the first 25K miles I had the PS4S on the car. The DWS06 did not throw stuff against the car, that was the one positive about the tire and also were slightly more efficient than the PS4S. They also haven't worn almost any in 15K miles.

Yea I just ordered the tst 18’s with as4 to replace my stock performance 20’s.

 

[Gasaraki]

I put new 19" ExtremeContact DWS06 Plus on my car and replaced the 18" MXM4. After 1000 miles or so, the range hit seems to be about 4%. This is also with an increase width of 245 from 235.

 

[Fadiawesome]

Pulled the trigger and ordered four Cross Climate 2s. They threw in an alignment to order four (contemplated only doing the rears since I had plenty of tread left on the front).

I get 245 (Summer) to 255 (Winter) wh/mi so we'll see how things end up.

Hi, can you share how your efficiency has been after a couple months now? I'm deciding between these and the pilot sport 4 all seasons, and I would like to go with the tire that gives me the least range loss

 

[dfwatt]

Hi, can you share how your efficiency has been after a couple months now? I'm deciding between these and the pilot sport 4 all seasons, and I would like to go with the tire that gives me the least range loss

Their efficiency is reasonably close but neither are that efficient compared to the MXM4. Their traction and grip is not close. Seems like a poor heuristic to weigh only range and not safety.

 

[Kevy Baby]

Hi, can you share how your efficiency has been after a couple months now? I'm deciding between these and the pilot sport 4 all seasons, and I would like to go with the tire that gives me the least range loss

I cannot compare the CC2+ and PS4, but I can say that my CC2s gave me a range hit of about 10+ wh/mi

 

[dfwatt]

I cannot compare the CC2+ and PS4, but I can say that my CC2s gave me a range hit of about 10+ wh/mi

That sounds about right. And I I suspect that the PS4 all seasons are a little bit past that.

 

[ysaliens]

According to reviews and Michelin specs, the CC2+ has a 10% improvement in LRR over the CC2.

No it won't be close to the MXM4...but it's closer-er

 

[Zoomit]

According to reviews and Michelin specs, the CC2+ has a 10% improvement in LRR over the CC2.

No it won't be close to the MXM4...but it's closer-er

I think you mean CC2 has 10% better rolling resistance than the CC+

 

[WAG441]

I replaced my second set of MXM$ with Pilot Sport AS4 and had a 16% mileage loss .... I filed a warranty claim with Michelin and will replace with MXM4 when available.

 

[dfwatt]

I replaced my second set of MXM$ with Pilot Sport AS4 and had a 16% mileage loss .... I filed a warranty claim with Michelin and will replace with MXM4 when available.

Did they laugh when you filed a warranty claim?

 

[dfwatt]

Did they laugh when you filed a warranty claim?

Please post here when you get the results of your ridiculous warranty claim. We need more entertainment!

 

[AZAV8R]

Please post here when you get the results of your ridiculous warranty claim. We need more entertainment!

Lighten up, Francis! Not everyone is as smart as you apparently are. The OP (This was their first post here) is certainly going to come back, given your warm welcome.

 

[AZAV8R]

I replaced my second set of MXM$ with Pilot Sport AS4 and had a 16% mileage loss .... I filed a warranty claim with Michelin and will replace with MXM4 when available.

You not likely to get anywhere with a warranty claim. If you bought them from Discount Tire, as I did, and you are within a certain number of miles they will take them back as a customer service but not warranty. Good luck finding MXM’s if you go back to them. I could not find them and went to the same tires you have. I’m still too early to find out about the range hit.

 

[Nayston]

Why is there limited (to no) talk about the Vredstein QuadTrac Pro's? The ratings on TireRack are better than the PS A/S 4 and the CC2's. Plus they are almost 1/3rd of the cost of the PS4's.

 

[Legacystar]

Figured i'd some actual data to this thread. I replaced the Stock 235/40r19 Continentals with 245/40ZR19 Pilot Sport AS 4. Now, i know i went wider but at least it's hard data. more context, i got them put on last week, so i picked the last 3 days of commuting and compared it to the last 3 days with the continentals. additionally, the continentals has 37k miles on them, so they were worn down, i anticipate once these Pilot sports wear a bit I'll see an improvement. side note, they are MUCH quieter than the continentals, I'm very happy.

Also, i did a rally up to Diablo Lake here in Washington right after i got them which i also did last year, so i'll pull the data from both trips and post.

Data taken from Tezlab app

Pilot Sport AS 4
Vehicle Name	Start Time	Distance Traveled (mi)	Efficiency	From	To	Temperature (F)	Est Wh/mi	Est Power (kW)	Difference
Stevesie	9/22/2021 16:15	22.2	0.7622	Kirkland, WA	Renton, WA	70	336	7.4	22.32%​
Stevesie	9/23/2021 15:37	25.7	0.93845	Woodinville, WA	Tukwila, WA	77	272	7	-7.72%​
Stevesie	9/24/2021 16:03	39.2	0.838578	Bothell, WA	Renton, WA	82	306	12	11.76%​
Continental
Stevesie	9/16/2021 16:22	24.9	0.981335	Bothell, WA	Renton, WA	73	261	6.5
Stevesie	9/17/2021 16:11	25.3	0.869342	Bothell, WA	Renton, WA	63	293	7.4
Stevesie	9/20/2021 16:10	25.2	0.946967	Bothell, WA	Renton, WA	78	270	6.8
Pilot Sport AS 4
Vehicle Name	Start Time	Distance Traveled (mi)	Efficiency	From	To	Temperature (F)	Est Wh/mi	Est Power (kW)	Difference
Stevesie	9/23/2021 6:10	21.8	0.773896	Renton, WA	Bothell, WA	60	330	7.2	13.94%​
Stevesie	9/24/2021 6:14	21.1	0.859656	Renton, WA	Redmond, WA	59	298	6.3	14.77%​
Stevesie	9/27/2021 6:26	23.7	0.877342	Renton, WA	Bothell, WA	63	292	6.9	8.22%​
Continental
Stevesie	9/16/2021 6:26	25.5	0.902298	Renton, WA	Bothell, WA	63	284	7.2
Stevesie	9/17/2021 6:30	25.5	1.00355	Renton, WA	Bothell, WA	64	254	6.5
Stevesie	9/20/2021 6:31	25.5	0.954438	Renton, WA	Bothell, WA	63	268	6.8

 

[mduffin]

Has anyone with a Model 3 Performance and 20" OEM turbine wheels gone from OEM Tire Size (235/35-20) to a taller tire like (235/40-20) or (235/45-20)??