Range issues

[Glan gluaisne]

That's fine. All I was saying is that 30 10 mile trips does not equal one 300 mile trip.
Current record for LR Model 3 is over 600 miles at about 35 mph. It's pretty easy to get above the rated numbers.

Short trips in cold weather are very definitely a range killer. Both my last two cars lost a great deal of battery range when doing short trips, probably around 25% to 30% less range in short trips during the winter at a guess.

Not sure how much the heating systems (cabin and battery) use, but would guess that it's a fair bit. I've noticed that the charge point maxes out at over 7 kW when preconditioning on a cold morning, which suggests that the car's using more than that to warm up. As the car probably averages somewhere around 8 to 10 kW* for motive power, it looks as if the initial power to heat the thing could double the power consumption for a time. If the heater needs ~2 kW to keep the interior warm on a cold day, then that alone would explain the big hit seen on range.


* WAG, based on 30mph using maybe 250 Wh/mile, which gives an average power of 7.5 kW

 

[Tonybvi]

This is UK. We can't do that here. London to Edinburgh is 500 miles using the long route and you would be very lucky to average 50

Oh yes you can!! I frequently do the 300mile trip Aberdeen to Preston. Dual carriageways and/or motorway nearly all the way and relatively traffic free. I easily average 55mph including a supercharger stop.

 

[davidmc]

Here is mine (SR+) - over 7k miles since August 2019

workings out 1,771kWh / 7,372 miles = 0.240 x 100 = 240wh/mile

 

[Yev000]

Oh yes you can!!

Show us the TeslaFi stats for that trip. That would be interesting to see.

 

[tess19]

Going on the motorway at +70 really eat into the range. Going any slower risk tailgated by white van or artic. The best consumption is achieved on roadworks with average speed cameras or A roads where the limit is 60.

With regards to short trips being a range killer, short trips should not give you range anxiety either. Dont worry about it and just use the car. If you are worried about efficiency, a bike is best for short trips.

 

[Tonybvi]

Show us the TeslaFi stats for that trip. That would be interesting to see.

Would do if I used TeslaFi! Note I didn’t say what my watts/mile was as the MX fairly uses energy at speed!
In case you don’t know the road the journey (A90 - A9 - M9 - M74 - M6) consists of only three sets of traffic lights and several roundabouts at Dundee then no other pinch points. It also happens to be a pretty scenic journey for most of the route.

 

[Fredneck]

Going on the motorway at +70 really eat into the range. Going any slower risk tailgated by white van or artic. The best consumption is achieved on roadworks with average speed cameras or A roads where the limit is 60.

With regards to short trips being a range killer, short trips should not give you range anxiety either. Dont worry about it and just use the car. If you are worried about efficiency, a bike is best for short trips.

I find it interesting that the Tesla navigator doesn't include an option for routing the way that uses the least charge. It seems to go solely by time. My routine includes a long drive to reach a destination (~125 miles) then a couple days of local driving (up to 100 miles), then a return trip (125 miles). It nearly always wants to route me on the high speed highway for the long legs even though I will reach the destination with less remaining charge, even if that is less than 5%. Using another tool like abetterrouteplanner it will let me pick alternate routes (with difficulty) and shows more remaining charge on the route with low speed highways.

Reaching a destination with 7% gives me a lot more confidence of reaching it than starting with the expectation of 5% or less. The time difference is only 10 minutes and the slower roads have a lot less chance of congestion.

 

[VanillaAir_UK]

I lost a lot of faith in abetterrouteplanner.com when it routed us to Liphook supercharger via a road little more than 6'6 with passing places in sections and potholes the size of craters.

 

[Fredneck]

I lost a lot of faith in abetterrouteplanner.com when it routed us to Liphook supercharger via a road little more than 6'6 with passing places in sections and potholes the size of craters.

If I remember correctly, ABRP uses OpenStreetMap for their road info. I would guess that road is not labeled correctly. It used to be set up so you could update it. They may have grown beyond it being manipulated by users, but I don't think so. I was stuck behind a rock slide on a highway last year and I found they had very poor support for adding temporary road closures like that one. Otherwise I would have gone in and ticked it as closed for the next couple of weeks.

I use ABRP for any trip where I will need to stop for charging more than once. The Tesla tools seem to suck for anything remotely complicated and are totally inflexible. It often routes me to a destination which is around 11% of my battery range from a charger and says I'll arrive with maybe 5% left. Why wouldn't it suggest that I stop at one of the three chargers I'd be passing??? Tesla Navigator sucks for many tasks.

 

[Gaz_]

I have a 2017 model S75, a 51 mile commute to work and EAP so I find my mind wandering to range calculations as I (or the car) drives along.

I park in the garage, My journey is 9 miles on smaller 30mph roads, 33 miles on the motorway, 8 miles on smaller roads again

The first 9 miles, regardless of how carefully I drive is always over 420Wh/mi, I put this down to warming the car despite it being in the garage and warming the battery.

Once on the motorway the initial 8-10 miles I get the Wh/mi down to about 350Wh/mi, its uphill and the car still isn't warm.

As I complete my motorway driving my average over the last 15 miles has got as low as 200Wh/mi if i do 60mph, more like 250 if I do 70mph.

Back on the back roads it is up to about 310Wh/mi till the end of the journey.

When I bought the car I reset trip B and have clocked my average mileage over the 12000 miles I've done in the last few months and it averages 324Wh/mi. It appears that 50% of my charge is about 34KWh so that puts my range at about 209 miles and the car always quotes me 220 at full.

Sorry for all the boring maths but the conclusions I draw are that those first 10 miles are a killer on the range, if you only do short journeys from cold the range is going to be horrible, but also there is quite a difference on the motorway between 75, 70, 65, 60 mph I find my sweet spot is 65, fast enough to be safely passing lorries but not annoy the faster traffic and getting notably more range.

I hope that helps.

EDIT: I would hope a smaller lighter M3 would do better than the S

 

[VanillaAir_UK]

Open Street Map in UK is largely Ordinance Survey data so pretty reliable.

The issue was we had detoured due to road closures, but not knowing these in advance, ignored the big detour that Tesla sat nav had told us to make and instead tried our normal route, bypassing the various road closures. After many detours, we eventually ended up on our normal route that we would normally take home if we were not looking to Supercharge. When we got to Petworth, heading north, ABRP gave us 2 options to get to Liphook supercharger - we chose the preferred southern route and then started following Tesla nav for turn by turn over the last two legs. Tesla sat nav turned us off early, a wise choice it transpired, as we had an OK trip to the point that we picked up the ABRP route again north into Liphook. The road from then on into Liphook was awful - I just revisited it on street view - just as bad as we remembered. Should have stuck with Tesla sat nav from the beginning, big route on major A roads, or gone the northern route from Petworth. Lesson learned, when going off piste with ABRP, don't plan route without double checking it.

 

[Adopado]

You need to measure what comes out of your wall outlet to measure the true wh/mi, which is what the OP did.

The title of the thread is about range so, for me, that means how far can you go with what's in your battery. If you are interested in measuring costs per mile then of course you then need to do the full consumption calculation.

 

[MaDProFF]

Fact is there is quite a few things you can do to improve range, from changing wheel rims to driving with no AC lower heat. even changing number plates to stick on all helps, the top glass rubber insert helps with area dynamics as well all the little things add up.

For me on average with my Performance on 18" rims at least 30% lighter, and tyres, no AC, 19ºc I average roughly 300 over all my journeys, which does include some fast motorway drives, and overtakes.

 

[mswlogo]

Fact is there is quite a few things you can do to improve range, from changing wheel rims to driving with no AC lower heat. even changing number plates to stick on all helps, the top glass rubber insert helps with area dynamics as well all the little things add up.

For me on average with my Performance on 18" rims at least 30% lighter, and tyres, no AC, 19ºc I average roughly 300 over all my journeys, which does include some fast motorway drives, and overtakes.

Rims are for looks. Tires are for range.

However some rims allow more tire choices. 19” gives you the widest tire selection.

I averaged 230 wh/mi in summer on 19” OEM and 300 wh/mi in winter on Aero’s. Performance Stealth.

 

[MaDProFF]

Rims are for looks. Tires are for range.

However some rims allow more tire choices. 19” gives you the widest tire selection.

I averaged 230 wh/mi in summer on 19” OEM and 300 wh/mi in winter on Aero’s. Performance Stealth.

if a Rim and aTyre weigh a lot less than what you took off, it makes a difference to range, and performance.

 

[mswlogo]

if a Rim and aTyre weigh a lot less than what you took off, it makes a difference to range, and performance.

Negligible on range. Might make 100th of second difference in 0-60.

I put larger, heavier rims, and removed aero covers but put more efficient tires and ended up at the exact same efficiency.

Weight does make a difference and everyone blames that instead of the tire change they made as well. 99% of it, is the tire.

Every OEM wheel has a drastically different performing tires.

In fact Europe (the one you guys are exiting) has nice standards that require efficiency ratings on the tire label. Along with noise etc.

 

[MaDProFF]

Negligible on range. Might make 100th of second difference in 0-60.

I put larger, heavier rims, and removed aero covers but put more efficient tires and ended up at the exact same efficiency.

Weight does make a difference and everyone blames that instead of the tire change they made as well. 99% of it, is the tire.

Every OEM wheel has a drastically different performing tires.

In fact Europe (the one you guys are exiting) has nice standards that require efficiency ratings on the tire label. Along with noise etc.

You carry on thinking that, it makes no difference to me, there are facts out there, go look and read all about it.

 

[mswlogo]

You carry on thinking that, it makes no difference to me, there are facts out there, go look and read all about it.

Ditto

lifetime on Performance with 19” OEM wheels 230 wh/mi. I won’t mention what the tire was though because you know the rim size and weight, and that’s all you need.

 

[Adopado]

In fact Europe (the one you guys are exiting) has nice standards that require efficiency ratings on the tire label. Along with noise etc.

We know that because we are here ... and we see those labels on the tyres we buy. By the way all European rules stay the same even for UK leaving EU unless we specifically decide to change them, which in this instance seems unlikely.

 

[VanillaAir_UK]

Just witnessed -35Wh/mile on screen about 3/4 mile into trip. Didn't last long, soon upped to 34Wh/mile. About 1/2 of trip by then was downhill. Ended up at (TeslaFi) 258Wh/mile for a 4 mile journey, heater on 19C/2/AC, 11C outside. So nice to be reminded of warmer temperature benefits.