Range Loss Over Time, What Can Be Expected, Efficiency, How to Maintain Battery Health

[BMWM3Man]

Some real world. We got a standard range plus in September and my wife has driven it from home to work consistently for five days a week since then.

One way of 22 miles is almost always 9 to 10%. So round-trip brings her home at 80%. We have the LFP battery so we charge to 100% always when charging.

My M3 LR will be here in a week or two… Wish it had LFP.

 

[CheapBastid]

22 miles is almost always 9 to 10%. So round-trip brings her home at 80%

If my math is right the new SR+ is giving you 220miles as opposed to the listed 253 which seems to be 87% of the advertised.

I would not be freaking out if I was closer to 90% rather than what appears to be 64%

 

[Birdsfan]

If my math is right the new SR+ is giving you 220miles as opposed to the listed 253 which seems to be 87% of the advertised.

I would not be freaking out if I was closer to 90% rather than what appears to be 64%

Your thread just got moved so you'll have 200 pages worth of examples to sift through SomeJoe7777 is correct, don't worry about this yet, give your battery a chance to break in and calculate then go for a long drive, you'll be happy.

 

[BMWM3Man]

If my math is right the new SR+ is giving you 220miles as opposed to the listed 253 which seems to be 87% of the advertised.

I would not be freaking out if I was closer to 90% rather than what appears to be 64%

This is exactly what I expected… Stop and go traffic in Atlanta is crazy and then the high speeds in PeachPass lane. It’s called real world.

NONE of my gas powered cars got what the advertised mpg and no one seems to mention this…

Also it’s significantly better obviously on longer trips to Savannah etc.

Finally it’s a commuter car and we charge it at home twice a week… It’s beyond perfect.

Finally I don’t “freak out” ever.

 

[Tam]

...very little range...

You are missing the point. It is possible to get the full 358 miles as advertised but you need to do exactly like how the EPA tested the car in its laboratory.

That means you can also beat the EPA numbers if you know how to control the factors that affect the mileage.

My 2012 Model S was rated at 265 miles but hypermilers were able to drive 550 miles in just one single charge.

I myself was able to beat the EPA number and drive more than 265 miles too. It's very easy: It only takes some disciplines and controls of the factors.

Here's the table of my old Model S 85 at its age of 83,000 miles in odometer rated at 265 but I drove 274.31 miles in one single charge and still had 17% left to run more:

But my goal is to enjoy my car even if that means I only get 1/2 out of EPA range because that the price to break free from the disciplines and the strict factors of EPA laboratory and it is worth it.

Please read Tesla's tips:

Range Tips | Tesla Support

Your Tesla vehicle continuously monitors its energy level and proximity to known charging locations to provide range assurance. To maximize efficiency, it is important to know the factors that impact range and the recommended ways to reduce energy consumption.

www.tesla.com

From TeslaFi.com:

 

[CheapBastid]

Your thread just got moved so you'll have 200 pages worth of examples to sift through SomeJoe7777 is correct, don't worry about this yet, give your battery a chance to break in and calculate then go for a long drive, you'll be happy.

I had opened it (and titled it) to get specific 2022 M3LR data, and not have to sift through 200 pages, but I understand why you moved it.

 

[CheapBastid]

This is exactly what I expected

You expected to get less than 200 miles with your new car, but you got 220+, so I'm glad you were pleasantly surprised.
That is not my experience.

 

[CheapBastid]

It is possible

I understand that if I draft behind a truck downhill both ways it is possible for me to get extraordinary range benefits.
I (again) am concerned that real world numbers are going to be less than 2/3 of the advertised mileage.

 

[Tam]

...real world numbers...

Just like how to pass the Safety Score in order to get FSD beta.

My real-world driving number for my Model X is 89 out of 100. But I paid attention to all the factors and I stop driving as if it's the "real world" for my Model 3 and I passed easily with the flying color of 100.

But that 100 scores came with a cost: I was driving like a student driver and in a lot of stress, on pins and needles for all that time.

That's the same with matching EPA numbers. If you want "real world" numbers, EPA numbers are laboratory numbers so don't sweat it.

 

[conv90]

Just picked up my 2022 M3LR today. When I picked it up it had a charge showing of 72% with 8 miles on the odometer. When I got home (16 miles later) I was surprised to see only 65% left. I drove on some streets, but did a good stretch on the freeway (what I'd consider my typical driving pattern).
If I did the math right, it appears I burned 7% in 16 miles
If I'm extrapolating right (times 14.29) that would only give my 2022 M3LR a range of 228.64 miles at 100%.
That seems low to me, can anyone else weigh in on their 'actual' mileage experience vs. Tesla's 'published' mileage?

You can't judge the total range nor the efficiency from the very first miles done expecially if ONLY 16 miles.
Probably you used also the brakes and you really don't know what means using the brakes.

 

[CheapBastid]

Probably you used also the brakes

FYI - I've watched hundreds of videos in the 50 days since ordering along with doing a test drive on an M3. I used one-pedal-driving and regen braking on my drive home.
Again: I am looking for feedback from 2022 M3LR owners on their range experience.

 

[siggyfreud]

Hey all,

Long story short, for years now my mom insists on not keeping her Model 3 LR plugged in. She lives in a home, parks in a garage, and I put a level 2 charger in it for her to use. About once to twice a year she says "so and so says it's bad to plug in your Tesla every day." I reply by showing her the car's manual, Tesla's official statement on their site, and various articles from battery chemists (some Tesla, some not) that say charging to 70-80% regularly is just fine.

Today she had to talk with Tesla to get an estimate on a repair when a visiting family member drove it over a curb. During that call apparently the Tesla tech told her not to charge it each night, and to only charge it up to what she needs each day. She drives about 55 miles each day, so she emailed me saying she's going to charge it to 60 miles the days she works. At this point, I think she just wants to be argumentative and is looking for opinions that differ from what I think is correct.

Now, if I'm wrong on this one I have no problem telling her otherwise, but I think the advice she was given was incorrect, and in fact, dangerous, given that she will have almost zero contingency range.

Any other resources out there that can either confirm or deny her Tesla tech's advice? This is as much a post to vent as it is for advice, so apologies in advance. At this point I just want to tell her it's her car, and I'll happily text her a link to download Uber when she gets stranded.

 

[RayK]

I'm afraid that if she does not believe Tesla's owner manual, web site and other internet resources which suggest that a plugged-in Tesla set to charge to a maximum of 80% is a happy Tesla, then your Uber link is about all you can do.

On the other hand, ask her what she did with all of the ICE vehicles she has owned / driven in her life. Ask if she only kept enough gas in the tank for her to go on her daily trips and went to the gas station every day. That might be enough to jog her (dis)belief.

 

[jjrandorin]

Hey all,

Long story short, for years now my mom insists on not keeping her Model 3 LR plugged in. She lives in a home, parks in a garage, and I put a level 2 charger in it for her to use. About once to twice a year she says "so and so says it's bad to plug in your Tesla every day." I reply by showing her the car's manual, Tesla's official statement on their site, and various articles from battery chemists (some Tesla, some not) that say charging to 70-80% regularly is just fine.

Today she had to talk with Tesla to get an estimate on a repair when a visiting family member drove it over a curb. During that call apparently the Tesla tech told her not to charge it each night, and to only charge it up to what she needs each day. She drives about 55 miles each day, so she emailed me saying she's going to charge it to 60 miles the days she works. At this point, I think she just wants to be argumentative and is looking for opinions that differ from what I think is correct.

Now, if I'm wrong on this one I have no problem telling her otherwise, but I think the advice she was given was incorrect, and in fact, dangerous, given that she will have almost zero contingency range.

Any other resources out there that can either confirm or deny her Tesla tech's advice? This is as much a post to vent as it is for advice, so apologies in advance. At this point I just want to tell her it's her car, and I'll happily text her a link to download Uber when she gets stranded.

You stated you have shown her the manual.

I happen to be a believer in personal accountability. In the end, its going to be hard for someone to get their parents to do something that they dont want to do, for some reason. Maybe this would be considered mean, but if it were me, I would say something like:

"Ok, mom, you are an adult and obviously can make your own decisions. I am choosing to go with what is displayed in the manual, over what a random technician says, unless that technician is willing to put that recommendation in writing on Tesla letterhead, like the instructions in the manual are.

Since you want to go with the tesla technician recommendation, that is something you can certainly do, but any ramifications of that decision are on you as well. Lets stop talking about that, since we disagree on it."

Basically, She needs to own that decision, and you have done everything you could. I would then let it go. Its her car, after all.

 

[Apprunner]

To be frank, I don't see much evidence that a plugged in Tesla has any more/less degradation than one that isn't plugged in everyday. I don't plug in everyday and charge to ~55% and most of the life of my car has been less than 70% SOC and my range after nearly 30k miles is 290 on a full charge. So I've seen about 6-7% of degradation...would I have less degradation if I charged to 80% everyday? Doubt it. I don't think she is doing any sort of damage to her car at all.

 

[Candleflame]

To be frank, I don't see much evidence that a plugged in Tesla has any more/less degradation than one that isn't plugged in everyday. I don't plug in everyday and charge to ~55% and most of the life of my car has been less than 70% SOC and my range after nearly 30k miles is 290 on a full charge. So I've seen about 6-7% of degradation...would I have less degradation if I charged to 80% everyday? Doubt it. I don't think she is doing any sort of damage to her car at all.

Plugging it in advice is largely to reduce cycling burden and to use the wallcharger for preheating.

 

[Dave EV]

Hey all,

Long story short, for years now my mom insists on not keeping her Model 3 LR plugged in. She lives in a home, parks in a garage, and I put a level 2 charger in it for her to use. About once to twice a year she says "so and so says it's bad to plug in your Tesla every day." I reply by showing her the car's manual, Tesla's official statement on their site, and various articles from battery chemists (some Tesla, some not) that say charging to 70-80% regularly is just fine.

Today she had to talk with Tesla to get an estimate on a repair when a visiting family member drove it over a curb. During that call apparently the Tesla tech told her not to charge it each night, and to only charge it up to what she needs each day. She drives about 55 miles each day, so she emailed me saying she's going to charge it to 60 miles the days she works. At this point, I think she just wants to be argumentative and is looking for opinions that differ from what I think is correct.

Now, if I'm wrong on this one I have no problem telling her otherwise, but I think the advice she was given was incorrect, and in fact, dangerous, given that she will have almost zero contingency range.

Any other resources out there that can either confirm or deny her Tesla tech's advice? This is as much a post to vent as it is for advice, so apologies in advance. At this point I just want to tell her it's her car, and I'll happily text her a link to download Uber when she gets stranded.

If you've been reading this thread, you'd find that lowering the average SOC the car sits at is most likely far more important than any cycling wear induced on the pack. And keeping the car plugged in doesn't do any extra conditioning of the battery or anything - it just ensures that it's charged up to whatever charge limit you have set up at the scheduled time.

If she drives 55 miles / day, the best thing to do would be to charge to 50-55% every day and your average SOC would be well under 50%. But if she charges to say 90% and probably does this every 2-3 days or so, the average SOC will probably be 60% or so she probably charges around 25-35%, I would guess.

Plugging it in advice is largely to reduce cycling burden and to use the wallcharger for preheating.

Yeah, but cycling burden largely doesn't matter - the car sits around 95% of the time. The cycle life test you see cycle the batteries as fast as possible. Shallow cycles at lower average states of charge are the best for longevity. Tesla simply recommends leaving it plugged in because it's the easiest way to ensure that people don't complain about not having range when they need it.

 

[siggyfreud]

I don't really care if she plugs in every night or not. My main concern is that now she's fixated on only charging to what she thinks she needs, as she believes she's doing harm to the battery if not.

Her traditional behavior was to charge it to 80%, drive it down to 20-30%, and then charge. I said this is likely worse than just charging to 70-80% each day.

But now, thinking that it's best to only charge to her needs means she thinks she should charge to 20% each day and drive it down from there.

 

[Apprunner]

I don't really care if she plugs in every night or not. My main concern is that now she's fixated on only charging to what she thinks she needs, as she believes she's doing harm to the battery if not.

Her traditional behavior was to charge it to 80%, drive it down to 20-30%, and then charge. I said this is likely worse than just charging to 70-80% each day.

But now, thinking that it's best to only charge to her needs means she thinks she should charge to 20% each day and drive it down from there.

Reading through the battery threads, the practice that has yielded the best lab results has been to charge around ~50-60% and to plug in each night. Shallow cycles in the lower part of the battery will yield the lowest degradation.

Of course the real answer is to do whats most convenient for your use case. If i have a standard day, I charge to 55% and i'll get down to 20% at most. If i know I have a busy day, I charge higher and don't stress over it. Same with road trips. In the end, it doesn't matter that much as the car was designed for these multiple use cases.

 

[KenC]

Hey all,

Long story short, for years now my mom insists on not keeping her Model 3 LR plugged in. She lives in a home, parks in a garage, and I put a level 2 charger in it for her to use. About once to twice a year she says "so and so says it's bad to plug in your Tesla every day." I reply by showing her the car's manual, Tesla's official statement on their site, and various articles from battery chemists (some Tesla, some not) that say charging to 70-80% regularly is just fine.

Today she had to talk with Tesla to get an estimate on a repair when a visiting family member drove it over a curb. During that call apparently the Tesla tech told her not to charge it each night, and to only charge it up to what she needs each day. She drives about 55 miles each day, so she emailed me saying she's going to charge it to 60 miles the days she works. At this point, I think she just wants to be argumentative and is looking for opinions that differ from what I think is correct.

Now, if I'm wrong on this one I have no problem telling her otherwise, but I think the advice she was given was incorrect, and in fact, dangerous, given that she will have almost zero contingency range.

Any other resources out there that can either confirm or deny her Tesla tech's advice? This is as much a post to vent as it is for advice, so apologies in advance. At this point I just want to tell her it's her car, and I'll happily text her a link to download Uber when she gets stranded.

At a minimum her buffer needs to be more than 5 miles of range. And, a mile driven by your mom in Winter, isn't the same as an EPA-rated mile on a test track in mild weather.

And, is your mom completely sure she understood the tech correctly? I think it would be reasonable to tell someone to set their SOC at a level, where the commute is centered around 50%. So, 60% to 40% for a 55 mile commute, like your mom's.

As many know, my 2018 LR-AWD came with 310 EPA-rated miles of range, and it still has about 310 rated miles of range after over 3yrs and about 31k miles driven. I keep it at 60% SOC and plugged in all the time.