Dragetreneren
Member
Can you describe the problem with Bilstein shocks in detail? What part are you referring to that "come loose"?
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Mhoepfin
Member
It’s the bladder inside the shock vibrating against the structure of the shock itself. Sorry I don’t still have links to this but easily google-able. Sounds like maybe Tesla changed suppliers or the supplier may have changed the design. Can’t imagine how annoying this is with a silent car hearing that rattle.
I have a interesting situation, I had this noise in the suspension from when the car was about 4 months ( 2017 Oct build model S). I had it diagnosed at the SC in April 2018 and send to engineering. A raised the issue in this year January annual service and it was confirm with a test drive. However the technician suggested this was a brace issue as oppose to strut and told me about a difference in noise between the two. However he mentioned they will first fix the brace and check for the strut noise. He said they have TSB for both. Anyway I am schedule to have it fix later this month except the noise went away a month ago and I can't reproduce it. My noise was exactly like in the video in this thread, every technician that drove with me noticed it without issues pretty much in the parking lot of tesla (the rattle was loud enough that the technician said directly that this is the suspension rattle that this forum reference too). It was easy to notice it every morning on my drive to work but now nothing but now is gone. I am been driving with the radio off for the past couple of days and nothing (I could notice the noise when listening to songs with low volume or when listening to audio books). For reference I have about 13.5k miles now, nothing was done to the suspension by tesla that I know and the rattle went away about two weeks after this year maintenance.
I did raise suspension many times over the past month. I suspected better weather but it was warmer only in the past 4 or 5 days here and the noise was gone for the last ski trip as well.
I did raise suspension many times over the past month. I suspected better weather but it was warmer only in the past 4 or 5 days here and the noise was gone for the last ski trip as well.
My appointment is next week and without noise don't make much sense to go. Have any of you experienced a period when the rattle was gone like this for a period of time only to comeback later?
Art VandeIay
Attractive Membrane
I just came back from the Service Center where I had a terrible experience regarding the rattle noise from my front air suspension. 
I took my January 2017 S 90D with 21 inch Arachnid wheels to its annual service in February, and I mentioned the rattle to the Service Advisor, who said they were "well aware of the situation" and requested my authorisation to order the 77-C's with my VIN number as requested by "the engineering team at Fremont".
Last week I got a call saying that the 77-C's and the Enhanced Anti-theft System I ordered where both ready to be installed, so I took my Model S to the Service Center and upon picking up my car, I was told that they installed the 77-C's but took the car out for a quick test drive and found the car "behaved the same with the new installed parts" so they took them out and returned my car with its original parts, as they "could not justify the installation of the 77-C's to Fremont" since my car "behaved the same with and without the 77-C's"...
I wasn't even able to try the 77-C's and they are now saying the rattle noise coming from the front suspension of my Model S is "normal" for all vehicles with air suspension and even worse on vehicles with 21 inch wheels...
I couldn't believe what I was told, they even gave me the "We don't want you to be upset over this, so we are escalating the issue with the engineering team at Fremont in order for them to deal with your car's situation".
I've had this rattle since the first few months of ownership, and none of the three loaners I have used over the life of my Model S have displayed this same situation over the exact same road conditions, since my Home-Work-Home trips are always the same.
What should I do? I'm very upset by the situation...
I took my January 2017 S 90D with 21 inch Arachnid wheels to its annual service in February, and I mentioned the rattle to the Service Advisor, who said they were "well aware of the situation" and requested my authorisation to order the 77-C's with my VIN number as requested by "the engineering team at Fremont".
Last week I got a call saying that the 77-C's and the Enhanced Anti-theft System I ordered where both ready to be installed, so I took my Model S to the Service Center and upon picking up my car, I was told that they installed the 77-C's but took the car out for a quick test drive and found the car "behaved the same with the new installed parts" so they took them out and returned my car with its original parts, as they "could not justify the installation of the 77-C's to Fremont" since my car "behaved the same with and without the 77-C's"...
I wasn't even able to try the 77-C's
and they are now saying the rattle noise coming from the front suspension of my Model S is "normal" for all vehicles with air suspension and even worse on vehicles with 21 inch wheels...I couldn't believe what I was told, they even gave me the "We don't want you to be upset over this, so we are escalating the issue with the engineering team at Fremont in order for them to deal with your car's situation".
I've had this rattle since the first few months of ownership, and none of the three loaners I have used over the life of my Model S have displayed this same situation over the exact same road conditions, since my Home-Work-Home trips are always the same.
What should I do? I'm very upset by the situation...
I've had this rattle since the first few months of ownership, and none of the three loaners I have used over the life of my Model S have displayed this same situation over the exact same road conditions, since my Home-Work-Home trips are always the same.
What should I do? I'm very upset by the situation...
Have they checked the other TSBs that Tesla references that can cause rattles? (I think the steering rack is one of the things that can cause a similar noise.)
Art VandeIay
Attractive Membrane
Hey @MP3Mike, thanks for the replay.
They did mention that the steering rack could be a possible culprit of the rattle, but I'm not quite sure it really is...
Obviously I'm no expert in the matter, but I would have really appreciated if I could have been present during the test drive alongside the Tesla mechanic, instead of just picking up my car and finding out the rattle "is normal" but only because I'm upset, they will escalate the issue with the Fremont engineering team
...I'm not looking for free suspension parts, I just want my car to get fixed... if the 77-C's are not the solution, great, but don't tell me the rattle is in accordance with the manufacturer specs, this is just BS, as we can all read from the now 48 pages in this thread...
Sorry, for the long post, I'm just venting my frustration!
[Rant over]
aesculus
Still Trying to Figure This All Out
Ask them about the sway bar fix above in post 928 and have them do an extensive test with the "chassis ears" to pinpoint the source of the noise. They are obviously just trying things out at this point.
Dragetreneren
Member
Dragetreneren
Member
I just came back from the Service Center where I had a terrible experience regarding the rattle noise from my front air suspension.
I took my January 2017 S 90D with 21 inch Arachnid wheels to its annual service in February, and I mentioned the rattle to the Service Advisor, who said they were "well aware of the situation" and requested my authorisation to order the 77-C's with my VIN number as requested by "the engineering team at Fremont".
Last week I got a call saying that the 77-C's and the Enhanced Anti-theft System I ordered where both ready to be installed, so I took my Model S to the Service Center and upon picking up my car, I was told that they installed the 77-C's but took the car out for a quick test drive and found the car "behaved the same with the new installed parts" so they took them out and returned my car with its original parts, as they "could not justify the installation of the 77-C's to Fremont" since my car "behaved the same with and without the 77-C's"...
I wasn't even able to try the 77-C's
I couldn't believe what I was told, they even gave me the "We don't want you to be upset over this, so we are escalating the issue with the engineering team at Fremont in order for them to deal with your car's situation".
I've had this rattle since the first few months of ownership, and none of the three loaners I have used over the life of my Model S have displayed this same situation over the exact same road conditions, since my Home-Work-Home trips are always the same.
What should I do? I'm very upset by the situation...
Well, without knowing what is the issue that you experience with you vehicle I can just share general thoughts. There are few factors to consider:
1. Consumer law:
- How many attempts can Service Center do?
- How much time is allowed for rectification?
2. What independent experts mean about the issue?
3. Whether Tesla is willing to do the repair.
4. How long are you willing to wait (if it is not a safety issue)?
5. The question about "How serious the defect is" is the most interesting. But in case it is not unique to your vehicle, not "normal" (according to experts) and it has taken significant time to find a solution without positive outcome you can stress the fact that the defect implies unforseen risks when you will try to sell your vehicle. Provided that you are obliged to inform the potential buyer about the defect.
If Tesla is not cooperative then you are obviously NOT in the same boat with them. Then you might consider to find people who experience same issue to on-board in your case. It might be easier to address any issue together- whether that is Tesla or other owners in same situation. Together there is a higher chance of finding a solution.
I hope you do not have to seek help with legal council. Lawsuits are stressful, imply costs and give negative spinn-offs to Tesla. But if you know you are right and there is absolutely no other way you can resolve your situation then it is the lawsuit. Cannot do much about it. Do what you consider is right.
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So I have just read through the last 15 pages or so and it seems many think this rattling/knocking sound only applies to facelifted cars starting from 2016.
I can however confirm that my Dec 2015 Model S 85D with air suspension and 21" Turbines have the exact same issue. I (and the SC) had kind of given up on the issue, but I thought I'd chime in any way. I live in Denmark btw.
For me the sound is very clear and consistent when driving on uneven cobble roads like this type: https://d2ev1gaou5sisr.cloudfront.n...ne-cobblessetts-yorkshire-stone-cobbles-2.jpg
In fact it is only on this type of road I really notice it (and become annoyed/concerned).
The issue only started about 1.5 years after I got my car. I drive very little, so maybe after 16,000 km / 10,000 mi. During this time I did change the suspension height from time to time, but certainly not as frequently as I subsequently did (daily). So maybe, as some in this thread are indicating, changing your air suspension height, will cause the issue over time. Nowadays, I drive in low maybe 50% of the time.
About a year ago the SC had my car for weeks and subsequently replaced a ton of suspension parts at the drivers side such as:
- Upper control arm
- Steering rack
- Hub and bearing
- FRONT AIR SPRING MODULE - DM (1030608-00-C)
This seemed to lessen the sound ever so slightly at first (by maybe 50%%), but after a day of driving it was back in full force. The SC said they had tested many of their loaners and that they had the same issue and they basically did not know what to do. They tried diligently, but basically we agreed to leave it as a "concern" in my customer record. I have not raised this issue further and while it's a poor/unacceptable solution I simply avoid driving on cobblestone roads as much as possible. Quite a PITA however, as I live in a town where there is a 2 km stretch of cobble road that I have to avoid almost every day.
In my case, the sound becomes slightly louder and more distinct, if I put it in low, instead of standard height. Again only when driving on very uneven roads, like cobblestone. On a perhaps related note my suspension height is exercised daily as I change between standard and low frequently. I very rarely set it to high or very high, unless I need to change the wheels or do a brake cleaning job.
The sound is also slightly louder on my 21" summer tires (staggered 245/35 front and 265/35 rear) than on my 21" winter tires (245/35 on all wheels). I am guessing this is because my winter tires have a lot of thread + the rubber is softer and more absorbing, thus causing reduced stress/shocks to the suspension.
Unfortunately I don't have a solution for you, but wanted to confirm that nosecone/pre-facelifted cars can have the same issue. Even with the old air spring modules.
BTW, on several occasions I asked them to check the sway bar links, just in case. I had read that some Model S owners had successfully eliminated front suspension knocking by replacing the links and I know this is a common car issue in general. But maybe that was a different issue from the rattling/knocking sound we are addressing in this thread. In any case, the technicians said the links were not the culprit. That would have been an easy fix though.
I will be following this thread in the hope that a solution is found before my warranty is up in December. Good luck to all.
I can however confirm that my Dec 2015 Model S 85D with air suspension and 21" Turbines have the exact same issue. I (and the SC) had kind of given up on the issue, but I thought I'd chime in any way. I live in Denmark btw.
For me the sound is very clear and consistent when driving on uneven cobble roads like this type: https://d2ev1gaou5sisr.cloudfront.n...ne-cobblessetts-yorkshire-stone-cobbles-2.jpg
In fact it is only on this type of road I really notice it (and become annoyed/concerned).
The issue only started about 1.5 years after I got my car. I drive very little, so maybe after 16,000 km / 10,000 mi. During this time I did change the suspension height from time to time, but certainly not as frequently as I subsequently did (daily). So maybe, as some in this thread are indicating, changing your air suspension height, will cause the issue over time. Nowadays, I drive in low maybe 50% of the time.
About a year ago the SC had my car for weeks and subsequently replaced a ton of suspension parts at the drivers side such as:
- Upper control arm
- Steering rack
- Hub and bearing
- FRONT AIR SPRING MODULE - DM (1030608-00-C)
This seemed to lessen the sound ever so slightly at first (by maybe 50%%), but after a day of driving it was back in full force. The SC said they had tested many of their loaners and that they had the same issue and they basically did not know what to do. They tried diligently, but basically we agreed to leave it as a "concern" in my customer record. I have not raised this issue further and while it's a poor/unacceptable solution I simply avoid driving on cobblestone roads as much as possible. Quite a PITA however, as I live in a town where there is a 2 km stretch of cobble road that I have to avoid almost every day.
In my case, the sound becomes slightly louder and more distinct, if I put it in low, instead of standard height. Again only when driving on very uneven roads, like cobblestone. On a perhaps related note my suspension height is exercised daily as I change between standard and low frequently. I very rarely set it to high or very high, unless I need to change the wheels or do a brake cleaning job.
The sound is also slightly louder on my 21" summer tires (staggered 245/35 front and 265/35 rear) than on my 21" winter tires (245/35 on all wheels). I am guessing this is because my winter tires have a lot of thread + the rubber is softer and more absorbing, thus causing reduced stress/shocks to the suspension.
Unfortunately I don't have a solution for you, but wanted to confirm that nosecone/pre-facelifted cars can have the same issue. Even with the old air spring modules.
BTW, on several occasions I asked them to check the sway bar links, just in case. I had read that some Model S owners had successfully eliminated front suspension knocking by replacing the links and I know this is a common car issue in general. But maybe that was a different issue from the rattling/knocking sound we are addressing in this thread. In any case, the technicians said the links were not the culprit. That would have been an easy fix though.
I will be following this thread in the hope that a solution is found before my warranty is up in December. Good luck to all.
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Dragetreneren
Member
The source of the noise can easily be established with chassis ears. If your SC has not done that type of diagnostics during all these visits then I cannot understand how their efforts can be considered exhausted.
They used chassis ears. But as I see it that is not the point. Judging from my case and that of many others, Tesla doesn't seem to have issues locating the noise. What they clearly have issues with, is finding a solution to the noise. Based on what I have read thus far, this seems to be apparent for most cases.
Dragetreneren
Member
Where the noise was located?
You might be in luck with repair of defect on your vehicle if you dare to ask these guys: http://www.fleslandauto.no
For what it's worth, my March 2018 Model S suddenly began to make "rattle" like sounds when driving. Even the slightest bump in the road triggered the noise. It was like two metal parts banged together. Like someone forgot his wrench somewhere in the drivetrain and it was banging around. Perfectly new asphalt was the only road type that could make it stop.
I drove to Service Center, and well, long story short.. They replaced: "AIR SPRING MODULE FR - MS2 DM (1067361-77-C)", quantity 2.
All noises are gone! I was told the old air springs would go back to Fremont for investigation.
I drove to Service Center, and well, long story short.. They replaced: "AIR SPRING MODULE FR - MS2 DM (1067361-77-C)", quantity 2.
All noises are gone! I was told the old air springs would go back to Fremont for investigation.
Mhoepfin
Member
As I mentioned in previous comment, this is 100% faulty air spring related to the bladder inside the shock rattling around. Only fix is to get the air springs replaced and hope the new air springs dont start making the same noise again. Been there, done that. Most of these are made by the same company (Continental). Out of warranty there may be some other options with better designs like Arnott.
Dragetreneren
Member
Tesla engineering has been working with this for over a year as far as I am informed. Hard to imagine replacing bladder to an alternative would take so much of engineering. It does not make sense.
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But they are working on it. As can be seen from the changed partnumbers of the airsprings
ishareit
Member
The new air spring modules for my rear wheel drive (1067362-77-B) seem to have eliminated the rattle (or at least made it much better). The driving quality is much better as well. The car feels new again.
Dragetreneren
Member
Good if Tesla does work on it. Your revision is 1067361-77-C. It has become available sometime in the fall 2018. The 77-B is for RWD.
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