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Realist gets Real ;-)

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Tesla people have the order to spend money as fast as they can without burning it.

Problem in Spain in not Tesla, problem is spain's bureaucracy. Same in Italy, France, Portugal ...
Good old Kafka states, where you need a form to get a form.
 
Good to see that the Tesla works out for you.

I can't share your claim that you "can travel anywhere in Europe at a decent pace for free with the Supercharger", though. Despite the huge growth of the network its coverage is still quite limited. There are basically no superchargers along the whole of Europe's Atlantic seaboard. Try travelling to and within Brittany, to give just one example. What about Spain and Italy to the South of Bologna?

it should be 'ok' in 2016
2016.jpg

& Brittany is a small enough area it doesn't need an SC
 
it should be 'ok' in 2016
View attachment 77176
& Brittany is a small enough area it doesn't need an SC

Not really. I suppose you aren't familiar with the place. Brittany on its own is about the size of Belgium and it's 240 km from Rennes to Brest. additionally, when you go on vacation by car you don't want to go straight there and back again, but you want to use the car for extended day trips as well.
 
Not really. I suppose you aren't familiar with the place. Brittany on its own is about the size of Belgium and it's 240 km from Rennes to Brest. additionally, when you go on vacation by car you don't want to go straight there and back again, but you want to use the car for extended day trips as well.

sorry, nope, I have only been to Germany and Austria. I thought it looked doable based on size and distances but might be similar to where I am. Some spots you just can't get to or get back from. I was going to say 'who wants to go to Brittany anyway?' It does look like almost 300km from the SC's to the furthest point of Brittany. Looks like the north west tip of Spain is also void of SC's too
 
This morning I had a BMW i3 right at my side on the Autobahn. He was cruising at app. 100kph in the slipstream of a bus. I smiled at him and blasted away.

All of a sudden in the electric world all that classic principles of designing a vehicle to save weight don't make that much sense anymore. All that matters is the battery capacity and range. Model S ist the only electric car that makes sense in the real world.
 
This morning I had a BMW i3 right at my side on the Autobahn. He was cruising at app. 100kph in the slipstream of a bus. I smiled at him and blasted away.

All of a sudden in the electric world all that classic principles of designing a vehicle to save weight don't make that much sense anymore. All that matters is the battery capacity and range. Model S ist the only electric car that makes sense in the real world.

Indeed, the Model S design is a revelation once one "gets it". (Of course weight etc. can still affect range, energy consumption and thus indirect pollution.)

Congratulations for enjoying that period of concept-shattering change. :) You may never look at cars the same again.
 
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Model S ist the only electric car that makes sense in the real world.

As happy as I am for you to enjoy your Model S (and I certainly enjoyed my test-drive in one last year), that sentence only makes sense if you mean to add "..as your only car". Because an i3 or an e-Golf also makes a lot of sense - if it is intended as a daily short distance driver like most secondary cars are. For my needs for example, such a BEV would make sense for more than 99% of my driving.
 
Make sense on what criteria?
Finance? Nope.
Fun to drive? In the city? Nope.
Good looks? Nope.
What else?

All of a sudden in the electric world all that classic principles of designing a vehicle to save weight don't make that much sense anymore. All that matters is the battery capacity and range. Model S ist the only electric car that makes sense in the real world.
Some see the light sooner, others later. Some never ;)
Weight might save/add 10% of range, a bigger battery will triple it.
 
.... Because an i3 or an e-Golf also makes a lot of sense - if it is intended as a daily short distance driver like most secondary cars are. For my needs for example, such a BEV would make sense for more than 99% of my driving.

Exactly. Not much fun to drive a car of the Tesla's size in the city, least of all in European parking garages. One might even say that the i3 is more adapted to being a commuter car than the Tesla is to being a luxury motorway cruiser. Everyone should decide what fits his personal requirements best, though.
 
+1

Granted, Model S has the most range of any BEV at the moment (and surely for quite some time to come), but fun to drive in the city? Certainly not, at least not in European cities. It is too large for comfort. An e-Golf or an i3 is a zippy and handy car that does make city driving fun, yet is also practical enough to find a parking space almost anywhere. Try that with a Model S over here. You will have as much fun with that trying to make your way through a parking garage as JC and James May had in London with their Merc S 600 "Grosser" and RR Corniche respectively.

And good looks? Well, beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder, remember. Many people find a Golf very attractive (and I have heard there are even some that fall for the i3... ;-) )
 
About city driving.....

I'd have no issue were this discussion to be using comparatives like "less fun than..." or "more fun than...", but for anyone to call any vehicle "fun" to drive in a city is, to me, utterly misleading.

Or, I suppose I could be a nanny and say "if you're having fun driving a car in a city, you should be shot". :tongue:
 
About city driving.....

I'd have no issue were this discussion to be using comparatives like "less fun than..." or "more fun than...", but for anyone to call any vehicle "fun" to drive in a city is, to me, utterly misleading.

Or, I suppose I could be a nanny and say "if you're having fun driving a car in a city, you should be shot". :tongue:
I agree that city driving is anything but fun in any car. However, a small car like my recently replaced Fiat 500 makes it easy to squeeze into small traffic lanes and small parking spots.
 
P85D ... Even if the top speed is now 155 mph (I have 6.2. but unfortunately did not have the location to test)
My understanding is that Tesla "temporarily overpromised" this as part of 6.2 when, in reality, it did not make it.

- - - Updated - - -

Model S is the only electric car that makes sense in the real world.
Considering the source, this is one impressive tag line.
 
This morning I had a BMW i3 right at my side on the Autobahn. He was cruising at app. 100kph in the slipstream of a bus. I smiled at him and blasted away.

All of a sudden in the electric world all that classic principles of designing a vehicle to save weight don't make that much sense anymore. All that matters is the battery capacity and range. Model S ist the only electric car that makes sense in the real world.

See. We weren't wrong after all:). Glad you are enjoying it. Still surprised you bought one but glad you did. It definitely isn't the perfect Autobahn car but sounds like it gets most of the way there.
 
Not really. I suppose you aren't familiar with the place. Brittany on its own is about the size of Belgium and it's 240 km from Rennes to Brest. additionally, when you go on vacation by car you don't want to go straight there and back again, but you want to use the car for extended day trips as well.

I get it, I do. It is the same issue we have in the US. It takes time to build this stuff out. There is a LOT you CAN get to right now and even if you can't get where you would like to go that one time a year, there are many other great places you could go instead.

The example I can give is from my own personal experience. The ONE place I REALLY want to get to I can't. Which is middle-of-nowhere Ohio (near the WV side). But, in the same sense I have made 4 road trips all but one of which was to places I had never been and all of them were for reasons that would have needed a TON more justification otherwise.

And it isn't like it won't ever come. I should hypothetically be able to make it where I want to go sometime next year (assuming they stick to their current plans) and I am OK with that.

If I REALLY was despairate to go, I could rent a car. But I wouldn't trade the past 24k miles over the past year of awesome driving just for that one weekend trip I would have made once... Maybe... Over that same year.

If what is stopping you is that one RoadTrip you might not even make, don't. You will be able to be there sooner or later it is a matter of time. In the meantime you are passing up something truly awesome. And don't just take my word for it. Realist, one of the biggest naysayers on the car has changed his tune completely and that is more powerful than I could ever be.
 
About city driving.....

I'd have no issue were this discussion to be using comparatives like "less fun than..." or "more fun than...", but for anyone to call any vehicle "fun" to drive in a city is, to me, utterly misleading.

Or, I suppose I could be a nanny and say "if you're having fun driving a car in a city, you should be shot". :tongue:
So shoot me then.

The reason a small car like the Fiat or i3 is fun in the city, is because it can squeeze places others can't, and dart around stuff too. The i3's turning radius is insane. So when that darn delivery truck just stops in the road and starts unloading, instead of having to wait I can easily pull a u-turn, while the M3 behind me cannot. All that HP and he cannot use it. THAT's what makes it fun!
 
So shoot me then.

The reason a small car like the Fiat or i3 is fun in the city, is because it can squeeze places others can't, and dart around stuff too. The i3's turning radius is insane. So when that darn delivery truck just stops in the road and starts unloading, instead of having to wait I can easily pull a u-turn, while the M3 behind me cannot. All that HP and he cannot use it. THAT's what makes it fun!

+1
Of course there a things that are more fun than driving in a city, but when you have to, doing so in a small, zippy EV is as much fun as you can get.
 
+1

Granted, Model S has the most range of any BEV at the moment (and surely for quite some time to come), but fun to drive in the city? Certainly not, at least not in European cities. It is too large for comfort. An e-Golf or an i3 is a zippy and handy car that does make city driving fun, yet is also practical enough to find a parking space almost anywhere. Try that with a Model S over here. You will have as much fun with that trying to make your way through a parking garage as JC and James May had in London with their Merc S 600 "Grosser" and RR Corniche respectively.

And good looks? Well, beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder, remember. Many people find a Golf very attractive (and I have heard there are even some that fall for the i3... ;-) )

Well I get your point. Still the i3 is a 40.000 € car with less than 130km real range and 150kph topspeed. It’s a nice concept but to me it is just not a real car.
Model S handles quite nicely around town. Turning circle is fine, obviously it is a lot more usable than the i8. Comfort, Space, and drivetrain refinement are excellent, almost impossible to beat.
On the Autobahn the car sees it’s 240kw limit very quickly after 1km or so but even with that power you can go 200kph with ease. It will hit 250kph in that mode as well once Tesla allows me to do so.
 
I get it, I do. It is the same issue we have in the US. It takes time to build this stuff out. There is a LOT you CAN get to right now and even if you can't get where you would like to go that one time a year, there are many other great places you could go instead.

The example I can give is from my own personal experience. The ONE place I REALLY want to get to I can't. Which is middle-of-nowhere Ohio (near the WV side). But, in the same sense I have made 4 road trips all but one of which was to places I had never been and all of them were for reasons that would have needed a TON more justification otherwise.

And it isn't like it won't ever come. I should hypothetically be able to make it where I want to go sometime next year (assuming they stick to their current plans) and I am OK with that.

If I REALLY was despairate to go, I could rent a car. But I wouldn't trade the past 24k miles over the past year of awesome driving just for that one weekend trip I would have made once... Maybe... Over that same year.

If what is stopping you is that one RoadTrip you might not even make, don't. You will be able to be there sooner or later it is a matter of time. In the meantime you are passing up something truly awesome. And don't just take my word for it. Realist, one of the biggest naysayers on the car has changed his tune completely and that is more powerful than I could ever be.

I completely agree. And the best part about the ONE place you can't get to is that it is exactly where they will eventually put the Supercharger. For us, the One Place was El Centro, CA, where we have a commercial property. It was really marginal to do a round trip from San Diego. We could have done it, by continuing on to Yuma, AZ, and filling up before the return journey, but that was an extra couple of hours driving. Now there's a supercharger less than a mile away.