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scottf200
Well-Known Member
Likely referring to highspeed driving.
The “derestriction” sign means “now entering unlimited-speed section.” Occasionally, the signs include a number painted behind the lines; 130, for example, indicates the end of the 130-kilometer-per-hour (80 MPH) speed restriction.
Does not seem Model S is built for highspeed for any duration but for getting there quickly. They tried a two-speed tranny right but couldn't get it to work out (too much torque to control I suspect).
Tesla Ditches Its Two-Speed Transmission
by Katie Fehrenbacher
JAN. 24, 2008 - 10:00 AM PDT
http://gigaom.com/2008/01/24/tesla-ditches-its-two-speed-transmission-1/
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I thought Realist was banned for some of his negativity in the stock option/investment threads.
That said, it is good to have people who aren't just fanboys of TSLA the company and stock, as its valuation is insane now (and bubbles can burst... I've seen lots of it, having started investing in 97).... but it can be done w/o being a troll.
dennis
Model S Plaid
Its official. When I go, I want to come back as dennis' son
U adopting??
Full disclosure: The position does come with restrictions. My son is not insured on the Model S or the Mac. So he only gets to drive them in special circumstances like today's test.
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This is what I really love about this forum.
People comparing a Mclaren 12C and a 911 turbo to a Model S.
Funny thing though, both are not really nice handling cars. I have driven the Mclaren in Spa. It’s a head biting beast on the limit with too much power and no limited slip diff. The 911 turbos on the other hand tend to understeer.
If you want a nice handling car take any Lotus, a 911 GT3 or a modern Ferrari. These are pure driver’s cars. They communicate with the pilot and keep their balance even at 10/10s. I don’t think the Model S is anywhere close to these cars. But who would really expect that?
Handling is a very subjective issue. The Model S has a very low center of gravity, the weight distribution is rear biased. It’s a perfect setup. People will drive this car within their own driving limits and appreciate the natural balance. Indeed, it might feel even more agile than a BMW M5. Still this does say very little about how these cars compare over a demanding road if you really give them a stick.
I am sure that on any track on this planet a BMW M5 will run rings around the Model S, eat it for breakfast and spit it out.
But for most people, this doesn’t really matter.
The Model S is of course not a track car, nor does it need to be.
The Model S tries to be the best car ever to maybe 75% of the 1st world population. And 75% of the population doesn't drive on tracks, they don't need to drive 500 miles in one go, they don't live near the auto-bahn, they have access to an electrical outlet near where they park, they don't need to haul a yacht, etc.
It is impossible to make the perfect car for everyone, as everyone have different criteria, but I would say that the Model S is closer to being the perfect car than any car preceding it.
The Model S tries to be the best car ever to maybe 75% of the 1st world population. And 75% of the population doesn't drive on tracks, they don't need to drive 500 miles in one go, they don't live near the auto-bahn, they have access to an electrical outlet near where they park, they don't need to haul a yacht, etc.
It is impossible to make the perfect car for everyone, as everyone have different criteria, but I would say that the Model S is closer to being the perfect car than any car preceding it.
NigelM
Recovering Member
lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
OMG
I think I just read a Realist post I completely agree with. Ah Bill, do not take the bait. If you do another zinger will be a commin.
and I believe NigelM has found the only track comparison that really applies to daily drivers
If you are going to pick one venue to accel (pun intended) I think Telsa picked the right one.
Love Spa http://www.lolachampcar.com/Author.htm
I think I just read a Realist post I completely agree with. Ah Bill, do not take the bait. If you do another zinger will be a commin.
and I believe NigelM has found the only track comparison that really applies to daily drivers
If you are going to pick one venue to accel (pun intended) I think Telsa picked the right one.Love Spa http://www.lolachampcar.com/Author.htm
Yes. The Model S isn't designed to be a track car with its one gear. Since I'll likely never take my car to a track (why do that when you can rent someone's M5 or similar car to trash around a track for a weekend?) that isn't a big deal. For the 99.9999% of the time I'm not on a track the Model S excels at what most drivers want and that's acceleration and handling.
dennis
Model S Plaid
Since the Model S is a road car, not a track car, isn't that exactly what you want? A balanced car that is agile and can be driven fast? Personally, I'm not interested in driving at the limit on public roads. Too many places to hurt yourself and other people.
As for the M5 as a track car, I tracked my 2000 M5 at Laguna Seca and Thunderhill. With stock suspension and tires it was an understeering pig.
BTW @Realist, have you taken a test drive in a P85+?
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mnx
2018 M3P
With all the talk about Tesla building "road cars", I sure wish they build something that doesn't limit power on the track after such a short amount of time. When they do, I'll be the first in line with a deposit. (Assuming it doesn't cost more than a Model S P85).
Unfortunately no. It's not that easy here if you want to have the car for more than just a blast around the street.
I have driven the Roadster however a few years back. I even wrote a blog about it. It's in german of course: http://www.autos-pur.de/fahrberichte/tesla-roadster-sport.html
At that time, I said the Tesla Roadster is a true landmark car. The major bigbang regarding e-mobility.
I still think so today,. Even more so, since I believe the whole concept of a pure electric does make a lot more sense in a lightweight car.
lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
"Unfortunately no."
I too drove a Roadster when they were trying to sell the 400-600 of them that were unsubscribed. Being 6'4" and having owned an Elise Sport 190 I knew (1) I was not going to fit in the Roadster any better than I did the Elise and (2) there was nothing lightweight about the Roadster. Those that enjoy its "excellent" handling have likely not driven a Sport 190 in anger.
Move on a few years and I walk into a service center and see the "skateboard". The engineering is superb and my wife, while looking at the pictures, tells me the car is beautiful. I place my deposit. Six months later, I drive the car and confirm my assessment of the engineering. Model S is NOTHING like the Roadster apart from the Golf Cart like drive system.
Realist,
To be realistic, you really need to drive one before continuing to comment on the car
I too drove a Roadster when they were trying to sell the 400-600 of them that were unsubscribed. Being 6'4" and having owned an Elise Sport 190 I knew (1) I was not going to fit in the Roadster any better than I did the Elise and (2) there was nothing lightweight about the Roadster. Those that enjoy its "excellent" handling have likely not driven a Sport 190 in anger.
Move on a few years and I walk into a service center and see the "skateboard". The engineering is superb and my wife, while looking at the pictures, tells me the car is beautiful. I place my deposit. Six months later, I drive the car and confirm my assessment of the engineering. Model S is NOTHING like the Roadster apart from the Golf Cart like drive system.
Realist,
To be realistic, you really need to drive one before continuing to comment on the car
dennis
Model S Plaid
Realist,
To be realistic, you really need to drive one before continuing to comment on the car
And be sure it is a P85+, since the suspension/tire changes make it a completely different car when it comes to handling.
I don't get it. I was reading your roadster test and there you write "Selbst im Rahmen einer 50 km/h Zone lässt sich hier Fahrfreude erfahren, die mit den trägen lauten Verbrennern absurd erscheint". Quickly translated: "even driving slowly at 30mph the roadster gives so much driving pleasure which seems absurd to get with a sluggish and noisy ICE.
The P85 acceleration is only about 300 msec worse than the roadster and you describe it as "Auto und Fahrer werden subjektiv ungefähr so dramatisch nach vorne gefeuert wie ein Go-Kart mit dem 13 l V8 aus der Weineck Cobra". Meaning "car and driver are catapulted as dramatically forward as having a go cart with a 800 cubic inch V8 of a Weineck Cobra".
And suddenly you describe this as boring ? What happened ?
Any person I talked to so far which heavily criticized the car had two things in common:
1.) They never drove a P85(+)
2.) They could never afford it.
So is your negativity maybe just "Neid der Besitzlosen" ??
I agree however with your statement that the MS is "slow". In prior posts I claimed that the MS will not be a big success in Germany due to the extreme high Autobahn speeds. However on my last visit in June I was more standing in traffic on the Autobahn than driving ! Only on very few occasions I could max out the BMW 1 series I rented. However there is only one tiny country in the world without speed limit. If I would be Tesla, I would not waste millions on trying to add a gear box just for that 0.01 % of buyers who do not buy a MS because of the 130 mph max speed.
I also agree to your statement that one should take a train if serious about saving the planet. This of course is only valid for Europe as here in US trains are the biggest joke.
And last but not least. In my time in Germany I drove 2 Porsche 911, 1 BMW M5, 1 Porsche 928, the first produced Porsche 911 bi turbo and a Mercedes S600 12 Cylinder. I would not trade my Tesla for any of those ! 6 month and 12.000 miles after delivery, it is still the most exciting and fun car I ever drove. PLUS, and this is very important to me, with my money I support a REAL CHANGE of our world. Look at the IAA in Frankfurt. Suddenly hybrids, e cars and alternative drive drains where everywhere. The revolution is already happening and it is mostly due to Tesla that it is happening now and not in 50 years.
The Germans produce cars for 100 years. The MS is Tesla's FIRST own build car. Imagine what future Tesla's will be ! I can't wait to buy my next MS in a couple of years. I am sure it will be an all wheel drive 120KW battery, 650 HP, 0-60 in below 3 seconds car stuffed with the finest interior and all electronic helpers you can think of. Because they already build the best drive ever, they do not need to invest gazillions like standard ICE corporations to create the better engine, add more gears to the now 8 speed gearbox etc. Future enhancements will focus on the few thinks where the German cars are still better.
And it would not surprise me if by then you own a Tesla, even if it is a cheaper Gen 3. Not everybody is ready for it now, but I am sure sooner or later we will all drive one.
medved
Member
BMW M5 is an old, prehistoric piece of crap. And you know why? Because it has stinky, polluting, noisy internal combustion engine.
Joer00, great post. My wife's greatest joy driving the Model S is not at the highest speed, but at about 50 miles per hour in the carpool lane at rush hour, where she can pass the thousands of cars waiting to cross the SF Bay Bridge (with the Model S car pool sticker!). I am not a native speaker of German, so I will give you the English word - "schadenfreude."
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