Rear cross beam a big issue?

[Atari2600]

Wrong! They are not the safest vehicles! Volvo still owns that crown! Tesla don’t even rollover their vehicles to demonstrate roof/pillar strength.

Here is a roof crushing test video. Enjoy.

Roof strength​

Rating applies to 2017-21 models

Tested vehicle: 2019 Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus 4-door

Overall evaluation	G
Curb weight	3,563 lbs
Peak force	20,835 lbs
Strength-to-weight ratio	5.85

 

[rxlawdude]

Here is a roof crushing test video. Enjoy.

Not to mention how hard it is to flip a Tesla due to low COG.

 

[Atari2600]

Not to mention how hard it is to flip a Tesla due to low COG.

Peak force was over 20,000 lbs. This video was from 2019 and it amazes me how people post the comments they do without even using minimal effort to look up the facts that are all over the internet.

 

[TSELA]

Here is a roof crushing test video. Enjoy.

Roof strength​

Rating applies to 2017-21 models

Tested vehicle: 2019 Tesla Model 3 Standard Range Plus 4-door

Overall evaluation	G
Curb weight	3,563 lbs
Peak force	20,835 lbs
Strength-to-weight ratio	5.85

Thanks for the post, I have seen that one. from a structural loading point, this is not the same as a rollover test, where a sudden explosive load is placed onto the roof. Unfortunately, there is a very good reason why Tesla will not perform a rollover test.

 

[TSELA]

Peak force was over 20,000 lbs. This video was from 2019 and it amazes me how people post the comments they do without even using minimal effort to look up the facts that are all over the internet.

It amazes me how closed minded people are, when they buy a Tesla.

 

[TSELA]

Not to mention how hard it is to flip a Tesla due to low COG.

Very true, but Tesla intentionally found the max speed before a rollover will occur and used this speed to demonstrate its lack of rollover stability. Its a cunning Marketing tool which fools the majority.

 

[TSELA]

I love Tesla as much as the next guy, but sometimes the Tesla hats need to be taken and the love goggles removed.
Here is what a true rollover test should look like. For your information the roof and pillar integrity deformed only 6mm. The sunroof glass did not even break, due to the structural integrity. The tesla roof being crushed does not show anything but it crushing under load. If you still think the Tesla is safer, you need to do further research outside of the ancap and nhsta. Remember volvo do this safety stuff for a living and crash their vehicles in every conceivable angle. Enjoy…

 

[Atari2600]

Thanks for the post, I have seen that one. from a structural loading point, this is not the same as a rollover test, where a sudden explosive load is placed onto the roof. Unfortunately, there is a very good reason why Tesla will not perform a rollover test.

If this were a concern I am sure some government or insurance oversight body in the entire world would test for it.

You realize the entire roof is much stronger than just one corner top side which was tested by the IIHS? For which Tesla received the same rating as Volvo. An explosive load would be someone driving their car into the roof or the car falling over a cliff and landing on the roof.

I do not own Tesla stock nor am I a fanboy. All I see are statements with nothing to back them up, That is fan boy behavior.

Did you base your view on a Finite Element Analysis(FEA) in Ansys or SolidWorks or something else? Or did you just randomly pull this out of the air via armchair engineering?

 

[Seminole]

Very true, but Tesla intentionally found the max speed before a rollover will occur and used this speed to demonstrate its lack of rollover stability. Its a cunning Marketing tool which fools the majority.

Thanks for the post, I have seen that one. from a structural loading point, this is not the same as a rollover test, where a sudden explosive load is placed onto the roof. Unfortunately, there is a very good reason why Tesla will not perform a rollover test.

A sustained increasing load is tougher on the car than an “explosive” load. The video you posted of the Volvo rollover, the roof doesn’t even sustain anywhere near the forces the IIHS test exerts on it as evidenced by the Volvos deformation under that test:

In the Volvo rollover video the roof is sustaining forces yes, but the car is rotating as it hits the ground so it’s not a sustained force on the roof, it’s glancing hits. In fact the wheels and sides of the car take a lot of the impact. Additionally you realize a majority of the roof is just thin sheet metal right? The IIHS test is equivalent to dropping the car from heigh onto its roof rails. It’s not a perfect test, but it’s a good representation. With the pano sunroof the Volvo also doesn’t have any crossmember support and just a beam at the windshield and one towards the rear:

And if you think Tesla is gaming their rollover tests go watch some moose tests. The Model Y had no issues. Part of rollover safety is not having a rollover in the first place:

 

[thesmokingman]

Did you try to put your head on the headrest?

You've never been in a BMW x4 before huh?

 

[Hank Hill]

For reference I'm 6'4 and can fit comfortably in the back without even thinking about the cross beam. It's been stated here before but bodies are different shapes and sizes, people sit differently. Best to try it for yourself.

Damn that is very tall. Was this both reclined and upright?

 

[rxlawdude]

Very true, but Tesla intentionally found the max speed before a rollover will occur and used this speed to demonstrate its lack of rollover stability. Its a cunning Marketing tool which fools the majority.

Twit key engaged. G'day.

 

[Montucky]

I'm an engineer, so all about data and not opinions.

IIHS roof test results aren't about peak loads, but more about strength to weight which is advised to be above 4.

Tesla M3 = 5.85
Volvo S60 = 5.73
Volvo XC40 = 5.23

Higher is better.

Tesla looks like it's holding up pretty well in comparison to Volvo.

 

[Seminole]

Very true, but Tesla intentionally found the max speed before a rollover will occur and used this speed to demonstrate its lack of rollover stability. Its a cunning Marketing tool which fools the majority.

One more thing, the rollover risk of the XC90 is 18% compared to 10% for the Y. Another indication that your comment is a bunch of malarkey.

 

[TSELA]

A sustained increasing load is tougher on the car than an “explosive” load. The video you posted of the Volvo rollover, the roof doesn’t even sustain anywhere near the forces the IIHS test exerts on it as evidenced by the Volvos deformation under that test:
View attachment 725980
In the Volvo rollover video the roof is sustaining forces yes, but the car is rotating as it hits the ground so it’s not a sustained force on the roof, it’s glancing hits. In fact the wheels and sides of the car take a lot of the impact. Additionally you realize a majority of the roof is just thin sheet metal right? The IIHS test is equivalent to dropping the car from heigh onto its roof rails. It’s not a perfect test, but it’s a good representation. With the pano sunroof the Volvo also doesn’t have any crossmember support and just a beam at the windshield and one towards the rear:

View attachment 725984

And if you think Tesla is gaming their rollover tests go watch some moose tests. The Model Y had no issues. Part of rollover safety is not having a rollover in the first place:

‘Glancing hits’? Really? The full weight of the vehicles mass under acceleration landing on the roof and you call that glancing?
‘Majority of the roof is just thin sheet metal’? Do you know what boron steel is? Do you know where it is used in a volvo?
To the people that have given you thumbs up, you need to educate yourself and stop being precious Tesla fan boys.
Moving forward, can anyone show me a rollover test for a model 3 Tesla?

 

[Montucky]

‘Glancing hits’? Really? The full weight of the vehicles mass under acceleration landing on the roof and you call that glancing?
‘Majority of the roof is just thin sheet metal’? Do you know what boron steel is? Do you know where it is used in a volvo?
To the people that have given you thumbs up, you need to educate yourself and stop being precious Tesla fan boys.
Moving forward, can anyone show me a rollover test for a model 3 Tesla?

You appear pretty intent on your assertion that Tesla has somehow gamed the safety system and produced a car that is unsafe in a rollover situation... yet all you reference is hand waving assertions of boron steel, glass roofs, and 2mm of deflection.

The IIHS roof strength test *is* the benchmark rollover test you mention. Conducting the same test provides for a basis of comparison between cars/trucks normalized by the strength to weight ratio. The Volvo test you showed is an internal test that Volvo conducts that while admirable and likely informative, is highly variable and not a absolute indication of how the car will perform in true rollover events which generally involve frontal, side, and roof impacts all happening simultaneously.

Teslas have an extremely low center of gravity which is the main reason they can resist a rollover so well. Tesla also tests for rollover resistance and this video from 2018 shows that the model X had a difficult time even rolling over when it was dumped sideways onto sand. The low CG is the secret sauce here for sure. Tesla Has Released Footage of Its Failed Attempt to Rollover the Model X

Yes - Tesla has some "fanboys" as you call them, but for good reason. They make some damn fine cars that are both safe and fun to drive. What I don't get is why people hate on them so much as to ignore reality and chock it all up to some foaming at the mouth hero worship.

Volvos are great cars, and it's admirable that they apply so much time and resources towards safety. Tesla does as well, and should be recognized for it too.

 

[Seminole]

‘Glancing hits’? Really? The full weight of the vehicles mass under acceleration landing on the roof and you call that glancing?
‘Majority of the roof is just thin sheet metal’? Do you know what boron steel is? Do you know where it is used in a volvo?
To the people that have given you thumbs up, you need to educate yourself and stop being precious Tesla fan boys.
Moving forward, can anyone show me a rollover test for a model 3 Tesla?

You’re on the Model Y forum not three. And in the Volvo video the wheels and side of the vehicle strike the ground first absorbing forces of the impact before the roof rails make contact. I don’t have the info to do the math behind the forces being exerted on the roof but like the picture I posted clearly showed the IIHS test exerted significantly more forces on the Volvo than the rollover test just based on the deformation alone.

Yes, I’m quite aware what high strength steel is and how it’s used in the crash structure of a car. You realize that aside from the roof rails, the cross beams at the windshield and rear, there isn’t anything else right? The roof itself that you see is just sheet metal. Here are two picture and you can see there’s just a giant hole in the roof for the sunroof, the overall type of design is not that significantly different than a Tesla where the crash structure is all in the pillars, roof rails, and front and rear cross beams.

I gave you hard numbers that the rollover risk for a Y is less than half that of the Volvo and the three is even lower at 6%, the Y’s roof withstood higher forces than the Volvo’s on a force to weight ratio, and that the general design of the crash structure is the same as Volvo does not have a large mid section cross beam for additional protection.

You’re just speculating a bunch of nonsense. Independent private safety rating agencies and government agencies have all tested the Y and 3 and found it to be extremely safe. I’d take their word over yours.

 

[thesmokingman]

I think that dude is trolling.

 

[DanDi58]

I'm an engineer, so all about data and not opinions.

IIHS roof test results aren't about peak loads, but more about strength to weight which is advised to be above 4.

Tesla M3 = 5.85
Volvo S60 = 5.73
Volvo XC40 = 5.23

Higher is better.

Tesla looks like it's holding up pretty well in comparison to Volvo.

Facts are certainly inconvenient things, aren’t they?

 

[DanDi58]

I think that dude is trolling.