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Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
Is there any regulation or common value for the height location of a rear fog light?
I just measured the following for the Model 3:
27" (70 cm) - Front high beams above ground.
16" (40 cm) - Front fog light above ground.
34" (85 cm) - Rear stop and turn signal above ground.
20" (50 cm) - middle height of the rear bumper.
16" (40 cm) - Front fog light above ground.
34" (85 cm) - Rear stop and turn signal above ground.
20" (50 cm) - middle height of the rear bumper.
Using the rear stop or turn signal (which are stronger than the parking light) is an interesting idea.
However this would be almost useless because these lights are located too high above the ground.
In general, the rear fog lights should be located under the rear bumper.
As you can notice, the existing Model 3 front fog lights are located much lower than the front high beams.
I wonder in fact why Tesla installs front fog lights, but does not also provide rear fog lights?
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Candleflame
Active Member
In Europe one taillight becomes the rear foglight (so a EU spec Tesla only has one reverse light and not two!) .
The issue in America is that most people would use them inappropriately and dazzle other drivers.
There is also some issues with lack of drivers looking out for each other in the states i.e. in europe you would be expected to switch your front foglight off if you are following a car closely in the front or switch the rear foglight off if someone is following very closely so you don't dazzle them.
I guess the main reason is that in the USA they are not required so why add another light which might cost 10 dollars to manufacture?
The issue in America is that most people would use them inappropriately and dazzle other drivers.
There is also some issues with lack of drivers looking out for each other in the states i.e. in europe you would be expected to switch your front foglight off if you are following a car closely in the front or switch the rear foglight off if someone is following very closely so you don't dazzle them.
I guess the main reason is that in the USA they are not required so why add another light which might cost 10 dollars to manufacture?
The purpose of rear fog lights is to increase your car"s visibility to others. typically, they are just a very bright lamp ,like a braking lamp.
often they are only one one side of the car but my Volvo had fog lamps on both sides.the software would need to brighten a portion of the existing tail light LEDs
On my JCW Mini the car came with fog lights but I didn’t get the option. Never the less they were still there but not activated. I was able to reprogram the car so the fog lights come on with the brake lights. Looks pretty good! Can’t wait to get rid of that thing and get another Tesla! lol
Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
Similar rear fog light could be easily added to the Model 3.
There are already a lot of after market rear fog light available
The issue would be to turn them on only undr fog or snow condition.
My experience is that rear fog lights are high up and on the left side. I can't ever recall seeing rear fog lights below the bumpers when driving in Europe. Front fogs are low to cut thru the fog, for a driver's visibility. Rear fog lights have a different purpose, for other cars to see you.
Why fronts and no rears? It's probably due to US regulations. Does any US manufacturer offer rear fog lights?
My 1996 Saab and 2007 Volvo both had rear fogs. On the Saab the rear fog replaced one of the reversing lights, so mechanics doing inspections would always tell me one of the backup lights was out. On the Volvo I think it was just a brake light on constantly. Both were up high. Requires an extra switch. Not illegal in US apparently; both cars were US spec. I'd think it would be pretty trivial to add rear fog to the lights UI. There were times in heavy rain when the car in front of me would disappear and I'd be glad to be able to turn my rear fog on. FWIW I've never been hit from behind ;-)
I see way too many cars with rear fog light on in clear weather. It's pretty annoying.
Rear fog lamp(s) is mandatory by ECE UN reglulation no. 48 on all M and N category vehicles, that is on cars, VANs, busses, lories and trucks and on this trailers. ECE UN regulation valid on almost all world exluded United States nad Canada.
Rear fog lamp(s) are no so common, but possible, in United States and Canada. FMVSS no. 108 not regulated rear fog lamps system, because rear fog lamps system is auxiliary lighting device and is regulated by SAE standards and state´s laws. All 50 states and D. C. enable montage rear fog lamps on vehicles as so long as they are compatible with SAE J1319, correctly placed and wired.
Muse be distance minimaly 100 mm between illuminated area of each rear fog lamp and each brake lamp, realy is not possible wirring one brake lamp as rear fog lamp. If is placed one rear fog lamp, must be on centre or driver´s side of the vehicle, if is placed pair of rear fog lamp, must be symmetrically on both side of the vehicle. Must be not less than 12" up to ground and not more than 35". That´s all.
Because rear fog lamps are not so common in North America, is some problem buy auxiliary rear fog lamp, for example, on Wallmart, on Peterson lighting eshop and so on. But you can buy some on Wish, Ebay and so on, some are SAE approved too, but most of have only ECE certification. ECE UN regulation no. 48 required so different requirements than SAE J1319. Simply, SAE J1319 required the same requirements as requirements for each brake lamp in one brake lamp system, luminosity 80 - 300 cd in axis @ 100 feets and at the angle 15° up and down and 45° to left and right. ECE rear fog lamp must have bigger viewing angles, minimal luminosity of 150 cd @ 25.0 m and can have variable luminosity for daytime and nightime (variable luminosity is not possible in North America, that is banned!), but if have ECE rear fog lamp only one level of luminosity, must have luminosity 150 - 300 cd @ in axis and at the angle 25° up and down and 45° to left and right.
Typically ECE auxilliary rear fog lamps have 12V 21W bulb, but existed some with LEDs and some Bosh, or Hella, early Germany produce have H1 12V 55W halogen bulb. This, cca 4 - 5 3/4" in diameter, auxilliary rear fog lamps are verry useful in heavy fog, or snow storm, but very dazzling in all another situations. I do, because some trucks and heavy lorries on our country have this halogen rear fog lamps.
Rear fog lamp(s) are no so common, but possible, in United States and Canada. FMVSS no. 108 not regulated rear fog lamps system, because rear fog lamps system is auxiliary lighting device and is regulated by SAE standards and state´s laws. All 50 states and D. C. enable montage rear fog lamps on vehicles as so long as they are compatible with SAE J1319, correctly placed and wired.
Muse be distance minimaly 100 mm between illuminated area of each rear fog lamp and each brake lamp, realy is not possible wirring one brake lamp as rear fog lamp. If is placed one rear fog lamp, must be on centre or driver´s side of the vehicle, if is placed pair of rear fog lamp, must be symmetrically on both side of the vehicle. Must be not less than 12" up to ground and not more than 35". That´s all.
Because rear fog lamps are not so common in North America, is some problem buy auxiliary rear fog lamp, for example, on Wallmart, on Peterson lighting eshop and so on. But you can buy some on Wish, Ebay and so on, some are SAE approved too, but most of have only ECE certification. ECE UN regulation no. 48 required so different requirements than SAE J1319. Simply, SAE J1319 required the same requirements as requirements for each brake lamp in one brake lamp system, luminosity 80 - 300 cd in axis @ 100 feets and at the angle 15° up and down and 45° to left and right. ECE rear fog lamp must have bigger viewing angles, minimal luminosity of 150 cd @ 25.0 m and can have variable luminosity for daytime and nightime (variable luminosity is not possible in North America, that is banned!), but if have ECE rear fog lamp only one level of luminosity, must have luminosity 150 - 300 cd @ in axis and at the angle 25° up and down and 45° to left and right.
Typically ECE auxilliary rear fog lamps have 12V 21W bulb, but existed some with LEDs and some Bosh, or Hella, early Germany produce have H1 12V 55W halogen bulb. This, cca 4 - 5 3/4" in diameter, auxilliary rear fog lamps are verry useful in heavy fog, or snow storm, but very dazzling in all another situations. I do, because some trucks and heavy lorries on our country have this halogen rear fog lamps.
Candleflame
Active Member
which is exactly why it is a gentlemans agreement that american cars do not have foglights.
I used the rear fogs on my saabs and audi's to shine at people that are tailgating. Some people tailgate without realizing it and the light helps them realize it. It's less aggressive than brake checking because your car doesn't slow down so it tends to piss people off less. I do miss that in my Tesla. I also used it very frequently in bad weather to help people see you better behind you as its intended purpose. I wish more companies had them in their cars.
Candleflame
Active Member
you do realize you will dazzle the driver(s) behind you and may cause road accidents? not to mention that it is illegal.
they are also not designed to be used in bad weather unless the visibility is less than 400m. This may be the case in dense rain but usually normal lights are enough.
your post is a good example to explain why american cars dont have foglights.
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