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Reasons to upgrade from 70 to 70D or 85 (got a few days left in my change window....)

Discussion in 'Hong Kong' started by bignoodle, Aug 9, 2015.

  1. bignoodle

    bignoodle Member

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    Hi Folks,

    Anyone out there, like me, recently place an order for a 70 (rwd), but now you're thinking, Jeez, should I go for the 70D or even the 85?

    I've got 2 days left in my change window before the order is confirmed, so if I'm going to change my mind, the time is now!

    Couple of data points which have led me to my current choice of the "base model" 70 rwd:


    • Battery: My car park is being wired up for home charging, so range should never be a concern. Any current owners out there with real-world impressions on range? I live out by the Gold Coast and drive into Central 2-3 times per week, about 55km round trip.
    • Handling: I've always done perfectly fine with RWD cars, and given Tesla's naturally low center of gravity, and Hong Kong's mostly temperate weather, I'm struggling to see much value in the AWD option, aside from possibly better handling in a rainstorm, plus a bit of extra power & extra range. Weigh that against the reduced frunk space with the D, and it's really kind of a toss-up.
    • Speed: My Tesla is going to be a family car. Most of the time driving around with a child in the back. Most of the time I drive conservatively, but who doesn't like to gun it on the highway from time to time to get around a slow-poke? Or gun it off the line to get ahead of a minibus when you need to do a quick lane change? ....If you feel me.
    • Acceleration: I test drove an 85 and not surprisingly, when I floored it around Castle Peak Rd / Ting Kau, it blew my socks right off. "Kid in the back" notwithstanding, I yearn to have that kind of unbridled power at my disposal at all times, even if I'm only rarely ever going to use it. Anybody out there currently driving a 60 or 70, with real-world impressions about how it stacks up to the 85 in terms of that raw power & acceleration? Numbers are numbers, I get all that. But in terms of subjective "feel".....are they comparable?
    • Popularity: I've been told that the 85 is the most popular option in HK, but saying that, the 85 has been around longer than the 70, so I'm not sure how much it matters. I don't really envision myself selling the car on the open market (more likely will finance thru ORIX and take the 75% buy-back and trade in for a new model in 3 years time). Although, it's always good to keep one's options open, and for that reason, I'm wondering if the 85 might not be a better choice, for potentially trading in down the road.

    Thanks in advance for all insights & opinions of the group. Overall I'm inclined to believe that there really is no such thing as a "bad" Tesla, so no matter what I go with in the end, it's going to be straight-up amazeballs.

    But if I can justify the D option or the 85, and there are some compelling reasons to consider it that I haven't thought of, then naturally, I'm all ears.

    Thanks All!
     
  2. markwj

    markwj Moderator, Asia Pacific

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    I think you'll be happy with the base rear wheel drive 70. Range will definitely not be an issue (home charging). Even the performance of a base 70kWh model kills pretty much anything else 'normal' out there on the roads here.

    Remember if you go for a buy-back lease, you're gonna be hit with higher depreciation on anything you add above base anyway.
     
  3. jsiu

    jsiu Member

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    I tend to agree with Mark. If I had the choice when I ordered my 70D, I would go for the basic model 70. My Tesla is going to be my family car. I would take the buy-back lease to give myself some freedom in future finance to play around.
     
  4. gubes

    gubes Member

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    Based on your situation (home charger, not crazy about performance), the base model makes the most sense - you can use the money saved to spec it up more.

    I ordered the 70D before the 70 was offered. I may have gone for the 70 otherwise. The performance even for the base 70 is very strong.

    The 70/70D would be comparable in performance to somewhere in between a 535i and a 550i but feel a lot quicker due to the instant torque. Mercedes E400 or E500 equivalent. Nobody who owns those cars would ever say they were sluggish. Any faster than that and you would need to regularly risk losing your liscence in order to enjoy the benefits of the faster models.
     
  5. markwj

    markwj Moderator, Asia Pacific

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    Of course, using this logic you should buy either a base 70 or a P85D ludicrous, and nothing in between :biggrin:
     
  6. Optic

    Optic Member

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    I went with the 85d instead of 85 because when i test drove, it felt like it was understeering during cornering. the AWD should hopefully compensate for that... I don't have at home charging so any bit of extra range is great. Figure if I sell it back, i get some of the money back.
     
  7. gubes

    gubes Member

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    The one thing good about the Dual Motors is the traction. You can only test drive the P85 when I did the test. The car had so much torque that you would easily spin the rear wheels when accelerating on a slippery or uneven surface (which was a little scary). The Ds don't have that problem apparently. However the 70 is less powerful so as long as you are gentle with the throttle, there should be no issues.

    Also to correct my last post. The 70 is basically equivalent to just a 535i and E400 wheras the 70D is somewhere between that and a 550i and E500. Still 535 and E400 are pretty quick cars and the 70 is on paper just as fast - although I think in practice it is quicker in real life driving due to the instant torque etc.

    Big benefit of the rear wheel drives though is the added frunk space if that is important to you.
     
  8. MingMan

    MingMan Member

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    #8 MingMan, Aug 10, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2015
    I was choosing between 70 and 85 before ordering. This issue notwithstanding, I had made up my mind to go for the D anyway so as to get a better cornering control.

    No doubt 70 is sufficient for a family car driving. However, 85 not only will give me a longer range (at this point of time, home charging is not an option for me) but also the extra power and torque (to fulfill my ego). As I will go for the resale option too, the extra cost between 85 and 70 is some $9,000/year (before interest) ($658,000-$580,200)x0.35/3 which is $25/day. So I ordered a 85D.

    I tested drive a 85RWD last Saturday (there should be no AWD for testing at the moment). The steering is already good so I think an AWD will be even better (in additional to what gubes said about the advantages of AWD). After all, if you go for the resale option, you are talking about $13,580 (before interest) ($38,800 x 0.35)for 3 years.

    Had 90KWh been available at the time that I made my order, I would have ordered 90 but the Product Specialist suggested last Saturday not to opt for it unless the 6% extra range was really important.

    Let alone egoistic, I will not go for P85D or the ludicrous mode as seriously speaking, how likely can we be "ludicrous" in HK?
     
  9. AppleFan

    AppleFan Member

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    I drive a 60.

    Range: Like you, I have home charging. I have only worried about range one time, and that was for our rally last December. I drove 193km (including from home to the starting point, and to dinner after the rally) and I "only" used 34.7kwh. I can't see how range would be an issue in HK.

    Performance: Judging from your descriptions, I think your and my driving styles are pretty similar. Just yesterday, I drove a long uphill up Smithfield (in Western District) with four adults in the car, and I passed quite a few ICEs with ease. I wasn't even gunning it, or pressing the pedal to the floor. The instantaneous torque is key, and even with my 60, there's gobs of it. Sure, sometimes, I look at the numbers on the Design Studio and I wish I had an 85 or an 85D. But really, it's more for bragging rights.

    That being said, I note what MingMan said -- the price differential of D vs. non-D is relatively small, so if I were to buy a Model S now, I'd get the D.

    Hope this helps! You're going to enjoy your car regardless of what you choose!
     
  10. deku

    deku Member

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    First of all, welcome another EV adopter!
    And in fact, I live near Gold Coast, I wish I am living in Gold Coast since the Carpark there is much much EV friendly than the one I am in. Gold Coast have free 13A and parking is only 1800 a month. My place is 3600 a month and charging with 32A x 3 have to pay HKD42 per hour. So I will have a P85D tomorrow. I sprint, but I am also a father of two, of course I don't sprint with kids in my car, but occasionally, you might want to do that when you alone. And I assume you drive the Tuen Mun Highway everyday then. It's a road with lots of ups and downhill, curvy road and most importantly many dangerous "Sunday driver" and China-Hong Kong license Alphard (basically HK-China Taxi) along that road, they change lanes every god damn second. In sunny days, it's still ok. When it's raining heavily, especially near Tsing Lung Tau, the rain can be so serious that you can't see the car in front of you. I would, highly recommend you either have 70D, 85D instead of 85. D gonna save you a lot of trouble. Not to mention Tuen Mun highway always have those dangerous maintenance "Arrow" truck suddenly show up in front of you and closing one lane. The D will give you all the traction you need in rainy days to avoid those potential dangerous situations.
     
  11. SK1

    SK1 Member

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    If you have the option, take the "D".
     
  12. lx3h

    lx3h Charged.hk TSLA Grp Rep

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    DITB is your neighbour then.
     
  13. wombat

    wombat Member

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    When i was buying i was deciding between the 70D or 85 (ended up with 85). There were several things I considered

    Speed: In terms of speed the 0.2 sec is pretty much negligible and even the difference with 70 and 85 is not that great in terms of every day driving (for reference 0-100 70D 5.2sec, 85 5.4sec, 70 5.5sec).

    RWD/ 4WD: As for RWD vs 4WD, a lot of the driving is accelerating while already moving so traction is not as much a concern compared to going from a stand still. To me it is a nice to have, not a must. It is only on the few days with heavy rain that I think it would have been better with 4WD but 95% of the time it is dry and I don't think it is necessary. Just drive carefully! Yes it is safer having 4WD, but it dose not make you invincible on wet roads and it can give you a false sense of confidence.

    Battery: My main concern was the battery, since I don't have charging at home. But since you have charging at home the extra range is mostly good to have and not necessary especially with driving in HK where the distance is limited.

    The FRUNK! As you mentioned, without the front engine you get a nice usable space in the frunk. I find it ideal to put my kids booster seat when not in use, and some of the stuff which is usually found rolling around in the trunk of the car. If you get a small box its great to put the stuff in the small hole where the engine would be.

    Resale: There are some but not many 2nd hand teslas available. From the point of view of 2nd hand owners a 85 would be more desirable as not many people can charge at home in HK. But since you are financing the car I don't think it would be that much of a problem with the 75% buy back. Plus you are already saving on the initial costs of purchase.

    And other things which pretty much applies to all Teslas

    Highway driving: The best thing compared with ICE cars is the instant torque. If you are cruising on the highway and need to change lanes there is no hesitation like in ICE cars where you have to wait a moment for the engine to get up to higher RPM. I travel on Tuen Mun Highway frequently and its great to have the instant torque to avoid the trucks.

    Another is the regenerative brake, it's really useful when you are approaching the birdcages (speed traps). Sometimes I forget the speed trap is coming up but when I see it just a quick lift off the throttle and i'm back within the limit (provided your not going too quickly haha) In a normal car by the time you lift and apply brakes it might be too late.
     
  14. deku

    deku Member

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    There is a black S85 at the same carpark I am parking.
     
  15. AppleFan

    AppleFan Member

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    Oops, no, DITB's is silver.
     
  16. bignoodle

    bignoodle Member

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    #16 bignoodle, Aug 15, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 13, 2016
    Big thanks to the contributors to this thread, who provided some excellent insights and guidance.

    It was such a close call, with such good arguments on either side, that in the end, I settled the matter the only way I knew how.

    A coin toss.

     
  17. wombat

    wombat Member

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    HAHAHAHA :biggrin:
     

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