received EV -> EV2 transition letter [Discussion: CA Rate plans and PV or PV+Storage]

[astrorob]

this is something i was not expecting; i thought PGE would just switch my rate without warning. i received a letter the other day which looks like a mass mailing to EV customers saying that sometime starting in June i'd be transitioned from EV to EV2. a good deal of the letter is devoted to explaining the shift in the TOU tier times and advising me to start charging my car at midnight instead of 11PM.

maybe since i had PTO in late 2015 i just got put into the 2021 bucket or something? i don't know when EV closed but i imagine there are still going to be people inside the 5 year grandfathering period in 2021 and 2022?

 

[getakey]

I'm still grandfathered for 2 more years (I think). Got solar with EV in July 2018

 

[aesculus]

maybe since i had PTO in late 2015 i just got put into the 2021 bucket or something? i don't know when EV closed but i imagine there are still going to be people inside the 5 year grandfathering period in 2021 and 2022?

I think you nailed it. I got a PTO in Nov of 2019 (applied in July) so I got about as much of the grandfathering period as you can. You can hear me cry in 2025.

 

[astrorob]

I think you nailed it. I got a PTO in Nov of 2019 (applied in July) so I got about as much of the grandfathering period as you can. You can hear me cry in 2025.

indeed the letter does say that EV closed in 2019, i didn't notice that when i was posting.

so i guess i got a few extra months out of EV.

 

[zanary]

I wonder if there is an easy way to know when your grandfather period ends. I don’t see it on their web site.

 

[Ampster]

I wonder if there is an easy way to know when your grandfather period ends.

I think it is five or six years from when you adopted it or from your PTO date. Once you know the specifics you can get a more precise answer.
In my case I adopted EV-A in late 2017 and got PTO in 2019. Neither date matters because we are moving in June and I can't roll it over to the new place.

 

[charlesj]

...You can hear me cry in 2025.

Let's hope will be around to hear it.

 

[astrorob]

I wonder if there is an easy way to know when your grandfather period ends. I don’t see it on their web site.

i think it is 5 years. i had PTO in november 2015 so i expected to get transitioned in december 2020. but clearly it took them 6 months to get around to it. it could be they just do all customers expiring in 2020 in 2021, rather than doing each customer individually.

 

[sorka]

With 3 powerwalls, EV2-A actually works out better for me.

 

[getakey]

With 3 powerwalls, EV2-A actually works out better for me.

Thats interesting. I have 3 PWs and I'm still on EV1-A. Is it because of the longer Off Peak periods? After adding PWs, my True-up went from positive to negative. So it will be even more negative on EV2?

 

[sorka]

Thats interesting. I have 3 PWs and I'm still on EV1-A. Is it because of the longer Off Peak periods? After adding PWs, my True-up went from positive to negative. So it will be even more negative on EV2?

It turns out my statement is incorrect. Now that I have a dashboard that can model it to the penny with the rest data pulled for every 5 minutes, I can swap in different rates to model the entire history so I replaced my winter and summer rates with the old but current EV2 including the previous old rate prior to March 1st.

With the EV2-A, I'm $220.54 below true-up break even...i.e. with all my usage so far with solar and powerwalls, I have an NEM credit of $220.54 minus the $120 / year minimum billable.

With EV-A, I would be $256.96 below true-up, so I'm about $36 poorer for having been on EV2-A since December.

 

[sorka]

It turns out my statement is incorrect. Now that I have a dashboard that can model it to the penny with the rest data pulled for every 5 minutes, I can swap in different rates to model the entire history so I replaced my winter and summer rates with the old but current EV2 including the previous old rate prior to March 1st.

With the EV2-A, I'm $220.54 below true-up break even...i.e. with all my usage so far with solar and powerwalls, I have an NEM credit of $220.54 minus the $120 / year minimum billable.

With EV-A, I would be $256.96 below true-up, so I'm about $36 poorer for having been on EV2-A since December.

Oh wait, but now I just realized this isn't accurate as had I actually been on EVA, my advanced settings would have had different peak and shoulder times. Simply swapping in EVA has me using peak time from 2 to 3 when that isn't peak time for me on EV2A so it makes it look a little better than it actually is.

But I'd still be a little further ahead with EVA. I might modify the model to reshuffle the usage data between grid and powerwall for whatever would be optimal for the selected rate plan. Solar and house usage of course are unaffected...although house usage could be modified slightly to work around rate plan. However, my plan when we got solar and powerwalls was to not have to worry about it. We do still set the dishwasher and clotherwasher timers if we're preparing a load that would start during peak or part peak. Even if we use power from the powerwalls, every kwh we use has a 10% round trip penalty.

 

[getakey]

The NEM credit doesn't count towards anything. It goes away. I went from a positive ~$200. to a negative $900. just by adding PWs

 

[h2ofun]

The NEM credit doesn't count towards anything. It goes away. I went from a positive ~$200. to a negative $900. just by adding PWs

In non winter, I am assuming if I put all my solar back to the grid starting at 3pm, thats like credit at .50kwh compared to getting charged .018kwh, so I hope it adds up. Its just the winter I am not sure what will happen. what are others doing, seeing?

 

[sorka]

The NEM credit doesn't count towards anything. It goes away. I went from a positive ~$200. to a negative $900. just by adding PWs

Not sure what you're saying. I'll more than use up all of my NEM credit this summer when I'm running the AC...so yes, it will go away.

 

[getakey]

Not sure what you're saying. I'll more than use up all of my NEM credit this summer when I'm running the AC...so yes, it will go away.

Oh, I misunderstood. I thought you already had true-up of negative 200. In my case, I actually accumulate more negative NEM in the summer (even using AC) and use it up in the winter. So when I had the positive 200 NEM, it was from winter, not summer usage.

 

[sorka]

Oh, I misunderstood. I thought you already had true-up of negative 200. In my case, I actually accumulate more negative NEM in the summer (even using AC) and use it up in the winter. So when I had the positive 200 NEM, it was from winter, not summer usage.

My true-up is in December. If I have a large credit by the time that comes which is very unlikely, I'll use it up with electric heat rather than lose it.

 

[GenSao]

I wonder if there is an easy way to know when your grandfather period ends. I don’t see it on their web site.

The info is burred near the bottom of the EV FAQ page:

NEM customers are eligible for 5-years of grandfathering based on their Permission to Operate (PTO) date. Please refer to this table for an example schedule.

NEM1 Transition Examples
PTO Date	Grandfathered Until
Prior to 11/30/14	No Grandfathering
12/1/14 - 11/30/15	November 2020
12/1/15 - 11/30/16	November 2021
12/1/16 - 11/30/17	November 2022
NEM 2 Transition Examples
NEM 2.0 Active Date	Grandfathered Until
12/16/16 - 11/30/17	November 2022
12/1/17 - 11/30/18	November 2023
12/1/18 - 11/30/19	November 2024
12/1/19 - 10/31/20	November 2025

 

[holeydonut]

Keep in mind the grandfathering is just on the TOU dates and times, not the rates.

So you’ll be grandfathered for the whole summer/winter splits or have your 11pm vs midnight shoulder thing locked in. But the actual rate you pay/earn can change at a whim. During your grandfathered period they could change your peak rate from $0.30 to $0.60 per kWh and there’s nothing you can do.

Off peak Rates for EV2-A have gone up like 25% in the last 3 years. And for some reason nobody really seems to care (or notice?)

 

[astrorob]

Off peak Rates for EV2-A have gone up like 25% in the last 3 years. And for some reason nobody really seems to care (or notice?)

oh, i care (and notice). not much that can be done about it though.

i haven't consistently downloaded the EV rate sheet to capture all of the changes. does PGE keep the historical tariff sheets on their website?