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Reducing noise and keeping the door sills clean

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I'm also having real problems with the noise like most posters here, especially on rough roads. It sounds like sitting inside a drum or a jet engine, or driving a car with several atrociously bad wheel bearings. I plastered every surface I could get my hands on with Noico, including wheel wells, trunk, doors. But not the floors since the battery with its cooling fluid makes a much more efficient sound deadener than anything I can add to it. Although all of this improved the noise level somewhat it was just not enough.
After doing some research I decided to attempt to lessen the reverberation from the tires on the underside of the car. I glued outdoor carpet on the underside of the battery - the smooth floor pans. That reduced the noise somewhat to barely acceptable levels. I would say that was the biggest improvement I made so far.
As far as I can tell the problem is with the construction of the car itself. The tire vibration gets transmitted through the suspension to the car's frame. Tesla would need to install suspension bushings that absorb these vibrations; and probably re-design the shapes and perhaps the materials of the suspension parts themselves.
On smooth surfaces the car is quite quiet :D now, but on rough surfaces it is still annoyingly loud. :eek:
 
I'm also having real problems with the noise like most posters here, especially on rough roads. It sounds like sitting inside a drum or a jet engine, or driving a car with several atrociously bad wheel bearings. I plastered every surface I could get my hands on with Noico, including wheel wells, trunk, doors. But not the floors since the battery with its cooling fluid makes a much more efficient sound deadener than anything I can add to it. Although all of this improved the noise level somewhat it was just not enough.
After doing some research I decided to attempt to lessen the reverberation from the tires on the underside of the car. I glued outdoor carpet on the underside of the battery - the smooth floor pans. That reduced the noise somewhat to barely acceptable levels. I would say that was the biggest improvement I made so far.
As far as I can tell the problem is with the construction of the car itself. The tire vibration gets transmitted through the suspension to the car's frame. Tesla would need to install suspension bushings that absorb these vibrations; and probably re-design the shapes and perhaps the materials of the suspension parts themselves.
On smooth surfaces the car is quite quiet :D now, but on rough surfaces it is still annoyingly loud. :eek:

Noico the front strut towers as far down as you can get to. You'll have to take out the frunk but it's not that difficult
 
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To add to my previous post, I completed the bradhs seal install. A few things came up during the install which slightly modified his original idea. I thought I would document those changes here.

The first change we made was running the forward A-pillar door seal to the top of the mirror. That took a bit of creativity to have it fold over properly. We tried a few things but after testing out medium CA (cyanoacrylate) glue on a test piece, we found it didn't react negatively and created the fold we needed:

View media item 119658View media item 119657View media item 119654
Moving to the B pillar door seal, we found running the Z seal on the back side of the rear door didn't provide as much seal against the forward door as it would if we ran it on the front side, also we completed the run to bottom of the door and CA'd them to each other.

View media item 119659View media item 119653
At the top of the B pillar seal I use an Xacto and cut a nice arc to give it an OEM look:

View media item 119651
The bottom of the front left & right doors used the P seals as originally intended, allowing the flap portion (or the bottom of the P, if you will) to fold over itself and create a nice seal [not shown]

When we started the rear doors we found we couldn't get an even fold over for a consistent finished look. Using a test piece, we completely removed the bottom of the P seal (turning it into a D seal, actually). While this didn't close the gap of the body and rear doors, it did provide the seal we were looking for:

View media item 119655
To finish at the top of the rear door, we took a few more drops of medium CA and terminated it under the chrome to have that OEM look:

View media item 119660
As I mentioned, this took us about 5 hours to have it fully completed. We took our time and were methodical about each step. Overall I thought it make the car perceivably quieter and after driving the car for 45 minutes, no dust on the rear door jambs! The doors now close with a commanding thud, instead of the tinny noise as before.

As a final step, and after the seals had a night to settle in, I treated all seals with 303 Aerospace protectant.

Thanks bradhs!
 
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Thanks to everyone for the excellent write ups! I plan to do this mod in the next couple days.

Rev-777, just to confirm, did you attach Z seals to the B pillars on BOTH the front and back of the forward part of the rear door?

Regarding the P seals on the rears, how did you turn them into D? From the pic of the rear it doesn't look like you cut it. It think the issue with the rears is the bottom of the door could benefit from P, but as it runs up the side a D might be more appropriate. Did you consider cutting the P flap off gradually in the transition from bottom to side?

Did anyone account for the drip holes at the bottom of the doors? Seems the seals would need to go directly over them. Would love to see pics from modifications to account for this, or explanations for not worrying about it.
 
Rev-777, just to confirm, did you attach Z seals to the B pillars on BOTH the front and back of the forward part of the rear door?

Z seals on the outside until that lip ends, then the back side. A steady Xacto blade and CA brings them together.

Regarding the P seals on the rears, how did you turn them into D? From the pic of the rear it doesn't look like you cut it. It think the issue with the rears is the bottom of the door could benefit from P, but as it runs up the side a D might be more appropriate. Did you consider cutting the P flap off gradually in the transition from bottom to side?

I cut the lip off with very sharp scissors. I didn’t think of the taper idea (which is a good one), however didn’t find it really mattered in the end. You’re trying to seal the door for cleanliness and noise reduction. In this instance I didn’t feel it would make a huge difference. I’ll get a better picture of the modified P seals on the rear doors for you.

Did anyone account for the drip holes at the bottom of the doors? Seems the seals would need to go directly over them. Would love to see pics from modifications to account for this, or explanations for not worrying about it.

We had a good look at the channeling and elected to install the seals below the drip holes. We figure water will flow toward the B pillar from either direction. I’ll wash the car to confirm.
 
Thanks to everyone for the excellent write ups! I plan to do this mod in the next couple days.

Rev-777, just to confirm, did you attach Z seals to the B pillars on BOTH the front and back of the forward part of the rear door?

Regarding the P seals on the rears, how did you turn them into D? From the pic of the rear it doesn't look like you cut it. It think the issue with the rears is the bottom of the door could benefit from P, but as it runs up the side a D might be more appropriate. Did you consider cutting the P flap off gradually in the transition from bottom to side?

Did anyone account for the drip holes at the bottom of the doors? Seems the seals would need to go directly over them. Would love to see pics from modifications to account for this, or explanations for not worrying about it.

Would be helpful if you could take some sound measurements before and after. There is a free iphone app called dB meter that you could use.
 
Would be helpful if you could take some sound measurements before and after. There is a free iphone app called dB meter that you could use.

Measuring sound is an art in itself. Numerous factors come into play and having these consistent is the most difficult part. If you could leave the phone in the exact spot pointing the same way perhaps (maybe) you could get a consistent control and test. Somebody made a YouTube video and showed -4dB reduction. Again, where was the mic? What type of mic? How did they weight the sound meter? Too many questions came up and lost my interest in the actual reduction.

For me, the car door jambs are much cleaner from my initial observations, and ultimately the sound in the car is less. It does not completely solve all the problem areas (which I believe require it be taken into account at an engineering level), but it’s better than it was. That’s good enough for me.
 
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We had a good look at the channeling and elected to install the seals below the drip holes. We figure water will flow toward the B pillar from either direction. I’ll wash the car to confirm.

I also installed under the drain holes, and used an xacto knife to cut a gap through the P portion of the seal where the drain holes were. I suppose water could then drain into the P hole channel this way, but as they're on the bottom of the door and there are two of them, I figured it wouldn't be much and would drain fine eventually.
 
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After doing some research I decided to attempt to lessen the reverberation from the tires on the underside of the car. I glued outdoor carpet on the underside of the battery - the smooth floor pans. That reduced the noise somewhat to barely acceptable levels. I would say that was the biggest improvement I made so far.

Hello - I’m new here, this is my first post.
I’ve been lurking for some time unregistered, but what tipped me over the edge (registering) was that I just wanted to thank you for your particularly interesting and well-written report! :)

I’ve been down this path of trying to reduce noise levels before, in particular with a new FIAT 500 six or seven years ago (you’re probably familiar with the model). Similar to you, I found the road noise annoying on the coarse chip surfaces we have here in New Zealand. The drumming noise would begin at quite a low speed (50km/h-30mph) and not increase much with higher speeds (unlike drivetrain or wind noise).

I took apart some more luxurious cars (Mercedes CLS, Alfa Romeo 166 - I happened to own both of these as well as the FIAT 500 :)) to see what additions the manufacturers deemed cost-effective (all cars are built to a price; no manufacturer would fit anything not worthwhile as it would raise the cost for no benefit, so I believe any additions found on a production car are likely to be beneficial at some level).

The four that spring to mind are:
- thick padding under the rear seat
- extensive use of deadening pads in the boot/trunk area
- thick waterproof padding applied to the plastic wheelarch liners on the inside (ie not exposed) surface
- expanding foam in A-pillars

The first two make sense where large areas of sheetmetal tends to transmit suspension vibration into the sounding box of the trunk (of a sedan).

The padding of wheelarch liners makes sense to reduce the sound reverberating around the wheels themselves.

I remember a study that found an improvement with ‘fiber’ wheelarch liners instead of the hard plastic type. I think the outdoor-carpet material used for these is a compromise, as with a hard plastic backing, it is probably not as absorbent (for vibration) as it could be. Therefore, adding soft material to the back surface would seem to improve its performance.

As for the fourth point, I did some experimenting with using expanding foam to fill various places. The top of the A pillar (windscreen pillar) is usually out of the question due to the curtain airbag installation (and in the Model 3, a speaker?), but I had success at the base of the A pillar (behind the front wheelarch) and further back on the sill at the base of the B pillar. Filling these two areas seemed to stop the sound echoing along the sill.

I have to say that like you, I achieved the biggest reduction in noise on roads that were already quiet - a surprising 5dB decrease. It seemed difficult to solve the problem on surfaces that were very noisy, but I never tried the padded-wheelarch-liner idea - so, I just wanted to put it here for your consideration.

Thanks again. I look forward to tackling this myself one day when my Model 3 arrives. That’s several months away, as orders in NZ haven’t even started yet - but it will be soon.

-Alex
 
To add to my previous post, I completed the bradhs seal install. A few things came up during the install which slightly modified his original idea. I thought I would document those changes here.

...

Overall I thought it make the car perceivably quieter and after driving the car for 45 minutes, no dust on the rear door jambs! The doors now close with a commanding thud, instead of the tinny noise as before.

As a final step, and after the seals had a night to settle in, I treated all seals with 303 Aerospace protectant.

Thanks bradhs!

I’d like to use my second post to appreciate the quality of your contribution, Rev-777 - the photos are very useful to see exactly where these seals can be fitted - thank you. Again I think this is another area where Mercedes et. al. implement something that Tesla has not, and there are practical benefits to be realised. I would guess that there is less high-pitched sound when driving on wet roads, for example? The sound that always makes me wonder if a door is ajar.

-Alex
 
To add to my previous post, I completed the bradhs seal install. A few things came up during the install which slightly modified his original idea. I thought I would document those changes here.

The first change we made was running the forward A-pillar door seal to the top of the mirror. That took a bit of creativity to have it fold over properly. We tried a few things but after testing out medium CA (cyanoacrylate) glue on a test piece, we found it didn't react negatively and created the fold we needed:

View media item 119658View media item 119657View media item 119654
Moving to the B pillar door seal, we found running the Z seal on the back side of the rear door didn't provide as much seal against the forward door as it would if we ran it on the front side, also we completed the run to bottom of the door and CA'd them to each other.

View media item 119659View media item 119653
At the top of the B pillar seal I use an Xacto and cut a nice arc to give it an OEM look:

View media item 119651
The bottom of the front left & right doors used the P seals as originally intended, allowing the flap portion (or the bottom of the P, if you will) to fold over itself and create a nice seal [not shown]

When we started the rear doors we found we couldn't get an even fold over for a consistent finished look. Using a test piece, we completely removed the bottom of the P seal (turning it into a D seal, actually). While this didn't close the gap of the body and rear doors, it did provide the seal we were looking for:

View media item 119655
To finish at the top of the rear door, we took a few more drops of medium CA and terminated it under the chrome to have that OEM look:

View media item 119660
As I mentioned, this took us about 5 hours to have it fully completed. We took our time and were methodical about each step. Overall I thought it make the car perceivably quieter and after driving the car for 45 minutes, no dust on the rear door jambs! The doors now close with a commanding thud, instead of the tinny noise as before.

As a final step, and after the seals had a night to settle in, I treated all seals with 303 Aerospace protectant.

Thanks bradhs!

Sorry to ask for this, since you did a whole lot here to provide help everyone (me included). I'm having trouble figuring out which seal you used where in the grand scheme of the car? Like the P or Z seals going where exactly? Any chance you would be able to put a full picture of the car indicating which seal you used where? Like just a paint drawing even would be amazing. There are a lot of guides here and R&D, just trying to understand the consensus.
 
I completed the seals on just the passenger side front and back doors and to my dismay, it actually increased the road noise entering the cabin. It turns out that not only does it make the doors slightly harder to close, the seals are causing the door to not shut as tightly as it did, causing noise. This is the most apparent near the passenger side B pillar.

I took my car in for service after ripping off those seals and they replaced the entire passenger B pillar camera assembly and adjusted both door fitments. Even with that work, the issue still isn't resolved, so I'm thinking that this may be more than meets the eye. I have a follow-up visit at a different SC this Monday, will report after.
 
I completed the seals on just the passenger side front and back doors and to my dismay, it actually increased the road noise entering the cabin. It turns out that not only does it make the doors slightly harder to close, the seals are causing the door to not shut as tightly as it did, causing noise. This is the most apparent near the passenger side B pillar.

An increase in noise is odd. It does take a few days (5-10) for the seals to relax. Shame you took them off after all that work.
 
Sorry to ask for this, since you did a whole lot here to provide help everyone (me included). I'm having trouble figuring out which seal you used where in the grand scheme of the car? Like the P or Z seals going where exactly? Any chance you would be able to put a full picture of the car indicating which seal you used where? Like just a paint drawing even would be amazing. There are a lot of guides here and R&D, just trying to understand the consensus.

Same diagram as bradsh posted in this thread earlier.
 
I completed the seals on just the passenger side front and back doors and to my dismay, it actually increased the road noise entering the cabin. It turns out that not only does it make the doors slightly harder to close, the seals are causing the door to not shut as tightly as it did, causing noise. This is the most apparent near the passenger side B pillar.

I took my car in for service after ripping off those seals and they replaced the entire passenger B pillar camera assembly and adjusted both door fitments. Even with that work, the issue still isn't resolved, so I'm thinking that this may be more than meets the eye. I have a follow-up visit at a different SC this Monday, will report after.

Seals are a balancing act. Too tight and they actually pass resonances through from one body panel to the next adjoining panel(s). Too loose and they allow wind noise and water even to enter the passenger cage. I think the Z seals everywhere except the bottom of the doors, using the P seals only on the bottom, seems to hit a sweet spot. The P seals are bulky, and if the door is prevented from shutting except under a lot of pressure, you may have missed the sweet spot. Our doors also shut with a very satisfying 'thunk' (but without having to slam them or use much more force at all) quite different from how they did before dynamatting and the additional seals. I also found that all the seals had minimal stick, and used quarter inch 3M tape all around to keep them more securely in place, placing the tape as far inboard as possible, without going to the non-parallel surfaces, and putting the stock sticky tape right on the center of the 3M tape. They virtually all worked loose before using the 3M and none have worked loose since (and I obsessively cleaned the sheet metal on the original first pass).

We are VERY happy with the overall results, and have no question that the car is quieter with all the various things that we have done!
 
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I put extra seals everywhere, in the same manner as @Rev-777. Anecdotally, wind noise is down a bit. Not a substantial amount, but definitely noticeable. Road noise that couples into the car via the mechanics was obviously not affected. I regret that I didn't take actual SPL measurements before and after...though since they are notoriously difficult to do apples-to-apples, I'm happy with my purely anecdotal evidence ;-)
 
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