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I know this isn't the right thread but I don't really know my way around very well here. Has anybody else noticed that there M3P does not show 315 miles on a full charge?
I'm only charging to 90% but stats indicates that if I were out of 100% I would only have 309 miles.
I apologize for being off topic, hopefully someone can point me in the right direction.
I'm only charging to 90% but stats indicates that if I were out of 100% I would only have 309 miles.
I apologize for being off topic, hopefully someone can point me in the right direction.
I’m getting 310 at full charge
also, my supercharging seems to be capped at 80kw even on v3 with an hour of preconditioning. Has anyone had this issue?
Tholland
Plaid/Black&ebony/21in wheels/OD- 5/31/21
yes this is correct. for sure our cars have the 82kw pack. that has been some rumors about a software update coming. I also noticed that my 21 M3P doesn't charge as fast as my 19M3P. but mine as well only shows about 308-310 of charge. I wouldn't worry to much about this. they will probably adjust it with a update soon. they are pushing a update 48.30.2 overseas to SR+ cars so it could come soon. I recommend you switch you % on your display. you will drive yourself crazy trying to keep up with the Guess o meter of miles.
Thanks I have been seeing that we probably had the newer battery and I suspected that it was a software issue. I'm actually getting the data from the Stats app.
two additional questions since you seem to be in the know.
1. How are you able to determine the existence of the 82 kW battery? I know in the UK it's on paperwork that they receive I don't see it on anything that I have.
2. Some of you have been very specific in noting the date that your car was born on. I have no information to tell me what day in December 2020 my car was produced. Where is that information? The door tag only shows 12/20.
Tholland
Plaid/Black&ebony/21in wheels/OD- 5/31/21
well I know some stuff but not all. when it comes to the 82kw Pack it would make sense that the M3P pack has it. also I believe the LR cars has it as well but are software locked to a certain Kw usage. I also think Greentheonly on twitter, said something about a software locked pack a while ago. this is to ensure everyone gets the same amount of energy within the same the car. now over seas so of them have the 77 kw LG pack, but thats not here that is in Tesla MIC. but im not 100% on that. however some over there have the Panasonic it just depends on when and where it was built. tesla and Panasonic did have deal made for the new more energy dense cell for the model 3. seeing that the car that are overseas, like Norway and others, those cars are built here and then shipped there. but some are also exported from china as well. it would not make sense to make a different pack for them and another for here. I can see Tesla making some changes with some small parts and software. they are the best in the business with battery and BMS, but they did not gain 31 more miles just from that. we also can see that the cells being used are more energy dense from the EPA figures. the new Panasonic batteries were about 5%~ more dense which move the pack to 82kw from the 78 kw pack before. that also would explain the nice range boost and more efficient range we see. now what im assuming is from watching others test the new pack over there, and how it behaves, charges, discharges, power limiting etc that the new cars here have that newer pack. but someone can easily confirm this with Scan my Tesla on a new 2021 US model 3.
apparently the new packs are supposed to charger faster. that is not the case currently. for a fact, my 19M3P charged faster than my now 21M3P. im sure Tesla is just monitoring and testing that pack before they step up or unlock full speed. when it comes to your "born date" only the SA would be able to tell you take. or if you saw your car before they PDI you would see a barcode on the windshield which is like a shipping labelled and it would have the VIN, and the Full Manufactured date on it. My contact and friend told me when my was built and he was spot on. when another friend of mine went to my DC and found my car he saw the sticker and it showed the Born date. I can only assume that all the new 2021 model 3 have the more energy dense packs and newer Panasonic packs. the door tag will just tell you what month it was built. you may be able to ask someone in the Tesla chat if they can check for you if you really want to know when it was made to the day.
again, I dont know everything, just some stuff. I also infer things from others. I use logic an think about it. I also know some about their production lines and what they can do with them. but the biggest tale for me was the deal Tesla did with Panasonic for the more energy dense cell, which was for about ~5% which like I stated before is exactly what we got. 75-78kw-82kw
Bjorn does a great series on batteries that Tesla uses. check it out.
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Tholland
Plaid/Black&ebony/21in wheels/OD- 5/31/21
also their Is a difference in the EPA test as well. the new 2021 cars used less enegry to travel the distance in the test.
"we have the EPA results and it only required ~78.5kWh to get the rated range of 353 rated miles. That's less than the energy used in the 2020 Model 3 to get 322 miles (~79.5kWh)" from Alansubie4life post. now he is like range god on here so he knows more than I could ever know. I still believe that the performance 3 21 has the new 82kw pack. maybe the LR doesn't because of what is posted above. but for sure the LG pack is not here in the states. @AlanSubie4Life but he can add alot more and correct me where I am wrong.
I feel that Tesla is using these new cells, traveling 31 more miles with 1less kw of energy is a lot for just small improvements here and there like wheels and tires, heat pump. but I dont think the heating and or cooling is factored in the EPA test because its stationary I thought. so maybe they are software locking the the LR pack down to 77kw or a different number or maybe its a slight refresh to the refresh, or maybe it is all the new improvements and Tesla just really cranking down on the software. I due know for fact the new 21 M3P do not show the rated EPA range yet. that will come in a software update later im assuming and they dont charge as fast as my 19 M3P as well. only time will tell. I could be completely wrong in all of this.
"we have the EPA results and it only required ~78.5kWh to get the rated range of 353 rated miles. That's less than the energy used in the 2020 Model 3 to get 322 miles (~79.5kWh)" from Alansubie4life post. now he is like range god on here so he knows more than I could ever know. I still believe that the performance 3 21 has the new 82kw pack. maybe the LR doesn't because of what is posted above. but for sure the LG pack is not here in the states. @AlanSubie4Life but he can add alot more and correct me where I am wrong.
I feel that Tesla is using these new cells, traveling 31 more miles with 1less kw of energy is a lot for just small improvements here and there like wheels and tires, heat pump. but I dont think the heating and or cooling is factored in the EPA test because its stationary I thought. so maybe they are software locking the the LR pack down to 77kw or a different number or maybe its a slight refresh to the refresh, or maybe it is all the new improvements and Tesla just really cranking down on the software. I due know for fact the new 21 M3P do not show the rated EPA range yet. that will come in a software update later im assuming and they dont charge as fast as my 19 M3P as well. only time will tell. I could be completely wrong in all of this.
Yes, I get most of my info from “Yo what’s up” Bjorn! He’s how I stayed sane-ish while waiting to get the car! LOL! Also, our Y has the denser cells. I remember Bjorn being surprised at the slower charging. I just wish we had the bill of lading or whatever it is that the Europeans get that expressly state that they’ve got x-size battery. I think you’re right about everything else.
Just wondering, I picked up my M3P 1.5 weeks ago. I live an apartment which doesn't have a charger so I have to use to a public charger. At 90% charge, I'm getting 275 miles. Is this about right?
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
You can take a picture of your battery label (totally not needed), or you can calculate (actually a projection as explained) your available energy remaining when charged to 100% (easy).
LR cars non-P do not have the larger battery. No evidence of that yet. The software-locked pack seems to apply to the 77.8kWh pack in Europe only.
The LG pack is actually only about 75kWh! And the Panasonics in the Europe LRs are software locked to about 75kWh. It's really strange, but there's a whole thread about it in the stickies. Here's a relevant summary. Remember, this thread is very Europe-centric and the situation in the US is much more simple AFAIK: Just a 77.8kWh pack and a (nameplate) 82.1kWh pack which actually has 80.7kWh.
Yes, that is true. Note that the 78.5kWh is the EPA number which never aligns with these other numbers quoted. it's normal for there to be some variation on this number. 78.5kWh is kind of the low end of the range but it doesn't imply that LR non-P 2021s have less energy than prior years.
That seems to be true for now.
Regarding 310 not 315 for the Performance - that seems to be fine for now for a battery with maximum capacity. It's not clear how things will change from here. Broadly speaking, I expect vehicles with undegraded batteries to eventually show 315 rated miles or maybe more (with accompanying fanfare), eventually.
That's a huge overstatement. Figuring out how the range display works in Tesla vehicles is actually pretty simple, once you know how it works (described in the second reference link in this post). The tedious poring through of EPA documents and understanding the method...yeah, that took a while, but is also pretty simple.
Boils down to: range is based on two (actually 5) dyno tests run by Tesla at Tesla:
EPA Range = scalar *( 0.55*City + 0.45*Hwy)
Where scalar is greater than 0.7, varies depending on vehicle and heat pump or lack thereof, because it is based on the results of all 5 cycles (some of which are done in cold and hot conditions).
So the final range depends on at least 5 different test cycles via the scalar, but the two core constituent City and Hwy cycles are actually done with no climate control on (and thus can be used to compare raw vehicle efficiency from year to year).
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AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
Depends on what you have your charge limit set to. You have to quote a % (not the calculation you made) and range.
.
It's a little low (by 3 or 4 miles) but if it's cold and stored outside that could be part of it. It may adjust very slightly in future too.
Thanks! It may be the cold then. The setting is just a line that doesn't tell me the exact percentage. I'm guessing I set it at about 90% though.
I'm set to whatever the non-trip default is. Guessing that's 90%, although my math is coming in at 88% (SoCal, so not very cold here... high 50s).
I don't think it's the cold. I just think it's realistic. You will usually see less than the EPA range with real world driving. The EPA range number is not 100% accurate by any means. I for one have never seen it on my car and don't know anyone that does that doesn't drive like a grandpa
Basically, whenever you see the EPA range number for any EV, subtract ~20 miles off of it
If you look up how the EPA achieves the range in their "tests", unless you drive like them (unrealistic) your car will never see that range.
275 is good on a Performance with 20's and heavy rims
You can take a picture of your battery label (totally not needed), or you can calculate (actually a projection as explained) your available energy remaining when charged to 100% (easy).
LR cars non-P do not have the larger battery. No evidence of that yet. The software-locked pack seems to apply to the 77.8kWh pack in Europe only.
The LG pack is actually only about 75kWh! And the Panasonics in the Europe LRs are software locked to about 75kWh. It's really strange, but there's a whole thread about it in the stickies. Here's a relevant summary. Remember, this thread is very Europe-centric and the situation in the US is much more simple AFAIK: Just a 77.8kWh pack and a (nameplate) 82.1kWh pack which actually has 80.7kWh.
Yes, that is true. Note that the 78.5kWh is the EPA number which never aligns with these other numbers quoted. it's normal for there to be some variation on this number. 78.5kWh is kind of the low end of the range but it doesn't imply that LR non-P 2021s have less energy than prior years.
That seems to be true for now.
Regarding 310 not 315 for the Performance - that seems to be fine for now for a battery with maximum capacity. It's not clear how things will change from here. Broadly speaking, I expect vehicles with undegraded batteries to eventually show 315 rated miles or maybe more (with accompanying fanfare), eventually.
The tedious poring through of EPA documents and understanding the method...yeah, that took a while, but is also pretty simple.
Boils down to: range is based on two (actually 5) dyno tests run by Tesla at Tesla:
EPA Range = scalar *( 0.55*City + 0.45*Hwy)
Where scalar is greater than 0.7, varies depending on vehicle and heat pump or lack thereof, because it is based on the results of all 5 cycles (some of which are done in cold and hot conditions).
So the final range depends on at least 5 different test cycles via the scalar, but the two core constituent City and Hwy cycles are actually done with no climate control on (and thus can be used to compare raw vehicle efficiency from year to year).
Big thanks!
What happened to all the upset/depressed complaints and anger. I’m missing it now lol, now we are interested in battery specs lol.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
It doesn’t always end up exactly at the target.
You can see what the % is in the car by going to Car -> Energy Display Mode -> Energy. And swap back and forth.
Or you can use the method linked above for battery capacity to assess your battery health.
That is generally true.
It doesn’t work that way. Remember, the range display has very little to do with range - it doesn’t display distance! - it displays ENERGY. It’s very confusing to people, because the units (miles) SEEM like units of distance. But they are not. The battery gauge shows you the BMS estimate (usually quite good) of how much energy you have left. It is always true that when the battery is cold, for a given charge level, there will be slightly less available energy. It’s generally just a mile or two difference for modest (35-50 degrees) cold.
That all being said, I think the likely issue here is that people are not quoting the % they are at, along with their number (both numbers are required concurrently and this is not possible in the app). What you can do in the app (but only when the car is charged to about 90%, no lower), is use the slider to slide to 100% and see the estimate.
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It’s hidden. Go to your Tesla account and then click on ‘details’ under your vin.
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