Regen braking and neck pain

[Kamban]

So on the first day we get the car and the salesperson stated to keep the Reg as standard. I take it out of the dealership and it is quite strong. As soon as I slowed and took my foot from the accelerator ( used to that technique in ICE car to let it coast to a red light) the car jerked and wants to stop abruptly. This was more pronounced in the interstate. Anyway I persisted and tried to keep my foot on the accelerator at all time. That night my wife, who was sitting in the passenger seat, started to have neck pain and it lasted 3 days.

Anyway we changed regen to low. She was driving it yesterday and even in that mode it jerked a bit when slowing down. I was sitting in the passenger seat and today I have a neck pain. I wonder how many Tesla passengers have experienced it while the drivers learned the correct reg technique. My Camry Hybrid and Acura MDX Hybrid have reg while taking off the foot from the accelerator and braking, but is not this strong.

After all this my wife is not too keen to go back to standard regen braking. I don't want to push it. My questions are

1. How much energy loss from non recapture occurs between low and standard regen. Out electricity costs are not expensive and extra costs while charging may not add too much. Does it matter on longer trips.

2. How much additional wear and tear is there on the brakes by using the brakes in the last few 10-20 yards. Neither of us are aggressive jack rabbit type of drivers. Would the brake pads have t be replaced much sooner. Anyone who has used low reg braking can comment on this?

 

[Eno Deb]

Don't be deterred by the first day experience. You will soon learn how to modulate the accelerator pedal more carefully, and drive as smoothly as you did before.

 

[jjrandorin]

OP I dont have answers to the question you posed, but will tell you that learning to drive with regen can be different.. because "coasting" is actually pressing on the go pedal slightly less, not completely removing your foot from it. Removing your foot from the pedal is actually "braking" in an EV with regen braking.

You guys are likely experiencing neck pain because you are "tensing up" as your body is experiencing unfamiliar sensations while driving. Turn it on low until you get used to it. Dont worry about how much energy is lost or how much brake wear there is... its still cheaper to run than your ICE car(s) are / were, and still less brake usage than those cars were too.

If either of you know how to drive a manual transmission car (stick shift, or driving a stick as its known), it might help you both to think about it like that. mentally tell yourself that removing your foot from the go pedal is shifting gears down. The sensation is similar. If you dont know how to drive a stick, think of lifting your foot off as braking.

A WHOLE lot of people drive by "pulsing" the accelerator. They dont even realize it until they have to do something different. This is actually one of the reasons my wife does not like my model 3P. She drives that way (pulsing the accelerator) but that doesnt work in an EV because it feels like "start / stop / start / stop".

I never drove that way (pulsing the accelerator), so the transition was fast for me. You drive a Tesla with constant pressure on the accelerator, and slightly lifting off, or pressing down, vs fully lifting your foot off the accelerator like you may be used to.

Give it time, you will stop tensing up while you drive once your body gets used to what the car is doing. After that, then try standard regen.. but dont feel like you are doing anything wrong by putting it on low regen, or even turning on creep mode.

You can do it

 

[ksb467]

Hang in there, you’ll get used to it in full regen. 1 pedal is easier, and less work , than 2. It’s almost common sense if you step back and think about it, forgetting everything you learned from driving ICE cars.

 

[RTPEV]

Here's a little secret:

The MOST efficient way to drive is with the regen on low (actually coasting would be even better). Because regen has losses, you are never going to get out of it what you put into it. You are usually better off avoiding acceleration, keeping adequate distance between you and cars in front to just coast as much as you can. On other EVs (like the LEAF), if you hit the brake you are still going to get regen (for some reason, I don't think Teslas do this--it's a shame), so the best thing to do is just use as little regen as possible, and then use the brake when you absolutely need to.

What standard regen is good for:

1. One pedal driving. No denying that this is a convenience factor, especially in heavy traffic.
2. Reducing brake pad wear. With regen on STANDARD, I'm not sure my brake pads will EVER wear out!

But that's about it. It's not an energy saver by any means. If you can live without those two benefits, then set your regen to LOW and don't worry about it. Tesla fans love the STANDARD regen and think it's a great feature of the car, and they will insist on you using it too. But don't fall for the peer pressure if you don't like it. Just set it to LOW and enjoy the car.

And here's another secret:

Even though I think there is value in LOW regen, I personally have mine set to STANDARD. I have gotten used to it, and I do appreciate the fact that it reduces brake pad wear. I do wish it were easier to switch back and forth like I could on my LEAF. Then I could engage STANDARD regen only when needed. But alas, I now just have it in STANDARD all the time.

 

[ZOMGVTEK]

I initially thought standard regen was too strong, and I switched to low. A few days in I switched back to standard, ended up getting used to it, and now I think its too weak. I find its easier to drive with standard regen, and the full regen braking is basically in line with average braking anyways. It did take me about a week or two to get comfortable with it, but now its great. If you don't want to slow down as fast, just don't fully let off the pedal. It takes some experience to understand how strong its going to be, but then I find its easier than using the brake pedal. By all means, use low while you're getting used to the car if you'd like.

The physical friction brakes are in line with other vehicles of its weight and class, so they should last in the same range as typical cars if you never use regen at all. With mostly regen stops, they should last nearly forever aside from the issues with corrosion in harsher climates. In a mild climate, the stock brakes might last as long as the car is on the road. The energy lost by using low regen depends on how much you need to use the friction brakes. You should capture slightly more energy on low regen, but it takes a lot longer so its usually way less practical to ride regen all the way down to 5mph without pissing people off. Either way, the cost of the energy is more or less trivial in most every case. Use it however you're comfortable.

 

[ewoodrick]

Here's a little secret:

The MOST efficient way to drive is with the regen on low (actually coasting would be even better). Because regen has losses, you are never going to get out of it what you put into it. You are usually better off avoiding acceleration, keeping adequate distance between you and cars in front to just coast as much as you can. On other EVs (like the LEAF), if you hit the brake you are still going to get regen (for some reason, I don't think Teslas do this--it's a shame), so the best thing to do is just use as little regen as possible, and then use the brake when you absolutely need to.

What standard regen is good for:

1. One pedal driving. No denying that this is a convenience factor, especially in heavy traffic.
2. Reducing brake pad wear. With regen on STANDARD, I'm not sure my brake pads will EVER wear out!

But that's about it. It's not an energy saver by any means. If you can live without those two benefits, then set your regen to LOW and don't worry about it. Tesla fans love the STANDARD regen and think it's a great feature of the car, and they will insist on you using it too. But don't fall for the peer pressure if you don't like it. Just set it to LOW and enjoy the car.

And here's another secret:

Even though I think there is value in LOW regen, I personally have mine set to STANDARD. I have gotten used to it, and I do appreciate the fact that it reduces brake pad wear. I do wish it were easier to switch back and forth like I could on my LEAF. Then I could engage STANDARD regen only when needed. But alas, I now just have it in STANDARD all the time.

Wow, it's amazing how wrong some people can be. Standard regen represents about 20-30% of your energy. Turn it off, range goes down.
A very simple example, I go up a mountain and a 15 mile drive take more then 50 miles of range. I come down the other side and I make back about 30 miles of range. On low regen, you wouldn't get this.
Standard regen allows your brakes to barely be used, lengthening life.

Leave it on standard, you will get used to it relatively quickly.

 

[justsomeguy]

Here's a little secret:

The MOST efficient way to drive is with the regen on low (actually coasting would be even better). Because regen has losses, you are never going to get out of it what you put into it. You are usually better off avoiding acceleration, keeping adequate distance between you and cars in front to just coast as much as you can. On other EVs (like the LEAF), if you hit the brake you are still going to get regen (for some reason, I don't think Teslas do this--it's a shame), so the best thing to do is just use as little regen as possible, and then use the brake when you absolutely need to.

What standard regen is good for:

1. One pedal driving. No denying that this is a convenience factor, especially in heavy traffic.
2. Reducing brake pad wear. With regen on STANDARD, I'm not sure my brake pads will EVER wear out!

But that's about it. It's not an energy saver by any means. If you can live without those two benefits, then set your regen to LOW and don't worry about it. Tesla fans love the STANDARD regen and think it's a great feature of the car, and they will insist on you using it too. But don't fall for the peer pressure if you don't like it. Just set it to LOW and enjoy the car.

And here's another secret:

Even though I think there is value in LOW regen, I personally have mine set to STANDARD. I have gotten used to it, and I do appreciate the fact that it reduces brake pad wear. I do wish it were easier to switch back and forth like I could on my LEAF. Then I could engage STANDARD regen only when needed. But alas, I now just have it in STANDARD all the time.

This is only accurate if you coast to a stop every single time. The idea is to use regen in lieu of braking, not for fun. It's absolutely impractical to coast to a stop, or near it, every single time.

 

[SigNC]

the accelerator pedal isn't an on off switch. Modulate it and it drives very smoothly. It can take some time to get used to this.

 

[SigNC]

Wow, it's amazing how wrong some people can be. Standard regen represents about 20-30% of your energy. Turn it off, range goes down.

His point was that you want to regen as little as possible to be more efficient as there are losses in regenning and then using that regenerated energy to get back up to speed. Of course, it's not practical to drive at a constant speed always but some people think the more they regen the better which isn't actually the case.

constant speed > regen > braking

 

[KenC]

So on the first day we get the car and the salesperson stated to keep the Reg as standard. I take it out of the dealership and it is quite strong. As soon as I slowed and took my foot from the accelerator ( used to that technique in ICE car to let it coast to a red light) the car jerked and wants to stop abruptly. This was more pronounced in the interstate. Anyway I persisted and tried to keep my foot on the accelerator at all time. That night my wife, who was sitting in the passenger seat, started to have neck pain and it lasted 3 days.

Anyway we changed regen to low. She was driving it yesterday and even in that mode it jerked a bit when slowing down. I was sitting in the passenger seat and today I have a neck pain. I wonder how many Tesla passengers have experienced it while the drivers learned the correct reg technique. My Camry Hybrid and Acura MDX Hybrid have reg while taking off the foot from the accelerator and braking, but is not this strong.

After all this my wife is not too keen to go back to standard regen braking. I don't want to push it. My questions are

1. How much energy loss from non recapture occurs between low and standard regen. Out electricity costs are not expensive and extra costs while charging may not add too much. Does it matter on longer trips.

2. How much additional wear and tear is there on the brakes by using the brakes in the last few 10-20 yards. Neither of us are aggressive jack rabbit type of drivers. Would the brake pads have t be replaced much sooner. Anyone who has used low reg braking can comment on this?

You certainly should transition to the Model 3 by using low regen, but as you get used to feathering the throttle, you'll find the regen less intrusive. I drive with full regen with my 90yr old disabled mom in the car, and she doesn't have any issues, because your right foot learns how to feather the throttle/brake, for smooth braking feel.

 

[animorph]

You have control of the amount of regen by how close you let the accelerator pedal get to the top of it's travel. If you were really good you could emulate Low regen or coasting while using Standard regen. Yes, if you just step off the pedal it can be a little abrupt.

Even Standard regen is not a lot of braking (I think about 0.2g compared to a max of near 1.0g). But it certainly is if you were used to coasting to a stop. Low regen is perfectly fine if that matches your driving style. You should be able to regen/coast down to about 5 MPH and then use the brakes to come to a full stop. Using Standard at its max level gives you a shorter stop than Low at its max level. If you find yourself using the brakes too much, try Standard regen again.

 

[David99]

I know it takes a few days to get used to one pedal driving with regen, but it is absolutely the better way to drive a car.

What I don't understand is when people say regen is too strong. That's like saying acceleration is too strong. If you want to accelerate less, you push the pedal less. It would be silly if someone would ask to have the pedal only allow 50% of the power so acceleration is not so hard. Everyone would say, just don't push the pedal all the way.

But when it comes to regen people make that exact point. They say regen is too strong and set it to 'low' which is reducing the max regen to 50%. Just as much as you can modulate power with the pedal, you can modulate regen with the pedal.

It is the old ICE drive style of letting go of the pedal all the way. Once you have learned to keep the foot resting on the pedal, you can drive perfectly smooth and gentle. Actually much smoother than any ICE car.

 

[North75]

The physical friction brakes are in line with other vehicles of its weight and class, so they should last in the same range as typical cars if you never use regen at all. With mostly regen stops, they should last nearly forever aside from the issues with corrosion in harsher climates. In a mild climate, the stock brakes might last as long as the car is on the road. The energy lost by using low regen depends on how much you need to use the friction brakes. You should capture slightly more energy on low regen, but it takes a lot longer so its usually way less practical to ride regen all the way down to 5mph without pissing people off. Either way, the cost of the energy is more or less trivial in most every case. Use it however you're comfortable.

My favorite thing about standard regen is not having to clean all the brake dust off of my wheels any more. I have the 19” sports and they stay close to pristine. So easy to clean.

 

[raptor5244]

I think you are straining your necks from flooring it, not the regen. Remember, head back against the headrest first, then punch it.

 

[ewoodrick]

His point was that you want to regen as little as possible to be more efficient as there are losses in regenning and then using that regenerated energy to get back up to speed. Of course, it's not practical to drive at a constant speed always but some people think the more they regen the better which isn't actually the case.

constant speed > regen > braking

You really can't make that statement if you don't include the phrase "and never use the brakes"

 

[SigNC]

You really can't make that statement if you don't include the phrase "and never use the brakes"

Sure I can, as you see in my post braking is the least efficient

 

[towndrunk]

Visit a chiropractor.

 

[mswlogo]

OP is driving it wrong. There is no reason for abrupt stops on either regen setting. Let off throttle gradually.

I agree that regen on low can sometimes actually be more efficient. Mainly on the highway. Locally and in traffic standard regen is usually better. In situations you can’t plan your stops standard is better. But when you can plan your stops or on highway low can be slightly more efficient.

 

[XLR82XS]

2. How much additional wear and tear is there on the brakes by using the brakes in the last few 10-20 yards. Neither of us are aggressive jack rabbit type of drivers. Would the brake pads have t be replaced much sooner. Anyone who has used low reg braking can comment on this?

Brakes work like other cars - the harder you use them the shorter the life span. 10-20 yard deal will certainly not decrease the pad life span compared to having ZERO regen like an ICE vehicle.