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Resell Strength - Model S or Model X Better?

Discussion in 'Model S' started by tedrosenberger, Nov 30, 2017.

  1. tedrosenberger

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    Curious about something:

    So far is the Model S or the Model X holding its value better in terms of average resale values when compared to one another?

    E.G. , what's more valuable: a 2016 P90D Model X or a 2016 P90D Model S with the same mileage, same orlginal MSRP, same condition, etc.

    Thanks!

    Ted
     
  2. tedrosenberger

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    #2 tedrosenberger, Nov 30, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 30, 2017
    Curious about something:

    So far, which is holding its value better in terms of average resale values when compared to one another: ihe Model S or the Model X ?

    E.G.: What's going to sell for more on average: a 2016 P90D Model X or a 2016 P90D Model S with the same mileage, the same orlginal MSRP, in the same color and the same condition...

    Thanks!

    Ted

    Moderator note (bmah): The first two posts in this thread appear to be duplicates, starting two different threads. I've combined those two threads.
     
  3. Xenoilphobe

    Xenoilphobe Active Member

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    Just based on reliability, the S does better.
     
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  4. calisnow

    calisnow Banned

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    Huh? That wasn't his question.
     
  5. Xenoilphobe

    Xenoilphobe Active Member

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    #5 Xenoilphobe, Dec 24, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2017
    If you look at the IRS guidelines, you can deduct over $30,000+ in the first year of ownership on the X as a small business owner. Under Section 179 you get $25K the first year plus Section 30D gives you another $7500 your first year, plus whatever your state will kick in,which is between 0 and $8000 depending on the state you live in and how much money you make. So minimum write down is $32,500 and maximum is $40,500 based on where you live and your business situation on a X.

    Every business owner will take these write downs, so assume the first year depreciation on a X is $25,000 (we will ignore the state kicking in, due to the limited # of states that allow it and the fact that the S can get the Section 30D, $7500 deduction as well. The reality is that this will also impact resale value for the X and S equally. So take another $7500 off ($32,500 total in first year depreciation)

    The model S does get the Section 179 allowance, but it is limited to $11060 for businesses, due to the weight being too low and doesn't have the steep write down in the first year, like the X.. Also the S's reliability is significantly higher due to the lack of the Falcon Wing doors and auto open front doors and his been on the market longer, has longer range, and accelerates faster, the only downside is 15 cubic feet of cargo space difference between the S and X. So the minimum write down for an S is $18760 and the maximum is $26,760, again based on where you live and your business situation on the use of your S.

    So you would be crazy to buy an S, if you could exploit the small business sections of the IRS code, if not you would be crazy to buy an X as it costs more, depreciates faster, is slower, more complex, and has less range. Also, you can tow with and X, which will accelerate the depreciation faster as well.

    At least that's how I look at it, I'm not a small business owner, but I will be in 2018.

    My 3 (2013, 2014, 2016.5) Model S's have been rock solid, I've never owned an X, but might if I could write down $35K in one year.

    A savy used car buyer will immediately subtract all these deduction elements on any used X or S, then add deductions for mileage, wear and tear etc.. I would never pay over $100K for any used Tesla especially an X due to these significant deductions, you are better off getting a never titled demo and taking the deductions yourself in most cases. Section 179 can be used on used vehicles as well, so that could provide lower cap-x costs for the business buyers on both the S and X.

    YMMV
     
  6. Xenoilphobe

    Xenoilphobe Active Member

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    #6 Xenoilphobe, Dec 24, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2017
  7. Xenoilphobe

    Xenoilphobe Active Member

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  8. BerTX

    BerTX Supporting Member

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    They are cars. Resale value is not a reason to buy a car. Cars are not investments.
     
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  9. Xenoilphobe

    Xenoilphobe Active Member

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    #9 Xenoilphobe, Dec 26, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2017
    I think most people disagree about not caring about loss, no it's not an investment, but what if I want to buy the new P150DL in 18 months, this would impact my buying power and Total Cost Ownership (TCO) does include depreciation, as it impacts the cost to own the car over the period of use.

    Fortunately Section 179 and Section 30D helps with the TCO calculation for those that do care that they could lose <$40K on their X and <$26K on their S purchase a minute after they sign their sales agreement.

    About True Cost to Own®
    Edmunds.com's True Cost to Own® (TCO®) is proprietary data that helps you estimate the total five-year cost of buying and owning a vehicle — including some items you may not have taken into consideration. A benefit of using our TCO® tool is that you can easily compare the five-year totals for different vehicles and make a more informed choice.

    The components of TCO® are depreciation, interest on financing, taxes and fees, insurance premiums, fuel, maintenance, repairs and any federal tax credit that may be available. In order to estimate certain mileage-dependent costs, we assume that vehicles will be driven 15,000 miles per year. For a used vehicle, we calculate the years the vehicle has been driven using the nominal difference between the current calendar year and the vehicle's model year, and assume that it was driven 15,000 miles during each of those years.

    Note that TCO® is a comparative tool, not a predictive tool — your actual five-year cost of owning a particular vehicle will vary depending on your personal circumstances, such as your driving history and the number of miles you drive.

    How We Calculate True Cost to Own®
    The True Cost to Own® calculations use the following set of assumptions:

    • Ownership expenses are estimated for a five-year period
    • You will drive 15,000 miles per year
    • You are financing the vehicle using traditional financing, not lease financing
    • You have an above-average credit rating for the purpose of determining your finance rate
    • You are making a 10% down payment on the vehicle at purchase
    • Your loan term is 60 months
    Using proprietary formulas, we calculate the five-year costs for the seven cost categories that make up the TCO® (depreciation, insurance, financing, taxes & fees, fuel, maintenance and repairs). We also take into account any applicable federal tax credit.

    Explanation of True Cost to Own® Terms
    Total Cash Price

    For new vehicles, the Total Cash Price displayed is the vehicle's True Market Value® (TMV®) price plus typically equipped options, destination charge, base tax and fees assessed by your state, and, if applicable, gas guzzler tax; less any widely available manufacturer-to-customer cash rebates. (However, we do not account for other types of cash rebates or incentives because of the variability of those offers and their eligibility requirements.) For used vehicles, the Total Cash Price shown is the sum of the vehicle's Private Party TMV® price in "clean" condition plus typically equipped options, and base tax and fees assessed by your state.

    Depreciation
    This is the amount by which the value of a vehicle declines from its purchase price to its estimated resale value. The purchase price employed is the vehicle's Total Cash Price, minus any taxes and fees included in that amount. We estimate the resale value assuming the vehicle will be in "clean" condition, will be driven 15,000 miles per year, and will be sold to a private party.

    Insurance
    This is the estimated average annual insurance premium in your state. The premium has been determined based on annual premium data for defined driver profiles and coverages (liability, comprehensive and collision) from a major national insurer. While this information is specific to vehicle make, model, model year and body type, your personal information is not taken into consideration and could greatly alter the actual premium quoted by an insurer. Factors that will affect your rate include your age, marital status, credit history, driving record, and the garaging address of your vehicle.

    Financing
    This is the interest expense on a loan in the amount of the Total Cash Price, assuming a 10% down payment and a loan term of 60 months. The interest rate used is the prevailing rate that banks and other direct automotive lenders are currently charging consumers in your geographic region who have above average credit scores.

    Note: Even if you do not finance your vehicle, the inclusion of financing cost in determining True Cost to Own® is still appropriate because it reflects the estimated "opportunity cost" (i.e., the amount you may earn) if you invest the Purchase Price instead of using it to purchase the vehicle.

    Taxes & Fees
    This consists of the base sales (or use) taxes, license and registration fees in your state, and gas guzzler tax if applicable. These taxes and fees are often based on a percentage of the purchase price, and generally decrease as the vehicle ages and loses its value.

    Note: the state sales/use tax rate that we use includes the average local and county taxes assessed in that state.

    Fuel
    This expense is based on the revised EPA mileage ratings, assuming consumption consists of 45% highway and 55% city driving and that the vehicle is equipped with the transmission that is standard equipment for that vehicle. Cost estimates are based on the current one-year moving average of self-service prices in your state, using regular unleaded gasoline for vehicles whose manufacturers require regular; premium unleaded gasoline for vehicles whose manufacturers recommend or require premium; or diesel fuel for diesel vehicles.

    Maintenance
    This is the estimated expense of the two types of maintenance: scheduled and unscheduled. Scheduled maintenance is the performance of factory-recommended items at periodic mileage and/or calendar intervals. Unscheduled maintenance includes wheel alignment and the replacement of items such as the battery, brakes, headlamps, hoses, exhaust system parts, taillight/turn signal bulbs, tires and wiper blades/inserts. Estimated tire replacement costs are supplied to Edmunds.com by The Tire Rack, Inc.

    Repairs
    This is the estimated expense for repairs not covered by the vehicle manufacturer's warranties over the five years from the date of purchase, assuming 15,000 miles are driven annually. We estimate this expense based on the cost of a typical "zero deductible" extended warranty for the vehicle, minus the estimated amount of that cost that consists of the warranty provider's overhead and profit.

    Federal Tax Credits
    This is the tax credit that is provided for under the Energy Policy Act of 2005. A tax credit is subtracted directly from the total amount of federal tax you owe. The tax credit is for electric fuel vehicles.

    The credit is only available to the original purchaser of a new, qualifying vehicle, and is subject to certain "phase out" rules that we take into consideration when computing TCO®. If a qualifying vehicle is leased to a consumer, the leasing company may claim the credit.
     
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