Retuning a Long Range Model X

[Sm7400]

The range of our Long Range Model X is about 125 kms of city driving after a supercharge to 80%. This is not acceptable.

I’m aware of all the issues around cold weather and driving habits, none of that can explain range this low. I can only imagine if we had gone with the 22 inch wheels or the performance version (would it be less than 100kms?) We were advised of reduced range in the cold weather upon purchase but nothing to suggest it would be impacted this significantly. I feel like the sales experience and marketing materials are wildly misleading.

Does anyone have any experience with getting a settlement in this regard though some type of lemon law, or though CAMVAP (the defective vehicle arbitration program in Canada)?

 

[mswlogo]

The range of our Long Range Model X is about 125 kms of city driving after a supercharge to 80%. This is not acceptable.

I’m aware of all the issues around cold weather and driving habits, none of that can explain range this low. I can only imagine if we had gone with the 22 inch wheels or the performance version (would it be less than 100kms?) We were advised of reduced range in the cold weather upon purchase but nothing to suggest it would be impacted this significantly. I feel like the sales experience and marketing materials are wildly misleading.

Does anyone have any experience with getting a settlement in this regard though some type of lemon law, or though CAMVAP (the defective vehicle arbitration program in Canada)?

That's 77 miles !!!

Well it really depends on what you are doing during that time.
If you drove 2 miles and parked for 8 hours and then 2 miles 38 times I'd be amazed you'd even get that distance.
How long a period is that over, 77 miles in the city in one day or over weeks?

Do you have summon stand by enabled?
Do you have sentry enabled?
Are you preconditioning a lot (total waste of energy in my opinion)?
Do you have range mode enabled?

How cold is it? If you have a snow flake showing, that is not lost range, it's just not accessible until it warms up (from normal driving, typically).

Gets pretty darn cold in NH and MA and I'm fine with the Long Range Raven (non Plus) 20" wheels. Can always use more though.

You didn't say if yours is a Raven which was a step up on range. Did you buy it new?

 

[Sm7400]

This was a little over a week. With a few trips between 5-10km each way. No summon or sentry. We were told preconditioning is actually better for range some it warms the battery. Temps are around 30-40 degrees.

I don’t know what Raven is so no I don’t think it is.

 

[MXLRplus]

The overnight losses on the MX can be as high as 3% a day. It's really high for an EV. So driving just a few miles a day will make it look like it has terrible range.

 

[animorph]

Our X has averaged about 90% of EPA range under mild to very hot weather conditions, while actually driving, per TeslaFi data records. My Porsche used to average about 14 MPG around the city while it's EPA rated MPG was 19 MPG. So my Porsche was even worse than the X as far as actual vs. advertised. Who tests their ICE car range and complains if it fails the test?

Lots of short trips in cold weather plus days of vampire drain (or very high speed driving) will make the range look bad. But it's all normal. Take a long trip without exceeding the speed limit and you'll do much better.

Use ABetterRoutePlanner for long trips and you shouldn't have any surprises during normal weather.

 

[Zaxxon]

Yeah, you are either seeing very worst-case situations, or you're wasting more on preconditioning than on driving, or something is wrong with your car. What you describe is not even close to normal.

I live in Colorado, where we get quite cold and deal with large elevation changes.

My lifetime data:

Since last charge nearly a week ago, just short drives:

2019 X LR, 20" wheels.

 

[Sm7400]

I have contacted Tesla to see about a fix.
Thank you for those who responded.

In terms of a comparison to MPG. That’s not the appropriate comparison. MPG is time spent driving which can fluctuate widely, I agree. But this vehicle is sold on the basis of the range it can travel based on a charge and it’s hitting 20% to 25% of what is advertised. They don’t sell ICE cars on the basis of kilometres to a tank of gas. This is a consumer protection and false advertising issue, not an issue of the physics of the battery. It may well be working within normal parameters, but that is not acceptable to me as a consumer who was sold something very different.

I don’t believe any reasonable person who lives in Canada would be expected to understand that a car with 450+ km range actually gets 125kms when it’s “cold” out.

I will keep the thread updated as I engage with Tesla.

 

[mswlogo]

This was a little over a week. With a few trips between 5-10km each way. No summon or sentry. We were told preconditioning is actually better for range some it warms the battery. Temps are around 30-40 degrees.

I don’t know what Raven is so no I don’t think it is.

What is the build date?
All X’s built around March 2019 or later are Raven’s

If you are preconditioning while plugged in, yes that will help range. Still a waste of energy but it will help range. If you are preconditioning while not at home (like before leaving work) you will use up a lot of energy and no, it’s not more efficient.

 

[mswlogo]

The overnight losses on the MX can be as high as 3% a day. It's really high for an EV. So driving just a few miles a day will make it look like it has terrible range.

My X doesn’t hit close to 3% a day. More like 1% or less a day. I don’t run apps (that say it doesn’t drain it), no sentry, no summon standby, range mode and I have a habit of turning the HVAC off every time I park, because that can waste a lot when I’m packing or unpacking the car. Sure wish there was a HVAC mode that would be off unless the car is in drive.

BTW I just had a headlight replaced and it was at a certified shop for 2.5 weeks. They disconnect the main battery while in the shop. It didn’t lose a single mile the whole 2.5 weeks. So it’s not the batteries themselves that self drain. It’s all usage.

 

[MXLRplus]

My X doesn’t hit close to 3% a day. More like 1% or less a day. I don’t run apps (that say it doesn’t drain it), no sentry, no summon standby, range mode and I have a habit of turning the HVAC off every time I park, because that can waste a lot when I’m packing or unpacking the car. Sure wish there was a HVAC mode that would be off unless the car is in drive.

BTW I just had a headlight replaced and it was at a certified shop for 2.5 weeks. They disconnect the main battery while in the shop. It didn’t lose a single mile the whole 2.5 weeks. So it’s not the batteries themselves that self drain. It’s all usage.

So your X uses less. Mine is 100% stock and it has lost 3% on some winter days, average loss is about 2%. Compare this to my I-Pace that lost <1% in 30 days parked, not plugged in. Just parked it. Full factory drain rate including telemetry and alarm. The Bolt and Volt are also stable when parked.

OK - I came home from work at 1:30 and 37%. It is now at 33% at 11:14. However it did do an update. Sentry is not on when at home by geolocation.

 

[Sm7400]

What is the build date?
All X’s built around March 2019 or later are Raven’s

If you are preconditioning while plugged in, yes that will help range. Still a waste of energy but it will help range. If you are preconditioning while not at home (like before leaving work) you will use up a lot of energy and no, it’s not more efficient.

It’s a 2021 so I suppose it’s a Raven.

 

[pl8dlikafiddle]

I have a feeling you’re preconditioning while not plugged in...

 

[mswlogo]

I have a feeling you’re preconditioning while not plugged in...

I think the picture is coming into focus.

Running a week off one supercharge to 80% sounds like he has no charging at home. And mentioned preconditioning. He probably thought he could charge once a week at a super charger and not quite making it. In winter.

Big mistake not charging at home. Which Tesla WILL encourage.

If you have no charging at home it’s not going to be as convenient to own. Period.

To solve the problem get charging at home or work, ideally at home. Even if slow, get it.

Don’t precondition when not plugged in. Unless the car is iced up or you KNOW the cost. Precondition while plugged in does increase range a little but total energy cost will be higher.

Keep HVAC off when not driving. I find it wastes a bit of energy while packing and unpacking the car (which I often do).

Turn on range mode. It will spend less energy heating battery. Especially when preconditioning.

If you don’t have charging at home charge to 90%. I think 80% is good for nightly charge. But if your trying to maximize a charge, charge higher.

You will have some phantom drain over a week. You will have more if you drive it every day for a week vs it sat for a week. Most of the phantom drain is like after the first 8 hours after parking it. After that it tends to level off.

So a good part of your battery usage is not driving but preconditioning, warming up and cooling down.

Cold has its largest impact at “start up”. 5-10 “startups” in cold weather is a lot of battery usage on one charge. Once the car is fully warmed cold is not that big an impact (10-20%). But during “startup” it’s easily 50% hit. You’ll see 600 wh/mi for 15 min in a cold car. Then you shut it off and do it again and again.

 

[MrTuna]

I don’t understand doing a PEV without at home charging. Seems like such a hassle.

 

[Sm7400]

The vehicle with the longest range was specifically purchased because home charging doesn’t work for us. We live in house downtown in the largest city in Canada. The appeal of the Tesla was the range such that we didn’t need to worry about at home charging solutions. A bi-weekly trip to a supercharger would be more than plenty even in the winter. It appears this isn’t a battery issue, but rather a misrepresentation of what we were purchasing when we discussed our needs with the salesperson. We said we drive 5-10 kms a day each way to work. With a range of almost 600kms we were told this vehicle would have no problem doing that. I think any reasonable person would agree there is a problem here. Shockingly, the vehicle is now expensive to operate than a gasoline vehicle.

 

[Zaxxon]

It's not a misrepresentation issue. Calm down. Your numbers are not normal, and it's either a misunderstanding of when to waste energy and when to not on your part (eg preconditioning), or something causing your vehicle not to sleep. Also, you should definitely be charging to 90% given your circumstances. As I and others have shown with data to back it up, what you describe is abnormal. Either you or Tesla will figure it out.

Or not. But please stop claiming that 78 mi on a charge is normal.

 

[mswlogo]

The vehicle with the longest range was specifically purchased because home charging doesn’t work for us. We live in house downtown in the largest city in Canada. The appeal of the Tesla was the range such that we didn’t need to worry about at home charging solutions. A bi-weekly trip to a supercharger would be more than plenty even in the winter. It appears this isn’t a battery issue, but rather a misrepresentation of what we were purchasing when we discussed our needs with the salesperson. We said we drive 5-10 kms a day each way to work. With a range of almost 600kms we were told this vehicle would have no problem doing that. I think any reasonable person would agree there is a problem here. Shockingly, the vehicle is now expensive to operate than a gasoline vehicle.

Hmmm, when researching an expensive purchase you trust advice from the sales person vs the owners?

I noticed you were reluctant to give the full story in your opening post because you knew the reason now.

Unfortunately you bought the car at the worst time of year to enjoy it (range wise). Give it a year.

Do some of the things I suggested and you will probably double your range. When Tesla does recommend preconditioning they are assuming you are plugged in. Stop doing it unless it’s iced up. Or keep it real short (5 minutes) Cabin warms up pretty fast.

Wait until weather warms up to judge the vehicle. You’ll probably get away with your plan 9 months of the year. I do better than EPA in summer.

But I would NEVER advise anyone to get an EV without home charging. Period. It will get even older over time. It’s also not healthy for the battery to supercharge every time.

I would also advise not considering a Tesla without a garage in regions that get ice and snow. Plenty of happy customers that deal with it, but I certainly wouldn’t want to. If I know I might have to deal with snow or ice at work, I take my other car. Dealing with every snow storm, in a bad winter would not be fun with a Tesla. It’s also not quite as cold in the garage so not as hard an impact without.

 

[mswlogo]

It's not a misrepresentation issue. Calm down. Your numbers are not normal, and it's either a misunderstanding of when to waste energy and when to not on your part (eg preconditioning), or something causing your vehicle not to sleep. Also, you should definitely be charging to 90% given your circumstances. As I and others have shown with data to back it up, what you describe is abnormal. Either you or Tesla will figure it out.

Or not. But please stop claiming that 78 mi on a charge is normal.

I don’t think anything is wrong with his car. Also depending on how busy the supercharger he is at, it might be limited to 80%. But yeah, definitely 90% if allowed, especially in winter. Maybe even 92% and target it, so when he parks at home (or work) he parks it for the day (or night) at 90%.

 

[Sm7400]

It's not a misrepresentation issue. Calm down. Your numbers are not normal, and it's either a misunderstanding of when to waste energy and when to not on your part (eg preconditioning), or something causing your vehicle not to sleep. Also, you should definitely be charging to 90% given your circumstances. As I and others have shown with data to back it up, what you describe is abnormal. Either you or Tesla will figure it out.

Or not. But please stop claiming that 78 mi on a charge is normal.

I’m not saying it’s normal. The company who sold me the car is saying it is. I said if it normal then the company represented the vehicle when they sold it. Their service tech came to the house and said it loses range in the winter time and to plug it in. I was fully aware of the fact it can be lower than advertised. No one, including me, is suggesting I should get exactly the advertised range of 597kms in Winter time with intermittent driving. The question in this thread is this: is the range degradation within reasonable expectations.

 

[MXLRplus]

So your X uses less. Mine is 100% stock and it has lost 3% on some winter days, average loss is about 2%. Compare this to my I-Pace that lost <1% in 30 days parked, not plugged in. Just parked it. Full factory drain rate including telemetry and alarm. The Bolt and Volt are also stable when parked.

OK - I came home from work at 1:30 and 37%. It is now at 33% at 11:14. However it did do an update. Sentry is not on when at home by geolocation.

Update: Today at 8 am it's 31%, no sentry.