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Roadster on Destination Charging Doesn't Work

Discussion in 'Roadster' started by dpeilow, Jul 10, 2016.

  1. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    I was passing a destination charger earlier today so I tried plugging in using the Can.

    Short answer is it doesn't work and throws a pilot signal error.

    20160710_155653.jpg 20160710_155427.jpg 20160710_155416.jpg 20160710_155345.jpg
     
  2. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    You need to contact TMC member @hcsharp and see if he can help you.

    I have one of Henry's SR CAN units and it has worked perfectly for me with several HPWCs. But users have found that sometimes it doesn't work at certain chargers.
     
  3. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    If you look in picture 3, that is an @hcsharp Can. I mentioned it in my first sentence in that post. It is the Type 2 Can that works with European type 2 connectors (as used on the Model S here and various other EVs) and it has worked on every other type 2 charger.

    There is something funky about the way Tesla is doing the pilot signal on these destination chargers to limit them to Model S/X and not other makes. In doing so, the Roadster is collateral damage.
     
  4. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, I failed to recognize that you are using the European type 2 Tesla connector.

    So your theory is that there is something different about the pilot signal uses in Europe in its HPWCs compared to the US and that makes them not compatible with Henry's SR CAN version for Europe?

    Have other European users of Henry's SR CAN version for Europe reported this problem?

    I know that there have been a few reports in the US that Henry's SR CAN didn't work with certain HPWCs in the US, but it seems to be rare.
     
  5. dhrivnak

    dhrivnak Active Member

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    Another option is the Roadster firmware. Most cars needed the firmware updated to handle the 80 amp pilot signal. I have used Henry's CAN SR with success on several destination chargers.
     
  6. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    The European Model Ss have 3 phase 22kW charging which means the Roadster would normally see one phase for 32A, 7kW.

    However there was already a rumour that Tesla destination chargers were doing something non-standard in the handshake phase to exclude other cars and this seems to confirm it.
     
  7. markwj

    markwj Moderator, Asia Pacific

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    The original 40A single phase wall connectors had a very strange internal wiring arrangement and pilot signal. Only Model S and Model X can charge off those.

    The newer 32A single/three phase wall connectors are more standard and reportedly have standard pilot signals. Other vehicles should be able to charge on these, but not supported by Tesla. There is an internal switch to control the pilot signal legacy/standard, that might be causing this issue.

    The picture you show seems to be the newer style 32A single/three phase one (cable wraps around the top, and handle goes in the side).
     
  8. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    I've recently received another report that the Roadster won't charge from the EU destination chargers, but it charges just fine from the same charger sold for private home use. If they are limiting to Model S/X then I suspect it's a communication error at Tesla. I don't know for sure but I'll do my best to find out.

    In North America there was communication from Tesla, including the Destination charging staff that they did not want to exclude Roadsters from the network. I can't help but wonder if something was overlooked in Europe because I seriously doubt it was their intention to exclude Roadsters.

    @dpeilow, can you provide me with some information? Was that one of the new HPWCs that was just released in the last couple of months? It looks like it is but I can't tell for sure. When it fails, does the HPWC blink out an error code with its red LED? If so, what's the code (how many times does the light flash between pauses)? Thanks.
     
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  9. simonog

    simonog Member

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    Let me know if you need more UK data: there's a couple of Tesla destination charger 30 minutes from me that I can get access to.they are brand new as of 3 weeks ago.
     
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  10. Marius

    Marius Member

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    Is there any news on this? Can the Roadster use the destination chargers from Tesla?
     
  11. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

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    Yes there is news on this. There was a communications oversight within Tesla that resulted in the new destination chargers being incompatible with Roadsters. Tesla is now aware of the problem and is working on a solution. They haven't committed to a time frame for when it will be completed but they said they'd like to do it right away. Not all the new Destination chargers have this problem, but most of them do.

    You can tell if it's one of the new chargers if the cable connector has a place to be stored in the side of the HPWC. The older HPWCs, which are supposedly more Roadster friendly, store the connector in a separate plastic cable hanger.

    This information applies to Destination chargers in all regions, including North America, Europe, Asia/HK, etc.
     
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  12. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    Henry, thanks for that information. Unnerving. I may have come across one of those incompatible Destination Chargers recently.
     
  13. ViperDoc

    ViperDoc Roadster 1305

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    Wow Henry, that really sucks. So the new Model S destination chargers lock the Roadsters out of the equation, and you won't know it until you get there or you get someone at the destination to send you a photo of the charger to how it stores the connector? That is just bad...
     
  14. gregd

    gregd Member

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    Wow, indeed. Since I doubt the deployed EVSEs will get updated, are (can) they put a fix into the Roadster firmware to work around it? This is a really big deal, as ViperDoc says.
     
  15. AEdennis

    AEdennis Active Member

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    Well that's disconcerting. I just installed one of those at home FOR my wife's Roadster. I wonder when they'll have a fix.
     
  16. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    I just found a photo of the Destination Charger I first tried to use on September 16th and discovered nothing happened when I plugged it into my Roadster using my CAN S/R (see photo shown below, it is the new style HPWC). I was quite surprised, as was the proprietor of the establishment I was staying at, The Old West Inn in Willits, California. His HPWC and the Clipper Creek J1772 unit he had were newly installed and I was the first EV to try to use them. I ended up charging from the Clipper Creek using my Tesla Roadster J1772 adaptor and it worked fine (fortunately as I was 150 miles from home and EV charging is pretty scarce in Willits!). I told the proprietor to contact Tesla about his new HPWC. I followed up with him a few weeks ago and he said Tesla was shipping him a new HPWC. I was at his establishment for the second time on October 21st. The new HPWC had not arrived yet so again I used the Clipper Creek. The new HPWC has now arrived at his hotel but is not installed yet. However, now I know that probably the next time I am there it still won't work for me. I hope Tesla fixes this soon, but there will be a lot of HPWCs out there that may never be fixed if the destination doesn't take the initiative to do so.

    IMG_2128.JPG
     
  17. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    Yes, a photo will ID the charger so you can determine if it will work or not, or you can ask the destination to look at the charger and tell you if the cable end can be inserted into the side of the charger (new style) or if it simply hangs free (old style)
    Have you tried charging her Roadster using your new HPWC? Please let us know...
     
  18. AEdennis

    AEdennis Active Member

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    Will do. It's caught a snag with its annual... been at service center for over a month waiting on a refurb 1.5 motor that just arrived...

    New HPWC installed a week after Roadster went in to service center.
     
  19. ViviV

    ViviV Member

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    I am reading this thread with concern and would like some clarification.
    At home we have the old type 80 amp HPWC (does not hook on the side) and does not do power sharing.
    It works fine with the Henry Sharp CAN Sr to charge the Roadster (now that the firmware was updated).
    However, last week we purchased 2 new Wall Connectors in order to be able to share the 100 amp service between the two wall connectors for a MS, Roadster, and next year the M3 in our home garage. These are not yet installed.
    Should I be concerned that the new Wall Connectors will not work like the old one to charge the Roadster?
    If that is the case, is there a way to fix this? I am unclear about this from the thread discussion and would like advice before we call the electrician to install.
     
  20. Jeff N

    Jeff N Active Member

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    Just curious... Does anyone know what the incompatibility is?
     

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