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Rumor: Electric BMW 4 Series GT Coming to Take on Tesla Model 3

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by zenmaster, May 13, 2017.

  1. zenmaster

    zenmaster Member

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    • Informative x 3
  2. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    I find it interesting that their de-facto approach to AWD is, a "frontmounted electric motor in combination with a fixed-ratio gearbox and so-called electric propeller shaft to channel drive to the rear wheels" , whereas their plan for an optional dual-motor setup is described as "The second, more complex and costly solution"

    Certainly the former solution is more familiar to BMW, but that seems to indicate to me that the issues of motor control and software design are larger challenges for BMW in comparison to the mechanical complexity (and disadvantages) presented by traditional mechanical AWD drivelines... including a tunnel with a shaft running down the center of the car and some sort of mechanical spilt coupling to manage torque distribution.
     
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  3. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    There there is absolutely no explanation that covers using a long driveshaft with a front electric motor setup other than Walmart engineering. Having a center hump, more parts weight cost, rotational weight, noise,
     
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  4. Reciprocity

    Reciprocity Active Member

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    The more competition the better for us consumers. It's clear Tesla is forcing other manufacturers to accelerate plans, it's great news for everyone, including Tesla and BMW.

    The future waits for no one. Lead, follow or get out of the way.
     
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  5. Marc_GA

    Marc_GA Member

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    2020. There will be a few model 3's on the road by then.
     
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  6. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Well-Known Member

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    That's true, IF it's actually competition. When you show up at the horse show with a camel, you're not competition for the horses. Just sayin...
     
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  7. JohnSnowNW

    JohnSnowNW Active Member

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    It's great that they're moving towards electrification, but this trope of every vehicle with some AER being competitive with Tesla needs to stop.
     
  8. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    I don't read that article as saying that the upcoming 4-series EV will be "de facto" a front motor/rear drive design.

    From that article: "BMW is weighing up two electric driveline options for its new Model 3 rival, with a decision expected by the end of this year prior to the construction of road-going prototypes early next year. The first uses a frontmounted electric motor in combination with a fixed-ratio gearbox and so-called electric propeller shaft to channel drive to the rear wheels. This layout would provide the new model with traditional BMW traits and, according to at least one source, the best possible weight distribution. The second, more complex and costly solution proposes the use of two electric motors, one mounted up front driving the front wheels and a second at the rear within the axle assembly to drive the rear wheels. Similar to the system that is set to appear on the electric-powered X3, it offers the choice between front and four-wheel drive, depending on the drive mode selected."

    So according to that, BMW is simply evaluating those two approaches.

    In contrast, Tesla has taken a more straightforward and to me logical design approach. RWD with the motor in the rear, with the many advantages that brings, or Dual Motor with the car's computer controlling how to employ those two motors.

    What BMW will chose to do I have no idea. But whatever they finally end up selling, years from now, they will be years late to the EV revolution and likely playing a continual game of catchup. Tesla is not standing still and waiting for them to show up...
     
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  9. traxila

    traxila Member

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    The only market this is competition for is their ICE infrastructure. They have a problem that no amount of squirming or press releases will solve. If they come out with a great EV (which I welcome), it could be disastrous for them, unless they are somehow able to accommodate all demand. Won't happen.
     
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  10. T34ME

    T34ME Member

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    The TM3 looks like m EV, the BMw electric looks like a.........ICE car. It is interesting that the TM3 is considered the gold standard and it hasn't even hit the road yet! Must have something to do with the 400K+ reservations. The BMw is not going to be competition for the TM3 because price will be closer to a TMS than a TM3, no in-house battery factory, no proprietary SuperCharger system, very high Cd with that front end with all the meaningless swoops, scoops, and grilles, and their I3 is not setting the world on fire. BMw just doesn't get it, yet.
     
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  11. zenmaster

    zenmaster Member

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    That's not the actual car (of course)?

    BMW actually has a few key advantages over Tesla incl. in house carbon fiber fab, battery cooling tech, and importantly: driver focus.
     
  12. zenmaster

    zenmaster Member

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    I don't see the problem. They'll increase production capacity. Core platform is shared while old is phased out.
     
  13. Reciprocity

    Reciprocity Active Member

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    Uh yeah, but would they rather lose sales to another BMW or Tesla? Of course it competes with it's ice line of vehicles but they would rather those folks buy a BMW then a Tesla.
     
  14. skitown

    skitown Supporting Member

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    Couldn't resist.
     
  15. Reciprocity

    Reciprocity Active Member

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    Competition will improve. Tesla has a problem in that it's created massive demand and can't build the cars fast enough. This issue will be compounded by the 3 hitting the road in large numbers. It's easy to dismiss electric cars when you really don't see any. Most of America is not like Socal where every other car is a Tesla, which btw helped push demand there higher. Wait until the 3s are everywhere and friends and family talking about it and taking people for rides. The problem is, if you don't have a reservation from a year ago, you won't get your 3 until 2018 and even later in Europe.
     
  16. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Point well taken... perhaps better word choice on my part. I was trying to make the point that BMW considers the dual motor setup more costly and complex..., which indicates to me that their expertise in mechanical as opposed to software and digital control is a significant influence there.

    The issues associated with two electric drive units are largely software and control. If anything the mechanical design is simpler on a number of fronts. And there's not the issue of center shaft, limited slip center differential, brake-only traction and slip controls, etc...

    But agreed, we don't know what will be the "de facto" offering. The fact that a mechanical-split setup is outlined as option #1 might be an indicator, however.
     
  17. Gen3Joe

    Gen3Joe Member

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    This is why the ICE manufacturers are in big trouble unless they abandon these old ways of thinking. They should probably hire a brand new engineering and leadership team for the EV side of the business that operate autonomously.
     
  18. zenmaster

    zenmaster Member

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    lol! They have to because they all quit last August to work for a Chinese EV startup!
     
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  19. traxila

    traxila Member

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    Of course, this is what they should have done a long time ago. My main point is that it is EV vs ICE, not BMW vs TSLA.
     
  20. traxila

    traxila Member

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    Of course BMW want to sell all the EVs it makes. I believe that the sales they take will be from ICE not TSLA.
     

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