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Russia/Ukraine conflict

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I don't know exactly why Turkey wasn't admitted between 1987-2014. And I don't feel like reading up on it know. But I'm 100% certain there were at least one very good reason why they weren't...

They weren't because Turkey was not a fully functional democracy.

If the Army smelled Islamism in a government , then the Army would remove that government.

You can't have that in the EUs most populous country. Or a country tied with the EU's most populous country.

Turkey isn't a small Balkan country of less than 7M people with questionable democratic credentials that can be bullied down the democratic path. It is a culturally confident country of 85M.
 
What does that mean? That you prefer something else than Democracy?
Of course I prefer Democracy.

It means Croatia's fascistic instincts can be checked with carrots and sticks down the democratic path. If cut off from the West, Croatia is subject to the abuses of Russia.

Turkey doesn't feel it needs Paris, Berlin, or Washington to thrive. Or survive. Trying the same tactics on Turkey as Croatia would likely backfire and inspire more Islamism not less.
 
Of course I prefer Democracy.

It means Croatia's fascistic instincts can be checked with carrots and sticks down the democratic path. If cut off from the West, Croatia is subject to the abuses of Russia.

Turkey doesn't feel it needs Paris, Berlin, or Washington to thrive. Or survive. Trying the same tactics on Turkey as Croatia would likely backfire and inspire more Islamism not less.

I don't really know exactly how Islamism came about. But as an atheist it seems to me that the religion Islam is the biggest and most basic root cause here. Of course – going after Islam without going after Religion as a whole is probably not going to work very well. If Islamism is the concern here (which it probably is) – then unfortunately I don't think we're going to get very far without addressing the root cause...
 
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On behalf of all people that grew on the other side of the Iron curtain, I can tell you that the red army soldier WAS NEVER EVER perceived as an liberator; but as a savage barbarian burning and raping his way across Europe. There should be a reason to think it thru for even for the dumbest people on why the freaking Germans were received as liberators in the occupied soviet territories in 1941. OFC criminals as they were, Nazis managed to kill and plunder and turn the occupied parts against them in little time. But they were originally perceived as liberators from the communists/russians. Why the hell do you think the whole Eastern Europe couldn't bear the stench of communist russia for even few days after the Iron Curtain fell? All the names, symbols, statues, everything went literally into the trash bin posthaste.

Yup, and now we know you. Igor, Boris or Ivan? I can't believe that you're misinformed, so the logical conclusion is that very likely (90%) you are of russian origin and left motherland either on a mission or to enjoy the fruits of kleptocracy. I give 1% to uneducated (unlikely) and 9% to just enjoying being a contrarian (read troll).
STILL waiting on a reply to my valid question from a day or two ago.

Not answering that, everyone here is just going to brand you a troll, and add you to their ignore lists.

Are you a troll? Russian-sponsored shill? Idiot?
All of the above?

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And now it's time to scoot...

I googled Caitlin Johnstone and it Took less than 5 minutes of skimming articles about her to find out she’s a far left conspiracy theorist whose journalistic capabilities and integrity are seriously questionable.

Edit: adding source: Caitlin Johnstone: Anatomy of a Far Left Conspiracy Nut
and I checked media bias of Daily Banter (left, mixed factuality - so admittedly not perfect)

And I am also mystified by pro-Russian sentiment in Europe - and in the US, but here (if I can make a political observation without making a political judgement) it at least makes sense that Trump’s pro-Putin, pro-Orban, anti-Ukraine sentiments are causing it.

For some it isn't so much pro-Russian sentiment, but sentiment against their own government. Some people have so many problems with their own government that anybody opposed to them is a "good guy" while others condemn both. That seems to be the sentiments among the left who are not backing their governments. But the overarching attitude is mostly "cancel all of them!"

Among the right authoritarian instincts are kicking in. They have always been there, but they have been growing in many countries.

The politics of the right in many western countries has shifted from an economic reform argument and sometimes regressive social changes into a nationalism that can be very dark and ugly. As European countries have allowed non-whites in to keep their economies going as the white population declines tensions between the native whites and the immigrants have been building for decades. The pro-Brexit vote in the UK had a lot of anti-immigrant attitude behind it as well as a general anti-foreign attitude.

The US has had a mix of whites and non-whites since colonial times but the fact that non-whites are reaching parity with whites in some areas is freaking out some segments of the white population and right wing politics has been feeding that wolf for years. This segment of the right (and it's not the entire right, it's a largish minority of the right) has turned to authoritarian ideas because that's the only way a minority can stay in power when the rest of the country rejects them. With their authoritarian streak running strong, they are drawn to strong man leaders in other countries who behave like they want to see their leaders behave.

Other countries have different dynamics to their politics, but the authoritarians tend to like Putin because he's a strong man. In reality strong men are really pretty weak people who have to warp everything to their will or they get upset. In Russia it's a 15 year prison sentence for just appearing to be against the war. That's not the sign of someone who is free of fear.

Follow-up - the BEST possible use of these systems right now would be attacking:
1) Command and Control - chop the head off the beast to make the units under their command less effective
2) Russian Electronic Warfare - there have been several reports that Ukrainian drone effectiveness is down very significantly due to the Russian deployment of EWS systems everywhere - target those systems, and you open up many more targets for your drones
3) Russian Aircraft (on ground at their bases in Ukraine)
4) Russian Rocket systems
5) Russian Artillery systems
6) Russian armor

That's the order I would be using HIMARS with if I only had 4 of them right now.

Command and control is a good target, but another weak spot the Ukrainians are aiming for is supply. They have been identifying Russian supply caches and taking them out whenever they can.

It looks like the better anti-radiation missile would be the Phoenix Ghost developed by the USAF. It's similar to the Switchblade, but while the Switchblade is designed to target enemy vehicles, the Phoenix Ghost is an anti-radiation loitering munition. It's designed to look for enemy targeting radar and dive on them whenever they turn on. But it could be used to take out jamming stations fairly easily too.

The US is sending Phoenix Ghost to Ukraine, but apparently there was some top secret tech in them that they need to engineer around first. The ones the Ukrainians get won't be as sophisticated as the USAF model, but they should do the job.

As a side note on Russian aircraft. The shortage of parts from the west might be affecting Russian aircraft. I've seen in separate articles in the last week that there have been a number Russian military aircraft crashes in Russia. I've seen two Su-25s and a transport have gone down. It's possibly just coincidence, but it could be due to the Russians pushing their aircraft in combat for too long without enough maintenance and the shortage of parts could be contributing.

Russia has been very dependent on Europe for parts to keep their infrastructure going. The Nord Stream I is running at lower capacity because a Siemans pump went out, it was sent to Canada for repair, and they now can't get it back. Their oil infrastructure is going to continue to fail as parts break and they can't repair them. They will keep things going for a while with work arounds and possibly taking equivalent parts from less critical areas and applying them to more critical areas, but there will come a point where the stop gap measures wear out.

Russia has had some good engineers who could figure out how to do a fair bit with few resources, but I think a lot of those engineers are retired or in other countries. Russia's education system went down the tubes and they don't have the expertise to replace their older technical workers. But there are probably enough to patch up some of the infrastructure.

The higher tech parts of the military is probably suffering from the same shortages. Making more AKs isn't tough, making more bullets and gun ammunition isn't tough, but making smart weapons, aircraft, anti-aircraft systems, etc. require parts they can't get. As the existing system break down from the abuses of combat, all they can do is work arounds to try and keep things going.

This is not a fast thing, it's a slow erosion of their infrastructure that they can probably keep hidden for months if not years. But it's happening. That's where sanctions do their work.
 
And now it's time to scoot...



For some it isn't so much pro-Russian sentiment, but sentiment against their own government. Some people have so many problems with their own government that anybody opposed to them is a "good guy" while others condemn both. That seems to be the sentiments among the left who are not backing their governments. But the overarching attitude is mostly "cancel all of them!"

Among the right authoritarian instincts are kicking in. They have always been there, but they have been growing in many countries.

The politics of the right in many western countries has shifted from an economic reform argument and sometimes regressive social changes into a nationalism that can be very dark and ugly. As European countries have allowed non-whites in to keep their economies going as the white population declines tensions between the native whites and the immigrants have been building for decades. The pro-Brexit vote in the UK had a lot of anti-immigrant attitude behind it as well as a general anti-foreign attitude.

The US has had a mix of whites and non-whites since colonial times but the fact that non-whites are reaching parity with whites in some areas is freaking out some segments of the white population and right wing politics has been feeding that wolf for years. This segment of the right (and it's not the entire right, it's a largish minority of the right) has turned to authoritarian ideas because that's the only way a minority can stay in power when the rest of the country rejects them. With their authoritarian streak running strong, they are drawn to strong man leaders in other countries who behave like they want to see their leaders behave.

Other countries have different dynamics to their politics, but the authoritarians tend to like Putin because he's a strong man. In reality strong men are really pretty weak people who have to warp everything to their will or they get upset. In Russia it's a 15 year prison sentence for just appearing to be against the war. That's not the sign of someone who is free of fear.
While I agree with your technical analysis, the rest is not the way I see it. It is not the right vs left as much as it is authoritarian vs libertarian and populist vs technocrat. You have people towards the center on both sides supporting Ukraine and you have the ones embracing authoritarianism, on both sides, admiring Putin. And I think you have it almost backwards on the distribution. There has been more on the extreme left I'd say favoring Putin than anywhere else on the spectrum, as shown even from examples above, both in democratic countries as well as in the ones that are lacking (think South America or Africa). And the ones on the right that are pro-Putin can be divided in authoritarian right (think pure fascism - Mussolini and the Argentinian Junta of 1976) and contrarians ("I don't like the people in power in my country and they support Ukraine, so I like Putin") that really can't think for themselves so they need someone else to tell them what to think. On top of that you get the populists, of both sides, whom when you dig deep enough, they are authoritarians in disguise - the "All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others" kind. Plus the anarchists who are in just for the kicks and generating chaos...

BUT you get some of the same fringes literally fighting (together) on the Ukrainian side. Pretty much they have their own international brigades as well as the Durruti column fighting alongside Condor Legion. And russians have similar otherworldly mixes on their side. Messy, but that's the way it is...

Putin is a nationalist-socialist (populist and jingoist in other words). So of course he'll attract the ones that feel the same way. While it may sound elitist - and I don't feel very comfortable stating it - unfortunately countries get the leaders that they deserve most of the time. On the light side, maybe weighting the vote by IQ should help... Okay, that was extremely elitist😬.

Off my soap box, feel free to disagree, that's what civilized debate is. Lincoln vs Douglas. Thinking back to exactly those debates can get me to write another long post so I'll stop right here and get a nice gin tonic instead.
 
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While I agree with your technical analysis, the rest is not the way I see it. It is not the right vs left as much as it is authoritarian vs libertarian and populist vs technocrat. You have people towards the center on both sides supporting Ukraine and you have the ones embracing authoritarianism, on both sides, admiring Putin. And I think you have it almost backwards on the distribution. There has been more on the extreme left I'd say favoring Putin than anywhere else on the spectrum, as shown even from examples above, both in democratic countries as well as in the ones that are lacking (think South America or Africa). And the ones on the right that are pro-Putin can be divided in authoritarian right (think pure fascism - Mussolini and the Argentinian Junta of 1976) and contrarians ("I don't like the people in power in my country and they support Ukraine, so I like Putin") that really can't think for themselves so they need someone else to tell them what to think. On top of that you get the populists, of both sides, whom when you dig deep enough, they are authoritarians in disguise - the "All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others" kind. Plus the anarchists who are in just for the kicks and generating chaos...

From what you write I can see you're familiar with the political compass.

At least in the media the most pro-Putin sources in the US are pretty much all on the right. But I agree left-right is probably not the right axis to use. There are true libertarian people on the right end of the spectrum, but they are becoming increasingly marginalized. In the US and I think in a number of other democracies the right has pretty much been taken over by the authoritarian wing. I saw an article about it a few days ago I set aside to read in depth and then lost track of it that was about how the right of center parties in many nations have run out of constructive ideas and are now just trying to do everything they can to stay in power. It isn't just a US phenomenon, it's happening in many European countries too.

These people are looking to how Putin has hijacked Russia as a model for their power grab.

There are people on the left end of the spectrum too who are Putin's useful idiots. Jill Stein was wooed by the Russians in her presidential run in 2016 to weaken the candidate who would make life roughest for Putin. There's footage of her dining with Putin in Moscow.

Basically the Russians have co-opted anyone they could to divide western countries. But those who really admire Putin are lovers of authoritarian rule. Anybody on the libertarian end of the spectrum who actually can think for themselves (not always the case) want nothing to do with that ilk.



BUT you get some of the same fringes literally fighting (together) on the Ukrainian side. Pretty much they have their own international brigades as well as the Durruti column fighting alongside Condor Legion. And russians have similar otherworldly mixes on their side. Messy, but that's the way it is...

Putin is a nationalist-socialist (populist and jingoist in other words). So of course he'll attract the ones that feel the same way. While it may sound elitist - and I don't feel very comfortable stating it - unfortunately countries get the leaders that they deserve most of the time. On the light side, maybe weighting the vote by IQ should help... Okay, that was extremely elitist😬.

Robert Heinlein had a similar idea, though that has an ugly and racist history in the United States.

Off my soap box, feel free to disagree, that's what civilized debate is. Lincoln vs Douglas. Thinking back to exactly those debates can get me to write another long post so I'll stop right here and get a nice gin tonic instead.
 
The ruble continues to strengthen.....is the ruble rubble? USD/RUB (RUB=X) Live Rate, Chart & News - Yahoo Finance

Scroll down to the section labeled The Facts
Fact Check: Does Russian ruble rise prove Western sanctions don't work?

Russia is unable to import much right now, but they are still selling oil and gas. They are accumulating large reserves of currency that is essentially worthless where they need to spend it - outside of Russia. Pretty much nobody is taking rubles, so it's effectively worthless outside of Russia.
 

All evidence seems to indicate the Ukrainians are slowly gaining ground around Kherson. This Dr Snekotron is either in bed with the Russians or deluded. Mark Hertling on the other hand uses his real name and has told the world his background. He is a retired US Army general and one of his last assignments was training the Ukrainians.

ISW updates daily and while the Russians have been making very small gains in Donbas, they are very slowly losing ground near Kherson. As I said yesterday, when an aggressor in a war loses momentum, they are losing. It may take years for them to get to the point where they admit it, but they are losing.

WW I was Germany's to win in 1914, but as soon as their offensive in France bogged down, the war became a fight to see which country's internal systems would break first. By 1918 Germany's soldiers were rebelling and it was over. The western powers have all the appearance of being willing to keep Ukraine in the fight as long as they can hold out and the Ukrainians have all the appearances of being in it to win it. The Ukrainians figure that they can't afford to lose the war.

On the other hand, Russia has internal tensions building. There have been a large number of recruitment office fires all over the country. There have also been many acts of industrial sabotage and the country is under major sanctions.

Russia is bigger, but they have lots of problems: manpower, manufacturing, morale, equipment, losses, resistance at home, sanctions, etc. It appears they stripped their training units to create replacements at the front. That's robbing the future for short term gain. It will keep the army in the field a little longer, but it means they face a hard cliff when those people get chewed up and spit out. They have nobody left to train new troops.

The Germans did this around late 1942 and the quality of their troops, especially highly skilled speialities dropped dramatically within a year.
 
Hopefully, Putler is beginning to run out of ammunition:

EDIT: Or could possibly be that Belarus has agreed to this in exchange for not having to join in with Putler in his war...

Credit goes to this site (in Swedish):
 
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Russia has been very dependent on Europe for parts to keep their infrastructure going. The Nord Stream I is running at lower capacity because a Siemans pump went out, it was sent to Canada for repair, and they now can't get it back. Their oil infrastructure is going to continue to fail as parts break and they can't repair them. They will keep things going for a while with work arounds and possibly taking equivalent parts from less critical areas and applying them to more critical areas, but there will come a point where the stop gap measures wear out.

This is not a fast thing, it's a slow erosion of their infrastructure that they can probably keep hidden for months if not years. But it's happening. That's where sanctions do their work.
I think that the Russian claim that "technical reasons" associated with delays in returning stuff to Russia from Canada following repair are largely a convenient fiction re Nord Stream I. Russia has been claiming "technical difficulties" on lots of its oil & gas pipelines that funnily enough only seem to affect the countries it is seeking to apply pressure to. By the way the reason they always claim "technical" difficulties is because it triggers different clauses in the various pipeline & supply contracts, versus other reasons (i.e. "Putin told me to stop pumping").

But yes, I agree that sanctions will have a slow progressive effect on the Russian economy, and that we can already see this in areas from automotive to aerospace.
 
not very clever targetting by the Russians,


and these are the people most affected, the Donbass

 
Hopefully, Putler is beginning to run out of ammunition:

EDIT: Or could possibly be that Belarus has agreed to this in exchange for not having to join in with Putler in his war...

Credit goes to this site (in Swedish):

I saw something, I think by Trent Telenko where he was running some numbers for Russian artillery usage and he came up with a burn rate that was many times the entire world's capacity to make artillery shells.

I've read about at least one false flag attack the Russians did and several others are rumored to be in the pipeline to draw Belarus into the fight, but with Belerus' ammunition and equipment stripped by Russia and the public attitude there that is far more pro-Ukraine than pro-Russia, Belarus is staying out of the active fighting. Maybe put told Lukashenko "if you aren't going to join us, we're going to take all your stuff"

I think that the Russian claim that "technical reasons" associated with delays in returning stuff to Russia from Canada following repair are largely a convenient fiction re Nord Stream I. Russia has been claiming "technical difficulties" on lots of its oil & gas pipelines that funnily enough only seem to affect the countries it is seeking to apply pressure to. By the way the reason they always claim "technical" difficulties is because it triggers different clauses in the various pipeline & supply contracts, versus other reasons (i.e. "Putin told me to stop pumping").

But yes, I agree that sanctions will have a slow progressive effect on the Russian economy, and that we can already see this in areas from automotive to aerospace.

It could be. It's always difficult to tell what's going on in Russia without independent verification.

not very clever targetting by the Russians,


and these are the people most affected, the Donbass


And that poll was from 2014 when the political climate in Ukraine was very differen. It's impossible to tell what opinions are in occupied territories today, but I do wonder what the residents of Crimea think now about their Russian overlords. They have fared better than the people of the occupied Donbas territories, but the Russian government does tend to look down on anyone non-Russian as an inferior life form. The poll was also conducted after the Russian invasion of Crimea. The public in Russia are usually circumspect about expressing their real opinions publicly.

A poll of Ukraine today would likely be even stronger for Ukrainian unity.