Russia/Ukraine conflict

[madodel]

United Nations High Command for Refugees (UNHCR) apparently has a Swedish Director for Ukraine. Her name is Karolina Lindholm Billing. Including supplemental pay(?) she has a salary of a whopping $33.830 a month. That is considerably more than the Swedish Prime Minister...

Salaries are set centrally by the UN and the average salary of UNHCR's international aid workers in Ukraine is the equivalent of $14.500 a month...

Source (In Swedish):

Kritik mot FN: Ukrainachefen för UNHCR tjänar enorma summor

Högre lön än statsministern • Expertens uppmaning: Se över lönenivåerna

www.tv4.se

Would your PM go and spend more than a day or 2 in Ukraine right now? Even for $33K a month I wouldn't do it.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

United Nations High Command for Refugees (UNHCR) apparently has a Swedish Director for Ukraine. Her name is Karolina Lindholm Billing. Including supplemental pay(?) she has a salary of a whopping $33.830 a month. That is considerably more than the Swedish Prime Minister...

Salaries are set centrally by the UN and the average salary of UNHCR's international aid workers in Ukraine is the equivalent of $14.500 a month...

Source (In Swedish):

Kritik mot FN: Ukrainachefen för UNHCR tjänar enorma summor

Högre lön än statsministern • Expertens uppmaning: Se över lönenivåerna

www.tv4.se

Just to clarify, I'm going to guess for us Americans that those are $33,830 and $14,500, rather than $33.83 and $14.50 with unnecessary tenth-cent decimals.

My bad.

The correct numbers are $33,830 and $14,500.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

United Nations High Command for Refugees (UNHCR) apparently has a Swedish Director for Ukraine. Her name is Karolina Lindholm Billing. Including supplemental pay(?) she has a salary of a whopping $33,830 a month. That is considerably more than the Swedish Prime Minister...

Salaries are set centrally by the UN and the average salary of UNHCR's international aid workers in Ukraine is the equivalent of $14,500 a month...

Source (In Swedish):

Kritik mot FN: Ukrainachefen för UNHCR tjänar enorma summor

Högre lön än statsministern • Expertens uppmaning: Se över lönenivåerna

www.tv4.se

EDIT: Corrected the figures in the qoute above.

Would your PM go and spend more than a day or 2 in Ukraine right now? Even for $33K a month I wouldn't do it.

Then why doesn't the UNHCR get a Ukrainian to be their Director for Ukraine? Where is all this money coming from? Shouldn't it be spent on helping refugees instead of lining the pockets of high ranking officials?

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

Dr. of Business Economics Ulian Gottlieb calls for a boycott against Marabou (a popular Swedish chocolate bar brand), whose owner Mondelez is active and markets itself in Russia where they paid about two billion in taxes to finance Russia's illegal war in Ukraine last year. Gottlieb made the call in an LTE in what is arguably the leading Swedish daily newspaper Dagens Nyheter.

Mondelez is trying to pose as some kind of good guys claiming that they did indeed give 123 million SEK in support to Ukraine. But... They paid 15x this amount to the Russian state...

Gottlieb writes:

While the company contributes to the murder of innocent Ukrainians through tax billions, a pittance is given in support to the victims. While Mondelez counts it's profits in Russia, Ukrainians count their compatriots on the run and mourn lives lost. While Mondelez products are being enjoyed in Russian homes, bombs are falling on Ukraine and Ukrainians' homes, and lives are being destroyed by Russian troops.”

Brands from Mondelez in Sweden include for example Marabou, Alladin, Daim, Japp, Oreo, Toblerone, [...] Bassets, Belvita, O'boy and Philadelphia.

Chocolate and other products from Finnish Fazer is one good alternative.

Source (Behind paywall and in Swedish):

Insändare. ”Bojkotta Marabou som bidrar till Rysslands krigsmaskin”

Uliana Gottlieb, fil dr i företagsekonomi: Till skillnad från många andra företag har Mondelez som äger chokladtillverkaren Marabou stannat kvar i

www.dn.se

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

And as has been pointed out numerous times over and over and over again in this thread the Ukrainian Air Force and the Ukrainian armed forces completely disagree.

Also: I doesn't even have to be Ukrainian pilots.

Opinion: A Mercenary Air Force for Ukraine? It’s not as Far-fetched as it Sounds

The idea of leasing an air force to Ukraine could solve several current challenges on the issue of military support. And some discussions have reportedly already taken place.

www.kyivpost.com

Here's a Ukrainian pilot that says he can learn the F-16 in 3 months:

Ukraine fighter pilot: I could learn to fly western jet within three months

In plea for military aid, Vadym Voroshylov explains why modern planes are needed for defence against Russia

www.theguardian.com

And here's the Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba praising the F-16's nose gear:

Kuleba once again calls on partners to provide Ukraine with F-16 aircraft

After the Russian shelling on the night of May 9, Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba called for more air defense systems and F-16s to cover the skies together. â Ukrinform.

www.ukrinform.net

Ukraine started the war with about 40 Mig-29s and about 50 other fixed wing combat aircraft. If they plumb the depths of their retired combat pilots they might be able to scrape together about 100 fighter pilots if they're lucky. A number of the retired pilots are not going to be in good enough health to fly fighters in combat.

That's the pool they have to work with. When I said they don't have time to train the pilots, I meant they don't have time to train pilots from scratch. That takes a couple of years. Take shortcuts and all you are going to do is get a pilot killed and a plane lost in their first minutes in combat. That was true in WW II and it's even more true today.

There has been talk about something akin to the AVG from WW II, but there are problems with that too. First off they will be called mercenaries by the Russians and the Russians will use it as proof they are actually fighting NATO. Convincing the Russian people they are actually fighting NATO is Putin's only way to galvanize the Russian people behind him. So far he's losing that PR battle because there is no actual proof he can trot out.

Secondly, if the pilots are drawn from retired military pilots, they run into the same problem Ukraine has drawing on their retired pilots. Taking the g forces fighter pilots need to endure is a young person thing and the pilot needs to stay in top condition to handle it. G tolerance declines with age and declining fitness. [...

Why do you state incorrect figures for the number of aircraft the Ukrainian Air Force had at the start of the war?

The correct numbers are 51 MIG-29s and about 60 other fixed wing combat aircraft(!)...
(Source: Ukrainian Air Force - Wikipedia)

And no matter what, or how much you write, you are for whatever reason siding against the Ukrainian Air Force.

I am not going to do that.

I am going to continue to side WITH the Ukrainian Air Force.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

Dr. of Business Economics Ulian Gottlieb calls for a boycott against Marabou (a popular Swedish chocolate bar brand), whose owner Mondelez is active and markets itself in Russia where they paid about two billion in taxes to finance Russia's illegal war in Ukraine last year. Gottlieb made the call in an LTE in what is arguably the leading Swedish daily newspaper Dagens Nyheter.

Mondelez is trying to pose as some kind of good guys claiming that they did indeed give 123 million SEK in support to Ukraine. But... They paid 15x this amount to the Russian state...

Gottlieb writes:

Brands from Mondelez in Sweden include for example Marabou, Alladin, Daim, Japp, Oreo, Toblerone, [...] Bassets, Belvita, O'boy and Philadelphia.

Chocolate and other products from Finnish Fazer is one good alternative.

Source (Behind paywall and in Swedish):

Insändare. ”Bojkotta Marabou som bidrar till Rysslands krigsmaskin”

Uliana Gottlieb, fil dr i företagsekonomi: Till skillnad från många andra företag har Mondelez som äger chokladtillverkaren Marabou stannat kvar i

www.dn.se

More about this from Wikipedia:

...] Business in Russia​

After the Russian invasion of Ukraine on February 24, 2022, many international companies felt compelled to reduce or end business in the Russian Federation.[68] As of March 12, 2022, Mondelez International was listed in an online spreadsheet by Yale professor Jeffrey Sonnenfeld as being among a minority of companies continuing to do business in Russia, where it generates 3.5% of annual revenue (approximately $1 billion).[69] [...

Mondelez International - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[BioSehnsucht]

My bad.

The correct numbers are $33,830 and $14,500.

Well depending on where you are in the world, commas and periods swap places for delineating numbers, so it wasn't wrong, so much as potentially confusing to many of us in North America (and a few other places). Many European countries (excluding the UK) in fact use a comma as decimal separator.

Personally, I don't even notice it when there's an actual decimal included, my brain auto corrects that to what I expect (i.e. $33.830,00 -> $33,830.00) but when there's only the period there's a moment where I have to parse whether that's likely to be a number with 3 decimals or a non-Imperial style number.

 

[Alset Srotom]

Why do you state incorrect figures for the number of aircraft the Ukrainian Air Force had at the start of the war?

The correct numbers are 51 MIG-29s and about 60 other fixed wing combat aircraft(!)...
(Source: Ukrainian Air Force - Wikipedia)

And no matter what, or how much you write, you are for whatever reason siding against the Ukrainian Air Force.

I am not going to do that.

I am going to continue to side WITH the Ukrainian Air Force.

This is why this thread is difficult to read. As much as I think @wdolson overstates the effectiveness of UKR military and strategic planning, he is at least a realistic when it comes to their air power, he is not "siding against" anything, just being a realist.

You should try being more grounded with reality. The 21 additional aircraft you corrected him on don't change things in the grand scheme of things.

And just to clarify my position, I am neither pro Russian or pro Ukraine. I think the West is exploiting a situation to fulfill their own agendas and only innocent folks (UKR servicemen & RUS servicemen) are paying the price. I just like to drop articles in here that don't align with the overall (inaccurate) environment.

Bottom Line: You can cheerlead for whoever you want, but don't say someone is choosing a side when they post a fact that you don't like.

 

[madodel]

U.S.-Made Technology Is Flowing to Russian Airlines, Despite Sanctions
Russian customs data shows that millions of dollars of aircraft parts made by Boeing, Airbus and others were sent to Russia last year.

Corrupt people willing to do Putin's bidding for a profit.

 

[nativewolf]

United Nations High Command for Refugees (UNHCR) apparently has a Swedish Director for Ukraine. Her name is Karolina Lindholm Billing. Including supplemental pay(?) she has a salary of a whopping $33.830 a month. That is considerably more than the Swedish Prime Minister...

Salaries are set centrally by the UN and the average salary of UNHCR's international aid workers in Ukraine is the equivalent of $14.500 a month...

Source (In Swedish):

Kritik mot FN: Ukrainachefen för UNHCR tjänar enorma summor

Högre lön än statsministern • Expertens uppmaning: Se över lönenivåerna

www.tv4.se

What this means is that Sweden led quite a bit of the funding.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

...] And just to clarify my position, I am neither pro Russian or pro Ukraine. I think the West is exploiting a situation to fulfill their own agendas and only innocent folks (UKR servicemen & RUS servicemen) are paying the price. [...

You've made your 'position' abundantly clear.

Even trying to have any sort of conversation with you at this stage is obviously utterly pointless.

Others reading this thread can draw their own conclusion about what you stand for.

 

[Artful Dodger]

Odin | Wōtan | OTAN | NATO:



Democracies have survived in the West because of our mutual defence agreements.

IMO, the end-game for this conflict will be Ukraine joining NATO. Removes all doubt.

 

[bkp_duke]

Odin | Wōtan | OTAN | NATO:



Democracies have survived in the West because of our mutual defence agreements.

IMO, the end-game for this conflict will be Ukraine joining NATO. Removes all doubt.

IIRC no country can join NATO while in active conflict. Ukraine will have to have this conflict end before they can join.

 

[MC3OZ]

And just to clarify my position, I am neither pro Russian or pro Ukraine. I think the West is exploiting a situation to fulfill their own agendas and only innocent folks (UKR servicemen & RUS servicemen) are paying the price.

How did the West manipulate Putin into invading Ukraine?

The West was very timid about allowing Ukraine to join NATO, and about supplying weapons. before the war.

NATO is a defensive alliance which protects member states from invasion.

And why did Russia invade Crimea and the Donbas in 2014?

Usually when you want to find the party in the wrong look at who is invading a sovereign nation. That is also true when the US is the country doing the invading.

There is no need or excuse for invasions, and colonial territorial land grabs, in the modern era. There is no excuse for a military invasion which seeks to topple a democratically elected government.

 

[SwedishAdvocate]

IIRC no country can join NATO while in active conflict. Ukraine will have to have this conflict end before they can join.

Can the North Atlantic Treaty somehow be amended so that Ukraine can become a member even if the current or hypothetical succeeding Russian Dictator reuses to end this war? That way Georgia and Moldova could also be included as members in NATO.

 

[bkp_duke]

Can the North Atlantic Treaty somehow be amended so that Ukraine can become a member even if the current or hypothetical succeeding Russian Dictator reuses to end this war? That way Georgia and Moldova could also be included as members in NATO.

I don't know the legal details, but I believe it would take a unanimous ratification, and then it would auto-trigger Article 5 (one would think). Even the USA probably would avoid that, for fear of a nuclear escalation.

 

[madodel]

I don't know the legal details, but I believe it would take a unanimous ratification, and then it would auto-trigger Article 5 (one would think). Even the USA probably would avoid that, for fear of a nuclear escalation.

It is definitely an incentive to keep a hot conflict going for Putin or who ever replaces him after he falls out a window to prevent Ukraine joining NATO.

 

[Artful Dodger]

IIRC no country can join NATO while in active conflict. Ukraine will have to have this conflict end before they can join.

Yes, that would be the 'end-game' part of what I wrote.

Cheers!

 

[bkp_duke]

It is definitely an incentive to keep a hot conflict going for Putin or who ever replaces him after he falls out a window to prevent Ukraine joining NATO.

Russia is effectively going to run out of equipment before they run out of manpower. Watching this play out is like watching a giant realtime game of RISK play out.

 

[bkp_duke]

Yes, that would be the 'end-game' part of what I wrote.

Cheers!

OK, read it the other way around. That they would join NATO, then NATO would "end game" Russia.