Sales and service centers in Michigan

[rainman50]

Currently Tesla is working on setting up a sales and/or service centers in Michigan. I was wondering maybe someone familiar with laws in Michigan would comment here.

What if Tesla would get with an Indian reservation area to set one up? They have casinos in them now and get around Michigan laws. Most likely Tesla checked in to this already but I have not heard of this talked about before.

 

[jbcarioca]

Interesting. The first novel solution I have yet seen.
There is question:
Rice v. Rehner 463 U.S. 713 (1983)
That case held by the US Supreme Court that State liquor laws could be applied on reservations, but most State laws cannot apply. I cannot find a citation that might be directly applicable.
Seems to me the problem would be finding a commercially viable set of locations if this were to work. Some States, like Florida, have Reservations in the midst of major urban areas, with casinos thriving. Michigan, however, has no reservations conveniently located for such activities as auto sales/service. In addition the licensing process could become fraught.

I wonder if it would work in other Staes that do have easy urban access from Reservations? I suspect vehicle licenses would be the primary impediment.

 

[rainman50]

Thanks for your comment.

There are a couple ones i think that are just off of a main freeway, (Four Winds for one),

Interesting. The first novel solution I have yet seen.
There is question:
Rice v. Rehner 463 U.S. 713 (1983)
That case held by the US Supreme Court that State liquor laws could be applied on reservations, but most State laws cannot apply. I cannot find a citation that might be directly applicable.
Seems to me the problem would be finding a commercially viable set of locations if this were to work. Some States, like Florida, have Reservations in the midst of major urban areas, with casinos thriving. Michigan, however, has no reservations conveniently located for such activities as auto sales/service. In addition the licensing process could become fraught.

I wonder if it would work in other Staes that do have easy urban access from Reservations? I suspect vehicle licenses would be the primary impediment.

 

[Tam]

...Most likely Tesla checked in to this already but I have not heard of this talked about before.

Very interesting idea!

That would be great even if it's a remote region of nowhere but Tesla can bring its inventory there as a distribution center for Michigan and beyond.

Tesla has experience by getting Umatilla Indian Reservation, Oregon to approve its Supercharger already:

Tesla supercharger coming to Wildhorse

My guess is may be DMV state law applies to Indian Reservations too.

 

[Rockster]

Dibs!

I suggested this a few years ago...

Michigan passes bill to ban Tesla!

 

[Tam]

Dibs!

I suggested this a few years ago...

Michigan passes bill to ban Tesla!

Thanks for the nice Michigan Indian Reservations map and insightful article about state dealership who does not tolerate tribal entrepreneurial car dealerships.

 

[rainman50]

Sorry, I did not catch that. Hopefully someway is found to get around this situation.

Dibs!

I suggested this a few years ago...

Michigan passes bill to ban Tesla!

 

[jbcarioca]

Tesla vs state of Michigan: disclosure of discussions with car dealer lobbyists would result in more lawsuits, state says [updated]
It is always nice to see Electrek be quick to see developments.
At least the first important discovery step was decided in Tesla favor. Depending on how Michigan responds we could see this appealed. From a long-range perspective ti would be excellent for this to reach the US Supreme Court. Even a narrow ruling would have a chilling effect on direct anti-Tesla forces in Texas, Utah, Connecticut and Louisiana, to name some of the more egregious. It also would be helpful to reduce impediments from New York and Virginia.

I remain convinced that once these issues do reach the US Supreme Court the State-level dealership-only distribution model might well be deemed unconstitutional.

if that happens we all can be thankful that Michigan made the admissions of direct anti-Tesla so utterly obvious.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Tesla vs state of Michigan: disclosure of discussions with car dealer lobbyists would result in more lawsuits, state says [updated]
It is always nice to see Electrek be quick to see developments.
At least the first important discovery step was decided in Tesla favor. Depending on how Michigan responds we could see this appealed. From a long-range perspective ti would be excellent for this to reach the US Supreme Court. Even a narrow ruling would have a chilling effect on direct anti-Tesla forces in Texas, Utah, Connecticut and Louisiana, to name some of the more egregious. It also would be helpful to reduce impediments from New York and Virginia.

I remain convinced that once these issues do reach the US Supreme Court the State-level dealership-only distribution model might well be deemed unconstitutional.

if that happens we all can be thankful that Michigan made the admissions of direct anti-Tesla so utterly obvious.

I don't think Tesla cares so much about new car sales licensing, although that will help. The key point to win on is service centers. If Tesla wins on that point, the whole structure will topple.

 

[jbcarioca]

I don't think Tesla cares so much about new car sales licensing, although that will help. The key point to win on is service centers. If Tesla wins on that point, the whole structure will topple.

Maybe, but the licensing issue is itself a significant impediment so they really need wot win both points. Pretty clearly if they lose on licensing they'd still want SC's.

 

[Tam]

...The key point to win on is service centers...

Does Tesla needs to get dearlership license in order to repair cars?

I thought in states that prohibit Tesla direct sales, Tesla can still have repair centers:

Texas 5
Connecticut 1
Utah 1
Virginia 1

Could it be Michigan Tesla Service Centers are pending on Tesla owner population rather than because of prohibition of in-state repairs?

 

[TexasEV]

It depends on the specifics of how the state law is written.

 

[TexasEV]

Tesla vs state of Michigan: disclosure of discussions with car dealer lobbyists would result in more lawsuits, state says [updated]
It is always nice to see Electrek be quick to see developments.
At least the first important discovery step was decided in Tesla favor. Depending on how Michigan responds we could see this appealed. From a long-range perspective ti would be excellent for this to reach the US Supreme Court. Even a narrow ruling would have a chilling effect on direct anti-Tesla forces in Texas, Utah, Connecticut and Louisiana, to name some of the more egregious. It also would be helpful to reduce impediments from New York and Virginia.

I remain convinced that once these issues do reach the US Supreme Court the State-level dealership-only distribution model might well be deemed unconstitutional.

if that happens we all can be thankful that Michigan made the admissions of direct anti-Tesla so utterly obvious.

The auto dealers and manufacturers and the legislators may have actually discussed in writing their plan to change state laws to block Tesla sales? This wasn't just something they talked about behind closed doors? To paraphrase James Comey, Lordy, I hope there are emails.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Does Tesla needs to get dearlership license in order to repair cars?

I thought in states that prohibit Tesla direct sales, Tesla can still have repair centers:

Texas 5
Connecticut 1
Utah 1
Virginia 1

Could it be Michigan Tesla Service Centers are pending on Tesla owner population rather than because of prohibition of in-state repairs?

It's an issue of the state law. They couldn't have service centers without licensing and Michigan changed their law to force the need for an independent franchise to get a license.
There are essentially 3 parts:
(1) Service
(2) Used car sales
(3) New car sales

Service is essential.
Used car is very important because people would easily be able to get test drives in Teslas.
It's essential to have new car sales in _some_ states. Since they have California, it's not essential to have new car sales everywhere. Because car ownership is buy-once-service-many it's not a problem. Texas' prohibition isn't a really big barrier, in part because the state does give them exhibition permits so they can also hold some new-car test drive events.

Also, Tesla's long-term business model assumes that they'll achieve full autonomy and have a mixture of company-owned and privately-owned cars. In that model, having independent repair shops that they can't effectively control is bad for margin. What they'll want is either in-house repair or a decent FM deal.