Sandy Munro talks about the teardown of the Model 3

[paranoidroid]

I SAID/Meant.

Weight does not matter in a TESLA. It does not matter because the 0-60 times are good enough. They can beat ANY cars in their class.

It's not all about 0-60. My last post to you, you can either spend some time googling and learning about the many dozens of reasons weight is VERY important in a car or you can just keep quoting 0-60 times and look uneducated to everyone else in the car world.

And again, I gave you one article to start:

Weight Is Always More Important than Horsepower

 

[Garlan Garner]

You asked why weight matters (not why it should matter to you) and a few of us have given you a bunch of answers. If you don't get it, then you just plain don't get it. Everyone else in the car community does.

Let me ask you a question.

Concerning a Tesla Model S.

Why can a P100D blow away my car with my car being 1000 pounds lighter? If weight is everything...then why is that?

 

[Garlan Garner]

Everyone else understands it's not all about 0-60. Again, sadly this is the (bad) stereotype of Tesla owners in the wider car community. My last post to you, you can either spend some time googling and as you say "READ READ READ" about the many dozens of reasons weight is VERY important in a car or you can just keep quoting 0-60 times and look uneducated to everyone else in the car world.

I said that my car is faster in the quarter mile. My very heavy car can blow away most cars in the quarter mile and has.

If weight is everything...then why is that?

You aren't explaining why…..You just keep saying. Weight is important. Weight is important.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Look people.

Instant torque of Tesla EV's is what is now tearing up quarter miles.

There is no comparable stock engine/transmission/weight of an ICE car that can mimic electric instant torque.

Producing this torque over and over and over might require extra rivets and such that Morono and others here don't understand.

My car should be losing all kinds of races because of its weight. But it isn't.

 

[apsen]

I wish they would have asked Monro a follow up question like, "Could the issues you see with body design be explained by Tesla's attempt at making safety first?" I'm pretty sure he doesn't think so or he would have mentioned. However, seemed like it should have been broached.

He actually mentioned that without a battery that car is just as safe as with it. I.e. it could be still just as safe with weaker body.

 

[JeffK]

He actually mentioned that without a battery that car is just as safe as with it. I.e. it could be still just as safe with weaker body.

Exactly... but at the expense of the battery which in my mind would be horrible.

On the bright side, maybe this and due to the new battery design with the gel is the reason we haven't seen Model 3 fires.

 

[EinSV]

Everyone else understands it's not all about 0-60. Again, sadly this is the (bad) stereotype of Tesla owners in the wider car community. My last post to you, you can either spend some time googling and learning about the many dozens of reasons weight is VERY important in a car or you can just keep quoting 0-60 times and look uneducated to everyone else in the car world.

And again, I gave you one article to start:

"Weight Is Always More Important than Horsepower"
Weight Is Always More Important than Horsepower

Did you watch the Munro video? He raves about how well the Model 3 handled, admitted that he initially misjudged the car in part because he hadn’t driven it and mentioned a couple of the young engineers who worked with him went out and bought the Model 3 because they liked it so much.

The Model 3 handles fantastically well and is a blast to drive — as owners and car reviewers can tell you. And I’m sure Tesla will continue to improve it since they are constantly improving their cars. But the Model 3 is already a great driver’s car (and the 3P is crazy good to drive).

 

[ricohman]

I said that my car is faster in the quarter mile. My very heavy car can blow away most cars in the quarter mile and has.

If weight is everything...then why is that?

You aren't explaining why…..You just keep saying. Weight is important. Weight is important.

I've been building cars for decades. Power and weight are everything. I understand that you appreciate acceleration. But with motorsports acceleration is but one aspect that makes it so much fun. The Model 3 with 600 lbs less weight would really be something.
These cars have fantastic acceleration in spite of being heavy, not because of it.

 

[Garlan Garner]

He actually mentioned that without a battery that car is just as safe as with it. I.e. it could be still just as safe with weaker body.

Did you watch the Munro video? He raves about how well the Model 3 handled, admitted that he initially misjudged the car in part because he hadn’t driven it and mentioned a couple of the young engineers who worked with him went out and bought the Model 3 because they liked it so much.

The Model 3 handles fantastically well and is a blast to drive — as owners and car reviewers can tell you. And I’m sure Tesla will continue to improve it since they are constantly improving their cars. But the Model 3 is already a great drivers’ car (and the 3P is crazy good to drive).

It's very difficult to explain the P3D+ experience in words.

I would never have fully understood it in words.

 

[Garlan Garner]

I've been building cars for decades. Power and weight are everything. I understand that you appreciate acceleration. But with motorsports acceleration is but one aspect that makes it so much fun. The Model 3 with 600 lbs less weight would really be something.
These cars have fantastic acceleration in spite of being heavy, not because of it.

Ok ricohman. I understand your point. I really do.

However....If an EV reduces weight...it would have a reduction in torque.

If I removed batteries from my car....I won't have the torque. It would be lighter but slower.

I'm not understanding why that's not understood.

 

[kbecks13]

Concerning a Tesla Model S.

Why can a P100D blow away my car with my car being 1000 pounds lighter? If weight is everything...then why is that?

It can't on a track. Performance Model 3 is faster than a P100D mainly because it is lighter.

 

[paranoidroid]

Did you watch the Munro video? He raves about how well the Model 3 handled, admitted that he initially misjudged the car in part because he hadn’t driven it and mentioned a couple of the young engineers who worked with him went out and bought the Model 3 because they liked it so much.

The Model 3 handles fantastically well and is a blast to drive — as owners and car reviewers can tell you. And I’m sure Tesla will continue to improve it since they are constantly improving their cars. But the Model 3 is already a great drivers’ car (and the 3P is crazy good to drive).

Yes, I watched the whole video. I'm not debating if the Model 3 is a great handling car, I purchased my Performance 3 over a BMW M2 Competition or BMW M3. It IS a great handling car, but the question I was answering is why weight is important (with one article to start that can explain to the non traditional car enthusiast why 0-60 and power is only part of the story). I'm not going to answer past that because this is such a widely known fact that Garlan can simply choose to educate himself with some googling and reading if he wishes.

The Model 3 accelerates fast and handles well despite its weight. Shave 500lb off the body and it would be insanely good. Untouchable. This is why I'm interested in hearing a rebuttal from Tesla on Munro and his body criticisms.

 

[EinSV]

It's very difficult to explain the P3D+ experience in words.

I would never have fully understood it in words.

Seriously. These guys should take a test drive or better yet rent one on Turo for a couple days.

 

[voip-ninja]

Did you watch the Munro video? He raves about how well the Model 3 handled, admitted that he initially misjudged the car in part because he hadn’t driven it and mentioned a couple of the young engineers who worked with him went out and bought the Model 3 because they liked it so much.

The Model 3 handles fantastically well and is a blast to drive — as owners and car reviewers can tell you. And I’m sure Tesla will continue to improve it since they are constantly improving their cars. But the Model 3 is already a great drivers’ car (and the 3P is crazy good to drive).

Munro never said the engineers who bought the car were young. Sounds like you are injecting some of your own bias about who purchases Model 3 there.

A better engineered body could have shaved hundreds of pounds of weight which would improve both handling and range.

The car would also be less complicated and less expensive to build which means better margins for Tesla.

Elon told Munro that he fired the guy who did the body design when Munro wanted to discuss why he was critical of it. This seems like an acknowledgement from Elon that mistakes were made.

 

[Garlan Garner]

It can't on a track. Performance Model 3 is faster than a P100D mainly because it is lighter.

Ok. I haven't been speaking of a track. I've been speaking about quarter miles and 0-60 times.

However...the Model S has much more torque than the Model 3 and is able to accelerate out of turns quicker than the 3.

 

[kbecks13]

Ok. I haven't been speaking of a track. I've been speaking about quarter miles and 0-60 times.

Oh well i don't think those are really that important as you could easily stuff more power (or unlock it via software) into the Model 3 and crush the P100D, but that will be called the Roadster or something like that

 

[voip-ninja]

Seriously. These guys should take a test drive or better yet rent one on Turo for a couple days.

What guys? The guys who bought two, drove them and disassembled them or some other guys?

Some people here can’t handle any criticism of Tesla and fly into a rage like someone called their baby ugly.

Model 3 is great car, it just could have been both better and less expensive to build if they’d done some things a little differently.

 

[JeffK]

However...the Model S has much more torque than the Model 3 and is able to accelerate out of turns quicker than the 3.

You're assuming it makes the turn in the first place and doesn't cut power.
Sliding around in Teslas at the company's Alaska proving ground - Video

 

[Garlan Garner]

Yes, I watched the whole video. I'm not debating if the Model 3 is a great handling car, I purchased my Performance 3 over a BMW M2 Competition or BMW M3. It IS a great handling car, but the question I was answering is why weight is important (with one article to start that can explain to the non traditional car enthusiast why 0-60 and power is only part of the story). I'm not going to answer past that because this is such a widely known fact that Garlan can simply choose to educate himself with some googling and reading if he wishes.

The Model 3 accelerates fast and handles well despite its weight. Shave 500lb off the body and it would be insanely good. Untouchable. This is why I'm interested in hearing a rebuttal from Tesla on Munro and his body criticisms.

You can't shave ANYTHING off of the Model 3 and rely on it performing like a Model 3.

Sure you can remove the self driving cameras and tech.
Sure you can remove 3 seats
Sure you can remove a lot of things....but then its NOT a Model 3.

 

[Garlan Garner]

What guys? The guys who bought two, drove them and disassembled them or some other guys?

Some people here can’t handle any criticism of Tesla and fly into a rage like someone called their baby ugly.

Model 3 is great car, it just could have been both better and less expensive to build if they’d done some things a little differently.

Ok then ….list what you can remove from the Model 3 and it still be a Model 3.