Sandy Munro talks about the teardown of the Model 3

[Garlan Garner]

Tesla should tell someone then. Not mentioned anywhere in any mainstream mags.
10 Safest Cars You Can Buy for 2019
https://www.nydailynews.com/autos/n...top-safety-pick-awards-iihs-article-1.3685871

Whatever. I think he did a great job. Even 2 people who work for him bought Model 3's.
There are some issues with cold weather that Canadians are dealing with. I will assume these will be solved quickly. Cold weather range excluded of course but there is no way around that.
I've already accepted the imitations this car presents. I have 9 other vehicles so I will be able to get around them.

Tesla is telling EVERYONE. ELON mentions it ALL OF THE TIME at every quarterly meeting and EVERY reveal. Keep up.

Morono did a very poor job.

So wait....Morono talks negative of the Model 3 and people who work for him purchased one anyway? LOL Think about that for a second.

 

[Garlan Garner]

I'd like to hear a rebuttal on the weight issue too. Munro mentions OptiStruct software by Altair many times but it's hard to believe Tesla didn't do a proper finite-element analysis after three completed car programs. Tesla themselves have shared animations from such simulations for crash testing.

I can see Musk fire an engineer who over-did the welds on the car but mistakes such as not accounting for the battery pack as part of the body design is a big enough deal that would let go a VP, or director level manager.

I would like to think there's a reason for the body over engineering (and that could mean safety) that Munro isn't seeing but an answer that we may need to hear from Tesla.

I don't understand how the weight of a Tesla has anything to do with anything. Its a NON issue to me.

Use words @paranoidroid. Don't just hit the disagree button. For goodness sake...you brought it up.

 

[paranoidroid]

I don't understand how the weight of a Tesla has anything to do with anything. Its a NON issue to me.

Actually, for a driving enthusiast weight is everything.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Use words @paranoidroid. Don't just hit the disagree button. For goodness sake...you brought it up.

What exactly is the weight issue? Man up.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Actually, for a driving enthusiast weight is everything. If you don't understand that you aren't a high performance driver.

High performance driver? I have to be a high performance driver to own a Tesla?

I own a P3D+ because I wanted acceleration down into the 3's.

I'm not a high performance driver....what does that have to do with anything? I took my P3D+ to the Joliet Il race track last summer and was clocked as 3.1 0-60 / 3 times in a row. That's perfect for me ( a non performance driver ).

To me....the extremely low center of gravity of all of that perfectly distributed weight contributed to extreme stability.

 

[JeffK]

Man, if that battery was damaged in every crash that'd get super costly.

 

[paranoidroid]

Use words @paranoidroid. Don't just hit the disagree button. For goodness sake...you brought it up.

What exactly is the weight issue? Man up.

Weight is something every driving enthusiast knows why it's important. It's why someone will take a 2100lb Miata with only 130hp on a track over many types of much more powerful cars.

There are so many benefits less weight will get you. It might not manner as much to the average driver but it does quite a bit to car and driving enthusiasts.

It's something you can spend a few minutes googling and learn about.

Here's a start: Weight Is Always More Important than Horsepower

 

[mongo]

From my readings, the S can barely be moved around with the pack removed due to the chassis's reliance on it for rigidity.

Having the 3 structurally sufficient without the pack can be a good thing, because it removes the size and strength constraints from the pack. SR could be an externally smaller or flimsier pack without impacting the overall car.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Weight is something every driving enthusiast knows why it's important. It's why someone will take a 2100lb Miata with only 130hp on a track over many types of much more power cars.

It's something you can spend a few minutes googling and learn about.

There are so many benefits less weight will get you.

Here's a start: Weight Is Always More Important than Horsepower

I'm not a performance driver. I'm a timed driver.

My car gets 3.1 seconds 0-60mph. I will race a Miata any day ( which weighs 2000 pounds less than my car ).

Anyone ready. Lets go.


Hey - There is another TESLA called a Model S P100D that is heavier AND faster than my car.
Almost seems like the Heavier a Tesla is - The faster it is.

 

[paranoidroid]

I'm not a performance driver. I'm a timed driver.

My car gets 3.1 seconds 0-60mph. I will race a Miata any day ( which weighs 2000 pounds less than my car ).

Anyone ready. Lets go.

You asked why weight is important, not why weight should be important to you.

BTW someone who knows how to drive well will easily beat you with a Miata around a timed close course track to a non-driver in a Performance Model 3. You see this happening at every HPDE event, where the Porsche, Ferrari, BMW etc give the point by and let the 130hp Miata pass.

 

[ricohman]

Weight is something every driving enthusiast knows why it's important. It's why someone will take a 2100lb Miata with only 130hp on a track over many types of much more power cars.

It's something you can spend a few minutes googling and learn about.

There are so many benefits less weight will get you. It might not manner as much to the average driver but it does quite a bit to those who know cars and know how to do high performance driving.

Here's a start: Weight Is Always More Important than Horsepower

Exactly. What accelerates has to stop and turn. Less is more.
The Model 3 is fairly impressive. Could be even more impressive with less weight.

 

[paranoidroid]

Hey - There is another TESLA called a Model S P100D that is heavier AND faster than my car.
Almost seems like the Heavier a Tesla is - The faster it is.

BTW the stereotype of a Tesla driver to the wider car enthusiast community is they don't really know cars or what high performance driving really is. Along with that they don't understand why weight matters. They just quote straight line 0-60 times - which is only some part of what makes real driving fun but not close to all.

This is why understanding weight is important. There aren't many car enthusiasts from the performance petrol world who would ever buy a Model S because of weight.

 

[Garlan Garner]

It's clear you're not a performance driver. But you asked why weight is important, not why weight should be important to you.

BTW someone who knows how to drive well will easily beat you with a Miata around a timed close course track to a non-driver in a Performance Model 3. You see this happening at every HPDE event, where the Porsche, Ferrari, BMW etc give the point by and let the 130hp Miata pass.

Come on out and race then.

In a Tesla - its pedal to the floor race. There is no shifting or anything.

This is very simple. Its not complicated.

If there is a car that has a better quarter mile time....then that's what it is. In a Tesla...its not about the driver because there is nothing to do but slam the accelerator to the floor and wait.

 

[ricohman]

Come on out and race then.

In a Tesla - its pedal to the floor race. There is no shifting or anything.

This is very simple. Its not complicated.

If there is a car that has a better quarter mile time....then that's what it is. In a Tesla...its not about the driver because there is nothing to do but slam the accelerator to the floor and wait.

Be careful. That old Miata will stop far faster then you. By something like 40 feet at 60 mph. Closed course racing is a different beast than a couple of 1/4 mile runs.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Exactly. What accelerates has to stop and turn. Less is more.
The Model 3 is fairly impressive. Could be even more impressive with less weight.

Are you talking about a quarter mile race?

Look.

Everyone.

If my car weighed less then I couldn't go 310 miles per charge.

As I've been stating over and over and over. Teslas are multi purposed cars.

They aren't ONLY race cars.
They aren't ONLY EV's
They aren't ONLY the safest cars on the road.
They aren't ONLY the fastest cars in their classes
They aren't ONLY the longest range EV's out there.
They aren't ONLY the best self driving cars on the road.
They aren't ONLY anything.

They are the greatest in all of those areas combined.

You guys keep pulling out single factors saying that there is another car that can beat a Tesla in that factor. Sure.

Who can beat a Tesla with all of those factors combined?

 

[Garlan Garner]

Be careful. That old Miata will stop far faster then you. By something like 40 feet at 60 mph. Closed course racing is a different beast than a couple of 1/4 mile runs.

READ READ. I'm not talking about closed circuit racing.

All that I've talked about are quarter mile runs and 0-60 times. PERIOD.

 

[ricohman]

Man, if that battery was damaged in every crash that'd get super costly.

I think if the battery was damaged the unit body would be so far gone it would be a TL. Weakness in the body is not a problem here.

 

[JeffK]

I think if the battery was damaged the unit body would be so far gone it would be a TL.

...because the body is so good.

Weakness in the body is not a problem here.

That's Sandy's point. He's saying the body should be made weaker to let the battery take the force.

 

[paranoidroid]

READ READ. I'm not talking about closed circuit racing.

All that I've talked about are quarter mile runs and 0-60 times. PERIOD.

You asked why weight matters (not why it should matter to you) and a few of us have given you a bunch of answers. If you don't get it, then you just plain don't get it. Everyone else in the car community does.

 

[Garlan Garner]

You asked why weight matters (not why it should matter to you) and a few of us have given you a bunch of answers. If you don't get it, then you just plain don't get it. Everyone else in the car community does.

I SAID/Meant.

Weight does not matter in a TESLA. It does not matter because the 0-60 times are good enough. They can beat ANY cars in their class.

Racing EV's are different than racing Combustion cars.

The MORE batteries in an EV the higher the weight. HOWEVER the more batteries in an EV the more power you can pull out of them - the more torquie they can be.

In other words...in a TESLA ...I can make my car 2000 pounds lighter, however my motors won't be able to pull the torque I have to crush miatas.