Santa Clara County retroactively Changing ESS Rules

[Vines]

I am dealing with a significant rule change in Santa Clara County Fire jurisdiction, which is effecting our ability to get permits for Powerwall installations. SCC has retroactively applied new rules to our existing permits and is rejecting our other new permits based on their rules. These new rules were supposed to come into play in July 2021 with the interim code update.

They are enforcing these rules immediately and retroactively to permits from last year. Anything for more than 1 Powerwall needs to comply, and have even more strict rules for more than 5 units.

These are the really onerous requirements:
1. No Powerwalls closer than 3' to each other, so stacking kits are not allowed.
2. Limiting the Powerwall locations, and quantities in those locations.
3. If the PW are in an attached garage, all interior of the garage must have sheetrock.
4. Attached garages must have Listed heat detectors, which trigger an alert in the rest of the alarms.

The heat detector requirement has me looking at codes and products I am not used to worrying about. What i am hoping for is a product that we could retrofit in a garage, and/or home, which accomplishes this without new wiring or with as little as possible new wiring. So far all the wireless heat detectors I have found are designed for interfacing with a main control panel, which may not exist in an older home.

For instance this is my preferred wireless Smoke/CO detector. https://www.amazon.com/First-Alert-...&sr=8-7&swrs=C4E1F7315C16AEAE46DFB47BBDE7FD72

Unfortunately it doesn't come in a heat detector version. If it did that would be perfect.

I looked into NEST as well, but it has no heat detector option.

 

[woferry]

Do you know what the limitations for your #2 are on outdoor installations, i.e. attached to the exterior of a house?

 

[gpez]

With these new codes I wonder if there is a market for enclosure kits. I know the Powerwalls are IP 67/56 for power/wiring respectively but I imagine having it protected a bit more would be better. Put it away from the house but close enough for conduit. Sort of like how home gensets are installed?

 

[wwhitney]

Is this a Santa Clara amendment approved by the state, or is this about California FIre Code Section 1206? If this is for single family residences, that section doesn't apply and Santa Clara Country is misinterpreting it. See: Any California PowerWalls installed been killed/altered because Fire Code changes?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Vines]

Do you know what the limitations for your #2 are on outdoor installations, i.e. attached to the exterior of a house?

Must be 3' from any door or window entering the dwelling unit, (garage windows/doors ok) Must be 3' apart, Must be less than 5 PW units or 80 kWh total capacity.

With these new codes I wonder if there is a market for enclosure kits. I know the Powerwalls are IP 67/56 for power/wiring respectively but I imagine having it protected a bit more would be better. Put it away from the house but close enough for conduit. Sort of like how home gensets are installed?

I think there is a market for this, but probably a small one.

Is this a Santa Clara amendment approved by the state, or is this about California FIre Code Section 1206? If this is for single family residences, that section doesn't apply and Santa Clara Country is misinterpreting it. See: Any California PowerWalls installed been killed/altered because Fire Code changes?

Cheers, Wayne

I agree that they are misinterpreting it, and an official OSFM interpretation is incoming for both the 2016 and 2019 code cycles. I have had talks with the CALFire Head of Code Development about this and he agrees they are misinterpreting the code. The issue at the core is that 1206 as written does not exclude residential installations. So those who chose to use CRC R327 and those who choose to use CFC 1206 are both technically correct.

I did not get the sense that even if the OSFM came back with a clear interpretation to use CRC R327 for R3 and R4 occupancies, they would do anything different, and I directly asked them that question.

They aren't taking CFC 1206 in its entirety, they are cherrypicking parts of it to basically enforce what is the voting draft of the release for Interim Cycle July 1 2021 of CRC R327.

They are also not allowing any closer separation than 3' as written in the voting draft. The same draft code also says that large scale testing can be done to justify a closer than 3 foot spacing. Tesla has done similar large scale fire testing, but before the new UL 9540 update, which was just finalized end of February.

So if there was testing to justify closer separation then they should accept it, but because the standard was just finished literally nobody has that testing complete yet.

 

[wwhitney]

The issue at the core is that 1206 as written does not exclude residential installations.

So what does Santa Clara County say about CFC 102.5, which exempts the interior of buildings built under the California Residential Code from almost all of the California Fire Code, including 1206?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Sonus]

I passed inspection 3 weeks ago and the Nest Protect was perfectly fine.

 

[SMAlset]

Whatever comes down on this will affect us too. We were scheduled to have our electrician come out to update our main panel to one with a 225 busbar as Tesla’s staff was scheduled months out to do that work. We were all aiming for end of March for our solar panel install with PW system pushed back to fall. The day our electrician was to come out to start work was the day our bay area counties were shut down. Our permit office told him no inspector would come out for residential work like ours. Now this? Ughhh. I had heard people say some restrictive changes were in the works like spacing of units but thought those were only to apply to commercial applications. Will be following this thread.

 

[SMAlset]

@Vines as to the heat detector were they telling you it had to be in the attached garage itself or could it be part of the home monitoring system located inside the home? I'm aware that our drywalled garages (we have two) have firewalls since living units share an attached wall/ceiling but don't think we have any developer installed fire/smoke detectors in the garages.

When we had our electrician install our NEMA 14-50 back in March 2017 we updated our smoke detector system which is hard wired and with battery back up to include the carbon monoxide detector. Our house was built in 2004 timeframe and we didn’t mind refreshing everything at that point. I’ll check but I don’t think our alert system has heat detection.

 

[SMAlset]

So the detectors we updated to in 2017 were Kidde FireX units with a 10-year battery backup warranty. No smoke detection.

On the smoke detector front I see that Kidde makes the HD135F that can be a single station unit or interconnected to up to 24 Kidde devices in a multiple station arrangement. Kidde HD135 120VAC Wire In Heat Alarm

They also have this Kidde FireX hardwired smoke alarm, Firex I4618, that offers interconnectable with up to 24 devices (of which 18 can be initiating) including smoke, CO and heat alarms. Firex i4618 - Hardwired Smoke Alarm | Kidde Home Safety

Both might be helpful to check out. I don't have a problem with adding a heat detector unit just wondering now where it can be installed to meet any new code.

 

[wwhitney]

I assume the idea of a heat detector in the garage, rather than a smoke detector, is because ICE exhaust can set off a smoke detector? If so, is there an allowance to use a smoke detector for garages for electric vehicles?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Vines]

So what does Santa Clara County say about CFC 102.5, which exempts the interior of buildings built under the California Residential Code from almost all of the California Fire Code, including 1206?

Cheers, Wayne

They say this is true, until you exceed 20 kWh of Battery storage.

I passed inspection 3 weeks ago and the Nest Protect was perfectly fine.

Standard requirements everywhere in the state of smoke /CO are accomplished by the Nest product.
Santa Clara County requirements are not, I checked with Nest to be sure there was no heat detection feature, and there is not.

@Vines as to the heat detector were they telling you it had to be in the attached garage itself or could it be part of the home monitoring system located inside the home? I'm aware that our drywalled garages (we have two) have firewalls since living units share an attached wall/ceiling but don't think we have any developer installed fire/smoke detectors in the garages.

When we had our electrician install our NEMA 14-50 back in March 2017 we updated our smoke detector system which is hard wired and with battery back up to include the carbon monoxide detector. Our house was built in 2004 timeframe and we didn’t mind refreshing everything at that point. I’ll check but I don’t think our alert system has heat detection.

If the Powerwalls are to be installed inside an attached garage, there must be a heat detector in the garage interconnected with the existing smoke detection system. Sounds like for your home with an existing 120V system this is pretty reasonable. For other homes with 9v battery powered alarms its not so easy. I really want to find a wireless solution. Wire in solutions are available for most major brands, the majority of the cost will be in accessing the wiring, assuming the existing system has a protocol that a heat detector is available for. One customer we have has vaulted ceilings with spray in insulation and finished wood paneling over the insulation...nightmare.

I assume the idea of a heat detector in the garage, rather than a smoke detector, is because ICE exhaust can set off a smoke detector? If so, is there an allowance to use a smoke detector for garages for electric vehicles?

Cheers, Wayne

I agree that your line of thinking is right on the money, imagine the particulate that a ICE especially diesel would leave on the garage walls. I imagine it would cause all sorts of havoc with a smoke alarm.
Your line of thinking sounds good, but that assumes all vehicles ever parked there would be electric.

 

[SMAlset]

Many people have gas furnaces and water heaters (and washing machines/dryers—gas or electric) in their garages too. The condo we had had the gas furnace in there, our current home has the water heater in one of our garages which is gas heated.

@Vines any idea why the push in our area to implement this rule change from the 2021 initial effective date?

While we have a hard-wired system I have no idea how someone we hire will be able to wire up one to our two-story home’s system. Sounds complicated after construction and expensive. Passing this retroactively really puts recent and current construction too under an unfair burden IMO. I can see some homeowners trying to install PWs as a result of PG&E’s shutdowns as being subtantially impacted by this code change depending on their house design and wiring. As it is some homeowners balk at the costs of upgrading their main panels to include a 50A NEMA 14-50 and let’s face it the cost of a solar system and PW protection isn’t cheap. We just incurred an unexpected 5K expense upgrading our 200A service to a 200A with 225A busbar on top of our solar/PW contract.

Have to now wonder how Tesla is going to approach this problem. We need to do a garage install as the side of our house near the main panel has a south exposure with no shaded area to install outside. Temps during summers typically in 90-190 degree range and house is stucco. I’m not even sure our available garage wall can accommodate our two planned PWs now if there’s now going to be a 3 ft separation required. Also would mean no expansion for adding a third unit stacked to one of the two which we had contemplated. If it weren’t for PG&E shutdowns for the next 10 years here, not sure we’d pursue the PWs at this point.

 

[Vines]

I cannot speak to the mindset of the County Fire Officials. Their job is to see a risk and they address it and I respect that. I believe they think they are saving customers from a dangerous situation.

I have read the Tesla DNV full scale fire testing fire report, and I disagree. Still, I haven't seen testing done with the stacking kits, so there's really nothing to comment on regarding the fire performance of a 3 stack.

I don't believe installing Tesla Powerwalls is not any more dangerous than having an electric, or gas powered vehicle parked inside the garage. To my knowledge there have not been any rash of home battery ignited house fires.

 

[Sonus]

Standard requirements everywhere in the state of smoke /CO are accomplished by the Nest product.
Santa Clara County requirements are not, I checked with Nest to be sure there was no heat detection feature, and there is not.

I am in Santa Clara County and I did pass inspection in February without the need for heat detection.

 

[Vines]

While we have a hard-wired system I have no idea how someone we hire will be able to wire up one to our two-story home’s system. Sounds complicated after construction and expensive. Passing this retroactively really puts recent and current construction too under an unfair burden IMO. I can see some homeowners trying to install PWs as a result of PG&E’s shutdowns as being subtantially impacted by this code change depending on their house design and wiring. As it is some homeowners balk at the costs of upgrading their main panels to include a 50A NEMA 14-50 and let’s face it the cost of a solar system and PW protection isn’t cheap. We just incurred an unexpected 5K expense upgrading our 200A service to a 200A with 225A busbar on top of our solar/PW contract.

Have to now wonder how Tesla is going to approach this problem. We need to do a garage install as the side of our house near the main panel has a south exposure with no shaded area to install outside. Temps during summers typically in 90-190 degree range and house is stucco. I’m not even sure our available garage wall can accommodate our two planned PWs now if there’s now going to be a 3 ft separation required. Also would mean no expansion for adding a third unit stacked to one of the two which we had contemplated. If it weren’t for PG&E shutdowns for the next 10 years here, not sure we’d pursue the PWs at this point.

To get back to being able to use stacking kits and 10" separation, Tesla can do the testing required by the newest release of UL9540, this will just take a bit of time. Since its only one jurisdiction, I do not know how many resources they will throw at this however. I imagine it wont significantly accelerate the timeline they already had in place for testing before the July 1 2021 effective date, unless a bunch of jurisdictions pick this up early.

Rewiring existing alarm systems will absolutely be a significant burden to some jobs, without a good technology solution.

For your install, you could build a shade structure pretty easily, to shade the powerwalls, and it may be cheaper in the end than dealing with the garage install.

I am in Santa Clara County and I did pass inspection in February without the need for heat detection.

You likely had a permit issued before Dec 20 2019. This seemed to be the cutoff date. Also this is only effecting unincorporated areas of SC County jurisdiction, also cities of Los Gatos, and likely Campbell.

 

[SMAlset]

To get back to being able to use stacking kits and 10" separation, Tesla can do the testing required by the newest release of UL9540, this will just take a bit of time. Since its only one jurisdiction, I do not know how many resources they will throw at this however. I imagine it wont significantly accelerate the timeline they already had in place for testing before the July 1 2021 effective date, unless a bunch of jurisdictions pick this up early.

Rewiring existing alarm systems will absolutely be a significant burden to some jobs, without a good technology solution.

For your install, you could build a shade structure pretty easily, to shade the powerwalls, and it may be cheaper in the end than dealing with the garage install.
.....

Appreciate your heads up on all of this. Maybe it’s just a way to get more jobs for electricians although with a boom in new construction for the last year or so don’t think that’s it.

HOA here and no shade structures on the sides of our homed permitted...mainly because homes are built so close together and there are building codes about minimum side lot width and natural light restrictions and structure setbacks. Some single family homes in our area only have 5ft side yards to lot line shared fences. Our bbq island had a 3ft setback from our fence (our dining pergola required a 5ft setback from lot line shared fence and had to be built in the back yard). Older homes likely are on larger lots when land was cheaper and also not part of forced city HOAs. These kind of space requirements for many newer, tighter spaced developments simply seem too restrictive for homeowners who weren’t required by code to have a heat detector at time of build. I really hope these points are hammered home to those proposing these changes. So sad we have PG&E as our provider here with lines that are requiring shutdowns.

Next week I’ll speak with our Tesla Energy contact about this code change and what it will mean for all of us wanting PWs in this code change area. Where would I find a list of all the cities this fire district encompasses?

 

[Vines]

Maybe a plastic garden type shed? You could add ventilation to it as needed, not a permanent structure. HOA are a huge pain, good luck with that.

Hard to say how many cities will be affected, as Fire authority is a hodge-podge of different providers. To this point the information I have is that these rules are being enforced in Los Gatos, likely Campbell, and in all of the unincorporated areas in Santa Clara County. I cannot say yet where else this will happen. Depends on how much push back the cities get from the local tax paying residents. If 100 residents take the time to make this an issue they care about then that changes things. Its not always easy to understand who has Fire jurisdiction, only based on your street address.

Hopefully the rest of cities within Santa Clara County don't adopt this too soon and allow the manufacturers time to implement the proper UL 9540 testing when the rest of the state adopts the interim code July 1 2021.

PGE shutdowns make this imperative for some people to deal with. I took it as far as was reasonable with the AHJ given my position.

For those on the fence about now or later though, expect that some new version of the code will be restricting Powerwall locations and quantities after the interim code is released. This will be statewide so its coming regardless. We were planning for this next year, once all the fire testing was completed.

 

[SMAlset]

I looked up areas served by Santa Clara County Fire and found this list of fire stations for these areas. I guess when I read Santa Clara County Fire I assumed it covered all of Santa Clara County, which it doesn’t and why people in San Jose and other areas haven’t had problems with their installs.

Facilities and Fire Stations - Santa Clara County Fire Department

Since we aren’t served by SCCF our house might not be affected? Not clear if this will apply statewide or will be — something like permits and how individual cities/municipalities can have one set of rules different from another. I mention this as I’ve been told by a few of our contractors over the years doing work here how one city can approve something but another not. Case in point underground gas lines could be flexible in one city but another like ours insisted that the flexible line just installed for our bbq island be removed and this yellow non-flexible line be installed instead.

BTW laughed at reading my earlier post and my typo of 90-190 degrees (s/b 100 ). We get hot, but not that hot.

 

[wwhitney]

They say this is true, until you exceed 20 kWh of Battery storage.

So, legally, they need to enforce only the currently adopted state codes, unless they have amended them and registered those amendments with the state building standards commission.

Santa Clara County lists its amendments to the CFC here:

Municode Library

Santa Clara County has registered an amendment with the building standards commission as you can see here:

2019 Ordinances

Unfortunately, you have to email them to get a copy, I recall you used to be able to download them directly. To my knowledge any provisions listed in the first link that are absent in the document indexed in the second link are not actually enforceable.

In any event, I don't see anything in the first link amending CFC 102.5, nor Chapter 12. So it seems to me that what they are doing is illegal. They can't legally just ignore part of CFC 102.5, nor accelerate the draft unfinalized unadopted interim cycle code provisions.

None of that really helps you, though, unless you are willing to sue or just ignore their permitting, or can find someone high enough up in the administration to consider all this. Maybe they have a legal department that will talk to you?

Very frustrating.

Cheers, Wayne