Seeking Advice: Uneven treads, suspension?

[father_of_6]

My M3LR has 37.5k miles and the rear right tire has wire mesh sticking out of the inner most tread. This is already my 2nd set of tires, I replaced the first at about 9k miles because of inside tread wear and feathering on both rear tires.

I started feeling slight vibration at about 2k miles and went through a barrage of hassles attempting to rectify, including:

• 2 alignments
• 2 useless service center visits totalling 6 hours of driving and 4 hours of waiting
• more third-party garages than I can remember
• and eventually new tires plus road-force balancing

Sadly, the slight vibration / wobblyness was never resolved... and unsurprisingly the new tires now have uneven wear as well.

I *suspect* there's a suspension issue, and scheduled for service... but I'm dreading the 3 hours of driving for the appointment and the high likelihood that they'll just try to sell me an alignment and push me out the door. I don't have high confidence in the service center.

I explained to them that I have a full set of brand new tires already that I'll bring to the appointment, but that I'm not comfortable with them being put on until the underlying issue is resolved... I certainly don't want to buy new tires every year.

The employees at my closest service center are super friendly, but it's such a far drive to not have the underlying issue resolved, and chatting with them through the app feels very obtuse... despite being very detail oriented in my request, the estimate is for 4 new tires and an alignment.

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I appreciate any expertise and advice anyone has to offer. My primary questions are as follows:

1. Does this seem like a suspension issue? I know there are many posts about uneven tread wear, but *one* tire being totally warn seems different (coupled with slight vibration / wobbles).
2. If it is suspension damage, would you trust bringing it to someone other than Tesla? It's a far drive for me and my confidence is warn (and they may be overpriced).
3. If it isn't suspension damage, do I really need constant alignments / rotations / service to keep from burning through tires? I've never needed this much wheel care during 2 years of car ownership.

Attached is the first alignment sheet, in case that provides any value.

 

[Soul Surfer]

With respect and lots of humour. As a "father of six", you may have too many people in the car. Sorry, I couldnt resist.

We're almost neighbours. Now the real response:

Unless you've hit an object while driving, your car shouldn't have this type of wear. Have you brought it in for a checkup at Tesla or did the alignment guys find any damage? It does seem like a suspension issue. Sometimes if the coil falls out of socket, it can throw this off. Maybe it was never properly seated?

 

[father_of_6]

With respect and lots of humour. As a "father of six", you may have too many people in the car. Sorry, I couldnt resist.

No, only 5 of us fit in the car - the other 3 run alongside it.

Sincerely, thank you very much for sharing your expertise.

My first trip to Tesla regarding the "less smooth ride" was discouraging... the service tech drove the car (with me as passenger) but it wasn't very pronounced at that time (it seems variable) and the road seemed "chip and tar" style, so it definitely masked the bad ride. They offered to road force balance and I declined.

I then brought it to a local place to ask about road force balancing, but the guy alerted me to inside tread wear and said I need an alignment. Then I called and visited *many* local garages... couldn't find a single one who would do an alignment, so I then made *another* Tesla service appointment. Weeks passed, finally got there, the tech that does alignments wasn't there. Mostly a waste of time, but they referred me to a certified body shop that could do alignments. Few weeks later, finally got the alignment... still not a smooth ride.

I mentioned suspension to Tesla as well as the alignment folks, no help. Then I decided to replace the tires, thinking perhaps the inside wear and the feathering might be the cause of the unsmoothness. Unfortunately not. Then another alignment. Nothing. Then I found another owner selling 4 new OEM wheels for a pretty good deal, so i have those in my garage.

That brings me to today. 2k *really* smooth miles in my M3LR, followed by 35k less-than smooth miles. It's not major vibration, but it's not what it was when I bought it. Seems like I can feel the tire spinning, like it's out of round or something.

Desperate for a solution.

I'm thinking I'll find someone local to swap the tires and road force balance, get the alignment done (already paid for a 3 year unlimited alignment package), then keep my appointment at the service center and see if they can find a suspension issue. Crossing fingers.

This is a sad story.

 

[jkdman123]

Did you get the multiple alignments at the same place? Alignments seem like they're not that difficult IF the person doing them A) knows what they're doing and B) does what they're supposed to.

If you got alignments at 2 diff places then I would suspect a suspension problem more. The odds that you ran into 2 lazy and/or incompetent alignment techs seems low. Seems like the issue you had with your right rear tire on the inside makes sense given the alignment sheet you showed.

I think I would insist with Tesla that they look not just for overt damage, but really look closely for a suspension component that may only be bent slightly.

The downside to this is that they're gonna blame that on you, even if the car is still under warranty unless the damage is obviously a defective part (and even then they'll probably still blame you).

Is this the only service center that is within a day's drive of your home?

 

[XPsionic]

So are the current tires on the car new and road force balanced or not? Are you on OEM rims?

There's nothing wrong with the alignment specs sheet you posted, if you have wear on the inside of the tire then the toe and camber would be causing that, and it sure doesn't look like that's the problem either before or after that particular alignment.

Right now the thing to do is to either 1. Get a brand new set of tires and get it road force balanced 2. Road force balance your current set of tires but make sure they're definitely completely round and that your rims have no damage.

Unless there's some major damage in the suspension component, or bushings are really worn out and loose, you shouldn't get vibrations if the wheels are properly mounted and balanced. Any competent alignment shop would use a pry bar and give your suspension arms an inspection to see how much give the bushings have. If they're loose or worn, you could get uncontrolled vibrations even if the wheel/tire is balanced and your damper's in good shape. Another potential issue is a worn out suspension damper.

I've had a car with properly balanced tires that was shaking badly because the rims didn't have the right hub sizing and required hub rings which weren't installed, but if you have OEM rims then that wouldn't be an issue. I've also had a car which was driven for too many miles on unbalanced tires, which caused scalloping and uneven wear, which caused some high and low spots on the tire itself.

Anyway, see if you could do either #1 or #2 in my suggestion to start with and go from there I think.

 

[father_of_6]

Did you get the multiple alignments at the same place?

No. I had the alignment done at a Tesla certified body shop, then replaced the tires because the ride was still janky, then found a Goodyear tire that offered "free alignment checks" and decided to see if it was still aligned (because the Tesla SA said typically they find suspension problems when a car won't stay aligned).

That Goodyear duped me into paying because "we fixed it"... so I opted for buying a 3 year alignment subscription for a nominal increase in price. This alignment > new tires > alignment all happened within 2 days. Then I had the new tires road force balanced 2 months later. None of these things made a bit of difference to the ride quality. Because of the slimy way that Goodyear roped me into paying for the alignment, I can't really trust their numbers... they muddied the investigation. I'll post that sheet for reference though.

I think I would insist with Tesla that they look not just for overt damage, but really look closely for a suspension component that may only be bent slightly.

The downside to this is that they're gonna blame that on you, even if the car is still under warranty unless the damage is obviously a defective part (and even then they'll probably still blame you).

Is this the only service center that is within a day's drive of your home?

Sadly, this is the only service center. When I schedule for service, it actually only shows me a few locations in the Toronto, Ontario area, then I need to ask them to move me to Rochester (I don't think Canadian service centers can take U.S. vehicles).

The service center employees aren't terrible or anything, but they're weeks out on appointments so probably very overworked and under appreciated.

I fully expect anything they find to be blamed on me... and it's possible I *am* at fault, although I'm not aware of any specific incident that caused this. It just started one day. Actually - I'm pretty sure that day I went *really* slowly over a speed bump and at an angle, so one tire at a time. Perhaps related.

So are the current tires on the car new and road force balanced or not? Are you on OEM rims?

So at this time I have OEM rims with Quatrac Pro tires, the rear right being dangerously worn in the innermost tread.

In my garage I have a full set of OEM rims plus OEM tires (MXM4) that I bought from an owner here on TMC... he claimed to have driven them only 40 miles home from delivery and immediately swapped them.

Right now the thing to do is to either 1. Get a brand new set of tires and get it road force balanced 2. Road force balance your current set of tires but make sure they're definitely completely round and that your rims have no damage.

My plan at this point is to have the tires swapped and road force balanced, then visit Goodyear again for a free alignment. This time I'll ask "pretty please" for perfectly even alignment with zero toe.

I'll keep my appointment with Tesla next week and hope they can find a suspension issue. Ideally they'll fix it goodwill, but if I have to pay, then crossing fingers it won't break the bank and it *will* resolve the ride quality issue.

 

[father_of_6]

This is from Goodyear. They probably *totally* fudged the numbers.

Now that I think about it, my story was a bit jumbled. I think the order went:

1. Alignment from Tesla certified body shop
2. AIignment from Goodyear... magically it was out of alignment two days later.
3. New tires within a few weeks of this.
4. Alignment again at Goodyear... presto, nothing to align, it's already within specs... so they definitely muddied the investigation.

 

[XPsionic]

In my garage I have a full set of OEM rims plus OEM tires (MXM4) that I bought from an owner here on TMC... he claimed to have driven them only 40 miles home from delivery and immediately swapped them.

My plan at this point is to have the tires swapped and road force balanced, then visit Goodyear again for a free alignment. This time I'll ask "pretty please" for perfectly even alignment with zero toe.

If those MXM4s already mounted on rims, I'm assuming you're just gonna put the tire+rims on the car right? Don't pay to get the tires swapped onto your rims unless you have different rims that you just love. If I were you I'd just put the MXM4 tires+rims on the car myself at home. It's just like a 30 min job and you'll immediately narrow down the vibration issues this way. If they're brand new OEM then they should be well balanced and shouldn't have any issues. Alternatively if you don't have the capacity to swap wheels yourself, bring the MXM4s+rims to a tire shop and get them to road force balance them and put on the car.

The alignment specs sheet, it looks great. If that's the specs now you don't need another alignment, the car doesn't need zero toe, that's not the safe way manufacturers spec the car. A little bit of toe in is completely normal and stabilizes the car especially under hard braking.

 

[father_of_6]

If those MXM4s already mounted on rims, I'm assuming you're just gonna put the tire+rims on the car right?

The seller kept the TPMS sensors, so the tires aren't mounted. I'll need someone to swap and road force balance.

If that *does* resolve the ride jank, I'll be very happy. I believe that would imply an out of round rim, right?

Only issue with that is that the ride jank didn't really seem to change with rotations... plus it doesn't explain inside tread wear on only one tire.

Why can't these cars fly yet? Sure am tired of tires.

 

[ankit]

I don't have any insights for you, but curious about the vibrations/wobbliness. Does this happen at certain speeds, certain types of roads, is the vibration in the steering or the entire car, does it matter if you are accelerating or not? One thing to check would be the bolts on the control arm that are known to come loose on these cars.

 

[father_of_6]

I don't have any insights for you, but curious about the vibrations/wobbliness. Does this happen at certain speeds, certain types of roads, is the vibration in the steering or the entire car, does it matter if you are accelerating or not? One thing to check would be the bolts on the control arm that are known to come loose on these cars.

This is really tricky. I haven't been able to associate it with any specific conditions. It seems to always be there, but sometimes worse, sometimes better. At highway speeds I've felt fairly significant shudder, but not always. I would tend to describe it as a "woo woo woo" rotational sound.

 

[father_of_6]

I could be wrong, perhaps this is only in my head... but it might be less pronounced with a hearty adult in the front passenger seat.

 

[KenC]

That first alignment sheet the numbers were good, but the presentation of the sheet was not easy to read. You usually see the second alignment sheet, where it's far more obvious.

The 2nd sheet, all 4 toes were out, which can cause feathering etc. Did the left rear show the most feathering?

Do you have a specialist suspension shop in the area that can look over your suspension? Maybe a place that MPP, Mountain Pass Performance, recommends?

I'm not at all confident that Tesla SC is going to figure out the problem. This seems like a problem for someone who specializes in suspension.

 

[father_of_6]

That first alignment sheet the numbers were good, but the presentation of the sheet was not easy to read. You usually see the second alignment sheet, where it's far more obvious.

Yeah... I understand what they were trying to do, showing the before and after for each tire next to you... but it definitely feels like more of a brain teaser.

The 2nd sheet, all 4 toes were out, which can cause feathering etc. Did the left rear show the most feathering?

I don't exactly recall, but I *think* they were equally feathered. To clarify... these alignment spec sheets were both on the same set of tires, taken just a few days apart from 2 different shops.

Do you have a specialist suspension shop in the area that can look over your suspension? Maybe a place that MPP, Mountain Pass Performance, recommends?

I'm not specifically familiar with any place, but I expect to Google and find someone. I'm likely going to cancel my appointment at the SC.

I'm not at all confident that Tesla SC is going to figure out the problem. This seems like a problem for someone who specializes in suspension.

Yeah, that's what I suspect... thanks for weighing in.

 

[father_of_6]

More to the story... that rear passenger tire went totally flat today. The car's at a tire place now for a full wheel swap.

I'm planning to get road force balancing / alignment / suspension inspection locally and cancel my appointment.

It's just too far of a drive for "cross fingers and hope they do something and it doesn't cost a second mortgage".

 

[rpiotro]

View attachment 892473

This is from Goodyear. They probably *totally* fudged the numbers.

Now that I think about it, my story was a bit jumbled. I think the order went:

1. Alignment from Tesla certified body shop
2. AIignment from Goodyear... magically it was out of alignment two days later.
3. New tires within a few weeks of this.
4. Alignment again at Goodyear... presto, nothing to align, it's already within specs... so they definitely muddied the investigation.

I'd wonder when their alignment rack was last calibrated.