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Service says $22k for new battery on 2012 Model S

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So my battery got replaced 2 months back, but it failed again 1 month ago and I am waiting on another one. Does you pack look really clean and new like mine did?

While that sticker looks newly printed, the information on it ("T14L...") indicates that the original manufacture date of this remanufactured battery was December ("L" month) 2014. Thus unfortunately old enough to fail that quickly.
 
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So I got the car back with the REMAN 1014116-00-C. There is NO sticker/label on the battery. I have checked behind left/right front wheel.

It’s around 74 F outside and I went straitht for supercharging (15 min drive). Sadly, battery i still nerfed and I assume it’s a 85Kwh pack, not 90 Kwh. Charging starts at 80 Kw around 20 % (only some seconds), then appr. 60 kw and down. It takes about one hour to charge from 20-80 %. It seems like I have lost range compared to the old battery. I get 320 km (typical)@ 90 % charge = 199 miles. I used to have around 350 km. Perhaps it’s an BMS issue? I have to ask Tesla, but I'm not so happy with my «swap».

Per your description, it is definitely a Reman pack. There is no charging curve warranty, but my warranty booklet states:

"When replacing a Battery, Tesla will ensure that the energy capacity of the replacement Battery is at least equal to that of the original Battery before the failure occurred."
 
I got my Model S VIN 1751 off the line back in 2012 and have had it ever since. On Feb 14th during the day, I pulled it out of the garage with 114 miles showing on the battery. I woke up in the morning with some battery low errors. When I got into the car, it told me that the car wouldn't drive because it needed service, the 12V battery was low voltage and the HV battery was at 0 miles. After calling Tesla Roadside Assistance, they connected to the car and said that it had to be towed to a service center. I was able to get it towed to the closes Tesla service center and now they the tell me my warranty for the drivetrain expired on 1/9/21 (one month earlier) and the HV battery has to be replace for $22k. If my battery was 8 years old, I would be ok with that. I assumed a level of risk having a car for this long and I expected that the battery would go bad at some point. It's just a shame that it died a month after the warranty expired. The kicker for me is that I had a faulty backflow prevention valve in my HV battery 1.5 years ago and had the battery replaced under warranty. Now service is telling me that if I buy a new battery for $22k I get a 4 year/50k mile warranty on the new battery, but the battery they replaced 1.5 years ago only had a one year warranty for parts. I feel I had to somewhat document this to people as I am one of the first roughly 2k-2.5k cars that are out of warranty at this point and I seem to be one of the first to at least document out of warranty replacement options on this site (at least as my search abilities go). So be careful when that warranty expires. You are on your own. Tesla isn't budging on helping my 1.5 year old bad battery and now essentially bricked car. From what I can tell, the car is worth somewhere between $18k-25k working. I'm not sure yet if I'm going forward with the battery replacement to sell it or not.
I am pretty sure there are people who will just replace the bad modules for you I know my friend does that on Priuses
 
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I am pretty sure there are people who will just replace the bad modules…
Jason Hughes (@wk057) does a pretty good job explaining the math and statistics around how close your modules have to be to do this. The variation is high enough and the inventory low enough now that Tesla might not be able to module swap themselves. Jason doesn’t even try and he’s probably got access to the largest number of modules outside of Tesla.

There are also people that open up packs and modules to snip individual cells. You don’t want to hear what Jason says about that.
 
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Jason Hughes (@wk057) does a pretty good job explaining the math and statistics around how close your modules have to be to do this. The variation is high enough and the inventory low enough now that Tesla might not be able to module swap themselves. Jason doesn’t even try and he’s probably got access to the largest number of modules outside of Tesla.

There are also people that open up packs and modules to snip individual cells. You don’t want to hear what Jason says about that.
If you have a single bad cell, maybe if you snip a cell in every module you could get away with it. Wouldn't try it though.
 
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...
That being said, battery longevity and cost is an issue that does not effect ICE vehicles. Age does not hurt an ICE engine that much and catastrophic failure is very uncommon in the first 20 years. Not unheard of but uncommon for cars say manufactured in the 1990s. And then there is an easier path to a few $k used replacement - since failure is so uncommon.
...

Never owned an Audi?
 
Here's some actual Experian data on car lifespans, based on US registration data. Not only do they bust some myths about vehicle age and durability, they show what the industry thinks about car lifespans. There's a term in there called the 'Sweet Spot' because it's the age of vehicle where people are likely to spend big dollars on repairs. Guess when the industry things that is? 6 to 12 years old.

What this means for us is that if a majority of these EVs are making it to 12 years old, they're matching the trends of the industry at large. Personally I think we can do better than that, once we work out some of the issues that killed DUs and packs early on in production..
 
No, never owned an Audi.
Mostly Japanese cars - including an RX-7 that I threw a used motor in. I said uncommon - certainly some German brands with some engines are an issue but nothing beats the RX-7. I think I paid $2100 for a reman engine back in the 90s. So even adjusting for inflation, a different world of cost.

I don't agree that that slick presentation "debunked" anything. One has to wonder what the agenda is to keep using that word.

I think is is beyond obvious that between 6 and 12 years old is when the most money is spent on repairs. Given that warranties are around 4 years typically and the design is going to give some cushion on failures so that few failures occur before 4 years. And years 5 and 6 are generally pretty good.

It is also pretty clear that when a car is over 12 years old and worth 10% of original value, people aren't going to spend big money on repairs.

The average age of cars is 12 years old. The population is growing over time which skews the curve but even still, it means 1/2 the cars on the road are 12 years old or more and surviving when no one would put big money into them. Can we say the same for a Tesla (ie surviving without big money).

You have to wonder when they are talking about small changes in percentages of 3 year old cars not being on the road anymore - that is 99% accidents or floods and 1% lemons. That has nothing to do with longevity. Slide 22.

Good to see EVs up 60% Q1/22 over Q1/21!
 
Sometimes it's really nice to have data to back up things that seem obvious, because when you dig in to the data you'll find it supports different conclusions than you first though. If you have other data to support what you're thinking here feel free to point to it.
 

EUR 12,600 (tax included) for remanufactured battery.

Link takes you to google translation.
 
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Per your description, it is definitely a Reman pack. There is no charging curve warranty, but my warranty booklet states:

"When replacing a Battery, Tesla will ensure that the energy capacity of the replacement Battery is at least equal to that of the original Battery before the failure occurred."
Yes, I have complained. First they said it was normal with a new battery. I apparently had to drive the car to loose minimum 10 % battery capacity, and then recharge to 100 % 3 times for the BMS to calibrate (or something like that). Done that, and I’ve still have lost approx. 9 % capacity “Typical” estimated. (100% charge =221 miles typical.)

They did a remote diagnosis and wanted the car back in for a “inspection”, so let’s see how it goes. I tried to ask about out the battery, but the person I front couldn’t tell any details about the “new” stickerless battery at all.
 
Yes, I have complained. First they said it was normal with a new battery. I apparently had to drive the car to loose minimum 10 % battery capacity, and then recharge to 100 % 3 times for the BMS to calibrate (or something like that). Done that, and I’ve still have lost approx. 9 % capacity “Typical” estimated. (100% charge =221 miles typical.)

They did a remote diagnosis and wanted the car back in for a “inspection”, so let’s see how it goes. I tried to ask about out the battery, but the person I front couldn’t tell any details about the “new” stickerless battery at all.
Do you have an image of the invoice with your personal information and VIN covered up? The additional parts list would help figure out if the right battery was installed, or there was some kind of mix up at the Service Center or shipping. I am guessing a mistake was made in shipping.
 
Do you have an image of the invoice with your personal information and VIN covered up? The additional parts list would help figure out if the right battery was installed, or there was some kind of mix up at the Service Center or shipping. I am guessing a mistake was made in shipping.
I just picked the car. For days they have been tuning the battery up and down and slowly getting more range out of it (checked severeal time a day through the app). They never managed to get out more than approx 2-3% less than my old pack (377 vs 389 km). Last night I got a message it was finished, and the Invoice says indeed "Inspected and confirmed customer`s concern. Found that an incorrect high voltage battery pack was installed. Replaced HV battery and confirmed normal vehicle operation."
There is no information about the new battery on the invoice, but finally it seems like I got a real 1014116-00-C. The battery has a sticker, and there is no word about it beeing a reman pack. Serial nr starts with T22 (produced 2022??), so I guess it's a new battery. My only concern is that it's a 350V battery on a performance car, but over all I'm happy. I'll check supercharging the next days.
 

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… 2022??), so I guess it's a new battery. My only concern is that it's a 350V battery…
I find this fascinating. I never thought that they might have to make 350v previous generation batteries in 2022. Or that it might be cheaper to make one, or a batch, than to have stockpiled completed batteries for warranty use.

As for the 350v vs 400v, it is ironic you’d get a 350v in Norway since Norway got some of the 400v 75kWh (BTX8) that we don’t have in the US.
 
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I just picked the car. For days they have been tuning the battery up and down and slowly getting more range out of it (checked severeal time a day through the app). They never managed to get out more than approx 2-3% less than my old pack (377 vs 389 km). Last night I got a message it was finished, and the Invoice says indeed "Inspected and confirmed customer`s concern. Found that an incorrect high voltage battery pack was installed. Replaced HV battery and confirmed normal vehicle operation."
There is no information about the new battery on the invoice, but finally it seems like I got a real 1014116-00-C. The battery has a sticker, and there is no word about it beeing a reman pack. Serial nr starts with T22 (produced 2022??), so I guess it's a new battery. My only concern is that it's a 350V battery on a performance car, but over all I'm happy. I'll check supercharging the next days.

Great for you. Looks like a new 14-modules battery manufactured in April of 2022. Would you also report your full range or the SMT capacity screenshot? Your full range should be ~271 miles.

Also, you are not the only "P" owner who has received the 1014116-00-C pack. See this post, for example:


Edit:
Removed the cell type due to uncertainty.
 
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Great for you. Looks like a new 14-modules battery manufactured in April of 2022. Would you also report your full range or the SMT capacity screenshot? Your full range should be ~271 miles.

Also, you are not the only "P" owner who has received the 1014116-00-C pack. See this post, for example:


Edit:
Removed the cell type due to uncertainty.
I don't have Scan My Tesla or equal, and the app nor the car makes a 100% range estimate. It used to do so, but I just got a new GUI (MCU1-->MCU2). Something I'm misssing??? However, I get 143 miles@58% charge = 246 miles. They worked with the old battery for a long time, and must have done the battery swap late last night. They added 5 km of charge to the battery If I should believe the app, so I guess this battery isn't fully balanced/calibrated yet (I hope..... :))
 
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I don't have Scan My Tesla or equal, and the app nor the car makes an 100% range estimate. It used to do so, but I just got a new GUI (MCU1-->MCU2). Something I'm misssing??? However, I get 143 miles@58% charge = 245 miles. They worked with the old battery for a long time, and must have done the battery swap late last night. They added 5 km of charge to the battery If I should believe the app, so I guess this battery isn't fully balanced/calibrated yet (I hope..... :))

I currently have MCU1 and the app charge slider no longer shows the miles, only the percentage after one of the previous SW updates.

The label you posted does not indicate this is a remanufactured pack and if they have not capped you at the top, as they did to another 101411600-C owner I know, you should get ~271 miles. Can you charge it to 100% at least once to see what you get?
 
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I currently have MCU1 and the app charge slider no longer shows the miles, only the percentage after one of the previous SW updates.

The label you posted does not indicate this is a remanufactured pack and if they have not capped you at the top, as they did to another 101411600-C owner I know, you should get ~271 miles. Can you charge it to 100% at least once to see what you get?
I'll definitely charge to 100% a couple of times. I'll post the milage here .