Shopping for a new Electric car. Former Eniro / Model 3 owner.

[CertLive]

I am on the Tesla website now looking at a model Y long range. Up front I did not have a very good model 3 experience with a car full of production / failure issues. I did however like the style and charging infrastructure. But now that I have a second chance to buy and at 6 foot 4 I was on the comfort limits of the model 3 for long trips. I think the Y potentially looks like the more comfortable long term solution because its more upright seating position. So I have some practical questions before I commit to a model Y or an EV6 being a past owner of EV's.

Has the vision based system with no radar been just fine for lane keeping and less phantom breaking? I have none of these issues using a Kia Sportage Diesel with the same features as a fill in until I can get hold of an EV. It keeps to the lane without going off down another road sporadically. Kind of wish they had an EV version of that but not for some time. Solid car though no issues using its road and car following technology.

Did you pick the car up with no issues? I expect this for a car worth 50K I expect an employee of the company to give it a multi point pre delivery inspection actually so I do not have to drive it back the next day with obvious unfun discoveries.

How is the range compared to what was expected? I suppose UK winter stats are what I am looking for. For me it shows 331 miles WLTP? Should I expect 250 miles enjoying all the car has for long trips? I ask this to you because there is no other variable apart from WLTP. Only experience with Y would really get me close to working out this one.

When I commit I have to wait until September now which is fine but I want to also lay down what I expect as a customer and are the model Y's coming out in 2022 in good shape day one. I want a good pickup experience this time. This is shaped by experience so far and I want to know have Tesla listened at all and addressed this? I ask people here not the customer service / sales or Youtube videos. The passionate users!

 

[jcanoe]

Tesla being Tesla you should expect that there will be probably be some fit and finish issues with the vehicle. Panel gaps, hatch alignment, bumper color match with the rest of the vehicle may be there if you look closely.

The Model Y has a heat pump system that is much more efficient than the stator heating used in your Model 3. Stator heating is still used to warm the battery but the cabin temperature is maintained by a heat pump system. Still, the different body shape of the Model Y and the 500 pounds additional weight take a toll on efficiency and range. I would disregard the EPA combined city/highway estimate of 330 miles, discount this by at least 13% for a range of~287 miles. For winter driving assume almost 40% loss of range due to temperature, so expect something around ~200 miles of range in winter. As with the Model 3 the Supercharger network makes longer trips very practical. Plan on stopping every 2 hours for ~10 to 15 minutes at a V3 Supercharger.

 

[NovaTech]

I picked up my MYP in Dec of last year and was very pleased to not discover any fit and finish issues. Gaps were good, paint was fine, and no interior marks or scratches. I think complainers are much more vocal than praisers. At delivery, I was invited to look the car over very thoroughly and mention any areas where I was displeased so they could be corrected. I found none..
I'm 6'2" and find the car very comfortable. My wife has commented several times that I've never looked so comfortable behind the wheel of any previous vehicle we've owned. Range is definitely reduced in the winter - probably by 25-30 percent; 40% is a stretch imo... maybe in Canada or Alaska. As you know, range is heavily influenced by speed. I've not had issues with the vision system; there were some bugs reported that seem to have been fixed with recent software updates.

 

[Brian-MS90D]

Range is heavily influenced by speed in the Model Y due to wind resistance. This is why you will see large discrepancies in people reporting real world range. You'll be near EPA if you keep it between 60 - 65mph. You'll be much further from EPA as you get above 65 mph (and it's not linear, unfortunately).

I've not had any issues with my MYP, which was a big improvement over the (still great) experience with my previous MS.

In my previous MS, I had paid for Enhanced Auto Pilot and it was terrible (as you mentioned). I did not pay for the AP on my MYP and it is much, much better (I can't even remember the last phantom brake), and I road trip a lot. \

Finally, keep in mind the average price for a new car is $47k (at least in US). Therefore, a Y is not an expensive car at all (as you seemed to allude to).

 

[tashtibet]

fit & finish issue is a relative thing-do you think any other cars have none? Expectations & over blown comments on social medias make us more uncomfortable. But the reality is that waiting rooms for Tesla is full.

 

[WindPower]

I’ve had my model Y since Dec 2020. The car is fine: I had no major paint or panel issues when I received my car. The Y is not a luxury car, but for basic daily driving, it works for me.
Auto steer is still not perfect and I have radar in my car. Even with the latest updates I’ve had random braking issues. Lane departure warning is not reliable (though it seems to better than when I initially received my car). Lane departure warning is an essential feature for me, and I’m aware of when it works or doesn’t. Lane departure warning saved me from a major accident in a rented Toyota on the 405 in LA so it’s the one safety feature I depend most heavily on. The Y’s implementation is not perfect.
As for comfort, I find in the Y my right leg gets tired on a longish (1 hour or more) trip so I use adaptive cruise control but keep my hands on the wheel. This allows me to move my legs around a bit. ACC works very well in the Y.
Range is no where near what Tesla claims so be aware of this. I have the long range model Y and I extrapolate 100% to be around 260 miles when driving normally. This works for me so I don’t care what Tesla claims, but you should be aware of this in case you depend on more range.

 

[gx9901]

My MYP was delivered to my house last September. I didn't even see the guy who delivered my car as I was in the house when he arrived then left via Uber. I did not see any fit and finish issues on my car.

Regarding the vision only system, I have only experienced phantom braking once during my nearly 7 months of driving the MYP, but there are plenty of complaints about it in these forums, so I don't know. I would assume you will experience it in a vision only car but don't know to what extent.

I don't know how cold it gets in the UK, but in Minnesota, I've observed AT LEAST a 40% decrease in range when temps fall below 10F (compared to my observed range when temps are above 40F). Range starts going down once temps get below 40F for me. Still, because of the relatively long range it has, I did not run into any range issues in the winter during day to day driving.

 

[ShelJW]

I picked up my MYP in Dec of last year and was very pleased to not discover any fit and finish issues. Gaps were good, paint was fine, and no interior marks or scratches. I think complainers are much more vocal than praisers. At delivery, I was invited to look the car over very thoroughly and mention any areas where I was displeased so they could be corrected. I found none..
I'm 6'2" and find the car very comfortable.

This post could have been written by me, up to the point above... my experience exactly!

Picked up my Model Y Performance on Dec. 26, 2021, and it really was flawless... gaps were very close and equal throughout the car, no parts rattle, the only minor issue was a really tiny piece of plastic was left unremoved, at the roof liner on the interior. Five minutes and we had it removed (well, the Tesla guy came over at our request, and removed it)

My car was built in Fremont, as I'm in Los Angeles but I would expect the new Tesla Model Y's from Germany would be even better built!

I've loved the Y in the few months I've owned ours. It has flaws (no mood lighting, no heads up display) but overall, it's really a fantastic car that hasn't had any build quality issues.

 

[jjrandorin]

I am on the Tesla website now looking at a model Y long range. Up front I did not have a very good model 3 experience with a car full of production / failure issues. I did however like the style and charging infrastructure. But now that I have a second chance to buy and at 6 foot 4 I was on the comfort limits of the model 3 for long trips. I think the Y potentially looks like the more comfortable long term solution because its more upright seating position. So I have some practical questions before I commit to a model Y or an EV6 being a past owner of EV's.

Has the vision based system with no radar been just fine for lane keeping and less phantom breaking? I have none of these issues using a Kia Sportage Diesel with the same features as a fill in until I can get hold of an EV. It keeps to the lane without going off down another road sporadically. Kind of wish they had an EV version of that but not for some time. Solid car though no issues using its road and car following technology.

Did you pick the car up with no issues? I expect this for a car worth 50K I expect an employee of the company to give it a multi point pre delivery inspection actually so I do not have to drive it back the next day with obvious unfun discoveries.

How is the range compared to what was expected? I suppose UK winter stats are what I am looking for. For me it shows 331 miles WLTP? Should I expect 250 miles enjoying all the car has for long trips? I ask this to you because there is no other variable apart from WLTP. Only experience with Y would really get me close to working out this one.

When I commit I have to wait until September now which is fine but I want to also lay down what I expect as a customer and are the model Y's coming out in 2022 in good shape day one. I want a good pickup experience this time. This is shaped by experience so far and I want to know have Tesla listened at all and addressed this? I ask people here not the customer service / sales or Youtube videos. The passionate users!

The 2022 model Y performance I bought in March of this year is built much better than my 2018 Model 3 performance. With that being said, I do remember your previous experiences, and based on what you asked here, those experiences are still "fresh and raw" for you.

I would not recommend tesla to someone in your position. Even minor things that happen will drive you crazy, and you will think "WTF why did I do this again, this is just like before" even if it isnt quite like before.

You should buy some other EV brand, as you likely need a fresh start if you go back to an EV.

 

[mangrove79]

The 2022 model Y performance I bought in March of this year is built much better than my 2018 Model 3 performance. With that being said, I do remember your previous experiences, and based on what you asked here, those experiences are still "fresh and raw" for you.

I would not recommend tesla to someone in your position. Even minor things that happen will drive you crazy, and you will think "WTF why did I do this again, this is just like before" even if it isnt quite like before.

You should buy some other EV brand, as you likely need a fresh start if you go back to an EV.

I haven't been on this board long enough to have read the OP's earlier posts, but sounds like someone that's still very open-minded based on this thread. There are so many past owners that claim to have "escaped the Tesla cult" and bash anything Tesla every chance they get. That makes them more and more like they're still in the cult, LOL. But I agree that people who can truly forgive and not retain a bias based purely on past experiences are rare. I'm not one of them .

Back on topic. No fit and finish issues with my May 2021 MYLR whatsoever. Only one issue so far and it's with the left repeater camera having moisture. Mobile service fixed it in 5 min, and I didn't even need to move my MY out of the garage. The guy managed to do the work in a 2-ft space, amazing. Very few phantom breaking in my daily driving - nothing more than a 5-mph slowdowns, if any, since a Jan update (2021.xx).

 

[Bassmanbrett]

Finally, keep in mind the average price for a new car is $47k (at least in US). Therefore, a Y is not an expensive car at all (as you seemed to allude to).

"Expensive" is a relative term, but the MY definitely is not average price. Even if you just get a basic MYLR, after taxes and fees, you're looking at approximately $67k. That's 43% higher than the national average of $47k.

 

[nate704]

most average people drive $25k-$30k SUV/CUV same size as MY. Yes, Tesla cars are expensive.

 

[DayTrippin]

We originally were going with a 3 and ordered the Y due to towing limitations. We recently sold the Y and bought a 3. I am a pretty big guy and I have to say I am more comfortable driving the 3 than the Y even though getting in the 3 is a bit tougher. I like the more of the feet forward and straight out and I have more legroom in the 3 than the Y. The Y also put my left knee at an odd bend and the footwell felt more cramped on the Y.

My 2021 MY LR was put together as good as any I've ever seen come from Tesla. The 2022 3 LR was pretty good. Not perfect but nothing really worth having them fix as often it gets worse. So I am living with one frunk gap that is more than I'd like.

The 3's autopilot has been a thousand times better than the Y's. Granted I had a Y when they first switched to TeslaVision and removed radar but the phantom braking was a major issue. It got better but never as good as my 3 has been. The current owner of the car still has some issues that are reproducible even on the latest version of software. I have had only 1 phantom braking even in my 3 in 2k miles and it wasn't braking but more like a gentle lift of the throttle. I probably had 500 of them in my Y in 5k miles. So far 0 in my S in just over 1k miles. Some of the PB events were very severe on the Y such as slam on the brakes at 80 mph and pray nobody behind me hit before I could get on the throttle again. This was on a 4 lane divided highway.

Driving the 3 the same as I did the Y, I get MUCH closer to the claimed range than I ever did with the Y. Overall the 3 sips electrons compared to my Y and the Y guzzles them faster than my 2022 Model S.

If you don't need the extra room of the Y, buy the 3. The 3 is more fun to drive on a daily basis, a lot quicker at all speeds, cheaper to buy up front, and uses less energy. If you are older, have some physical issues that make it harder to bend, and need to an easier car to get into the Y is a great choice. If you need car seats in the back, the Y is clearly better. You have more leg room for the 2nd row in the Y.

The biggest benefit for me with the Y (since Tesla doesn't support towing with the 3 in the US) was the hatch. In reality the trunk floor size between the 3 and Y are pretty close to being the same. The taller height of the hatch, along with it being a hatch, gives a bit more options to what you can load in the boot. I am still surprised though how much I can fit in the 3 a lot of times when I go to the home supply store.

If I had to boil it down to maybe what might be a controversial is the Y is a bigger, clumsier, less athletic version of the 3. The Y is still a good car but I think the 3 is better overall except in the areas it can't compete in the sense it doesn't off 7 seats, hatch, towing, etc.

There still isn't anything the class of the 3 or Y that I would take over the Tesla. I looked at the Ford, BMW, Polestar and others and hard to beat the overall Tesla package at this point. I'd say go with a Tesla again even though there are things they still need to work out. Obviously if the lingering feelings are too strong you might not give it a fair shake which would be a shame as they are definitely getter better.

A good site for a nice comparison between 3 and Y for dimensions.

Tesla Model 3 vs. Tesla Model Y: Side-By-Side Comparison

See which market-leading EV is right for you with our Tesla Model 3 vs. Model Y comparison guide. Explore the specs, features, safety, and more on this page.

www.autoflex.com

Here is the data for seating from that link. "Front-seat passengers in a Model 3 will get 40.3-inches of headroom and 42.7-inches of legroom; Model Y front-occupants will get 41-inches of headroom and 41.8-inches of legroom. Both are competitive measurements in their class. Model 3 passengers will find 37.7-inches of headroom and 35.2-inches of legroom in the rear seats, while Model Y rear passengers are provided with 39.4-inches of headroom and 40.5-inches of legroom."

 

[CertLive]

Thank You that was a good read. Mostly very positive good to hear! Worth giving it another go I think.

 

[jjrandorin]

Thank You that was a good read. Mostly very positive good to hear! Worth giving it another go I think.

The thing is, tesla is still the same company as the one in which you talked about here:

Model 3 Customer cannon fodder & the right to full refund Dekra Report

Its been a rather frustrating time owning a model 3. It was meant to be part of an enjoyable YouTube series which ended in me personally not wanting to poster something of bad quality. Yes I held back. I have documented here the cluster of a pickup experience with pictures and video in another...

teslamotorsclub.com

There are still complaints over phantom braking, and the complaints have not changed. Some people experience a lot, some not very much. There are still complaints about panel gaps, or delivery tasks. Some experience it, some dont.

The "Rated range" issue has not changed.

The only thing that is changed, at least in my opinion, is that, in general, the cars are built a bit better than they were, but the company is still the same.

Given everything you expressed in the thread I linked above (and other feedback you had before), I dont think its changed enough for someone who had the experience you had, and the things you previously expressed (at least here) to buy again, unless your expectations have changed. The OP post in this thread does not look like your expectations have changed, so...

I am not a "brand loyal" person, I dont own any tesla stock, etc. I just happen to believe not every product or companies way of doing business is "right" for everyone, and I dont think tesla has changed very much since Sept of 2020. Especially not in the customer service point of view, or the "rated range" point of view.

Im not saying "I dont think you are worthy" or something, so please dont take it that way. I am saying "your expectations likely dont line up with where tesla is now, because its my belief they have not changed significantly since the above mentioned thread.

 

[Brian-MS90D]

"Expensive" is a relative term, but the MY definitely is not average price. Even if you just get a basic MYLR, after taxes and fees, you're looking at approximately $67k. That's 43% higher than the national average of $47k.

Haha, you're bending over backwards to make your point. For example, you didn't apply "after taxes and fees" to the average price car (which does not include taxes and fees). And, you're using the latest Tesla prices which have increased substantially in the "supply chain economy," but not also increasing the (old) average vehicle price number (which will also be going up significantly when next updated due to same "supply chain economy). Some ICE vehicles are seeing price increases well beyond Tesla's increases, not to mention sky rocketing prices of all pre-owned vehicles.

In reality, the MYLR - before or after today's inflation - is about 15-23% higher (not 43% higher) than the national average new car purchase, which does not put it in "expensive" territory. More importantly, it doesn't put it in the territory of expecting significantly higher quality on delivery than the average vehicle, which was my underlying point (OP referenced a $50k car).

 

[FatherTo1]

Like earlier poster we had a Model S and now onto a Model Y. I dare say I love the Y more than our previous S! The Y is just very well executed and a perfect balance of size, utility, range, performance, and value. I loved my S but admit the Y fits our family better. My wife never drove my S even though I encouraged her to. The S was simply too big and low for her to be comfortable. The Y is a whole different story and the wife takes it out every chance she gets. The Y is more her car now than mine (of course it is our car but you get the picture).

Our 2019 S and 2021 Y were both pretty perfect upon delivery. I later found paint issues on the S but the Service Center was great and took care of it without any hassles. Our local service center has always been great to work with.

Despite all the new challengers in the market, Tesla is still the leader in software, charging infrastructure, and battery tech. The Y isn’t cheap but I also don’t consider it necessarily expensive either when you factor in total operating cost. We drive 20K miles a year and are saving $400/month in gas. Once you factor that in then our monthly loan+insurance+“fuel” cost is equivalent to a $35K ICE car, it’s just more of the monthly Y cost goes towards a bigger loan instead of gas. Once the loan goes away then it’s very cheap to drive the Y compared to ICE. This is completely ignoring maintenance costs, although EVs will chew through tires more quickly.