Shopping for an ICE for my wife...

[804son]

The electric propulsion angle is a good one. I like it and agree it is a feature.

But really what started this was the 'cost savings' argument.

If only an EV will do, and I get that for some it's the only way, well then now you are just comparing EV's with their respective EV counterparts and that's rather a small and expensive market.

But for most while electric propulsion is great, it's probably not more important than saving 5 figures over a vehicle's operating lifespan. Those people should study costs very carefully before buying a new EV. Now if they were going to buy a new $70K vehicle either way, well EVs will certainly reduce their fuel bill considerably and frankly saving $200/ month in gasoline is more an emotional signal than a monetary one if your dropping $70K on a car.

Supply vs. Demand sets the price of any given product. By definition that means that the Tesla equivalent of the vehicles you are comparing are worth 20k less.

 

[Suns_PSD]

804son, I think you'd argue with a wall. No point needed!

GL.

 

[voxel]

Please don't go down this idiotic rabbit hole. If one is about budet, one can get a cheaper EV and save. I didn't buy the MYP for luxury or one aspect over another. Its the whole package. And I would not have thought to buy a cheaper ICE vs the MYP, so I can save 20K which is a number made up for a BS fabricated argument. And then spend that 20K on gas for however long. I've never thought like that. And on the matter of cars, the cars I compared the MYP to are not 50K, luxo barges, those are the last freaking SUV's I'm interested in. The MYP for ex. competes against the likes of the AMG GLC 63 or BMW X3 M which are more expensive.

The same arguments I make about Teslas being overpriced for what they are - I will make towards RAV4 Primes (I've owned two). The Primes are $30K SUVs.. with basic interiors, crappy audio, 10 year old infotainment, and a mediocre driver assist package. The drivetrain is worth $25K. It's an engineering marvel. 36mpg at highway speeds while 300hp with a 42 mile EV mode. 550 miles of range at least. Also weighs 4000+lbs (I think 4500?)

Teslas have amazing drivetrains but the safety features are pretty barebones and I'm not impressed by Autopilot these days compared to other ADAS I've used. It's really a $35-40K SUV with a $30K EV drivetrain.

Folks wanting real luxury aren't going to buy Toyotas and Teslas. They are kinda budgety in feel. At least the 3s and Ys are. The X and S are like Lexus trims

 

[Harsh Patil]

Test drove the model y and 45e the same day last week. While I have always liked the minimalist feel of the teslas I just couldn’t ignore how harsh the ride was on it or the overall cheap quality materials used. Both me and wife liked the x5 for the ride and feel but the tesla for everything else. The hybrid powertrain is perfect as a step up from ICE only but I think will feel outdated in a couple of years with more evs on the market. I am assuming Tesla would hold the value better if I decide to get a better ev in the future than a bmw.
Decisions

 

[voxel]

Test drove the model y and 45e the same day last week. While I have always liked the minimalist feel of the teslas I just couldn’t ignore how harsh the ride was on it or the overall cheap quality materials used. Both me and wife liked the x5 for the ride and feel but the tesla for everything else. The hybrid powertrain is perfect as a step up from ICE only but I think will feel outdated in a couple of years with more evs on the market. I am assuming Tesla would hold the value better if I decide to get a better ev in the future than a bmw.
Decisions

If you want an X5 interior and ride quality your choices are a tad more expensive or lack range…. Genesis GV60, Audi e-tron (avoid Q4), iX ($100K+ for a decent trim - anything less doesn’t even include adaptive cruise), Cadillac Lyriq.

The Ioniq 5, EV6, ID.4 have pretty cheap interiors and crap audio/infotainment compared to a BMW. I own an i4 and would love an X5 with an EV drivetrain (probably would be $80K) that would slide under the weird/expensive iX.

Back in July, I was told X5 PHEV wait times were 6+ months. Not sure if build times have shortened (doubt it).

 

[nate704]

Also, you should know about the tire size of those "better ride quality" cars mentioned above. They all have 45 or 50 or higher side profile tires vs. 35 for the MYP, and those "better ride quality" cars are lacking the performance that MYP can provide.

 

[Darmie]

and I just can't do it. She's just not ready for us to own only EV's ( I have an S and a new Y).

My wife was ok in our Model S but not the easiest to get in and out according to her. We sold that in 2018 and purchased an X. She fell in love with it and has been most happy ever after. It truly is a Diva car in many ways. The model Y came along in 2020. She'll ride with me but really don't like it all that much. Most long trips we take her Model X. So I'm thinking there may still be grace if you think she may warm up to a Model X. It is a true SUV with 3rd row seating. You can get the captain rear chairs. Rear A/C. Falcon wing doors that are just down right awesome. Auto open close driver door. Capable of towing and on air ride.

Let us know what you may end up with.

 

[bobbyjae]

Test drove the model y and 45e the same day last week. While I have always liked the minimalist feel of the teslas I just couldn’t ignore how harsh the ride was on it or the overall cheap quality materials used. Both me and wife liked the x5 for the ride and feel but the tesla for everything else. The hybrid powertrain is perfect as a step up from ICE only but I think will feel outdated in a couple of years with more evs on the market. I am assuming Tesla would hold the value better if I decide to get a better ev in the future than a bmw.
Decisions

We have both the MY and a 45e and we prefer the X5 when hauling the whole family - better ride, comfort, and you still get the smooth instant torque of the hybrid/electric.

 

[Harsh Patil]

Also, you should know about the tire size of those "better ride quality" cars mentioned above. They all have 45 or 50 or higher side profile tires vs. 35 for the MYP, and those "better ride quality" cars are lacking the performance that MYP can provide.

Performance is the least of the variables I am going after. I have had a fair share of it using the BMWs in the past. As loyal as I am towards BMW I somehow feel I will regret the decision of going with it(also the 50e LCI coming up next summer not helping). I am already looking at options that would be available in the next 3-4 years to upgrade to and in which case a Tesla now will probably give me a better return.

 

[DanDi58]

I just came back from 8 days in Iceland where I rented a Toyota RAV4 Hybrid. I have to say, in my first time driving a Hybrid (and this was not the Prime plug-in, just a mild Hybrid), that I was fairly impressed. Haven't worked out the fuel mileage yet but the range was very good considering there were 5 adults plus our luggage for the week. We did about 1,700 kilometers. It was kind of fun to try and max the 'EV' range. But it's definitely not a performance enhancer as the car didn't appear to use the battery for acceleration (i.e., in passing, which you have to do a lot of there). It was certainly rugged as we did a number of what they call F roads (unpaved but sort-of groomed). Good vehicle for those purposes, and Hybrids (as well as BEV's) are all over the country.