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Shorting Oil, Hedging Tesla

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every time an american puts 10 gallons of gas in their tank, someone in China / India / Greece is staying home or riding a bike because the price of oil is just too expensive.

its like going to a house auction, the dominant bidders gets the house.

If America ceases to be part of that auction, then the dominant price bidder becomes China, a school teacher in China earns about $500 a month (depending on province) that middle class simply will not pay USA prices for oil.

maximum profit is not demonstrated until there is curtailment, somewhere around the the world, curtailment is happening, as it has for the past 50years.
Americans bidding up the price of oil has subsidized global oil production for past 50+ years.
Americans bidding up the price of oil has curtailed consumption by poorer nations for the past 50+ years
Ok, now I see what you have been trying to say. Thank you for taking the time to make that clear.

What you are describing is scarcity. There is too much demand for the available supply. Wealthier countries are able to bid up the price for a scarce good. The oil market is somewhere between a monopoly market and a competitive market. To the extent that OPEC is a capable cartel, the market tends closer to monopoly pricing, which produces less volume at a higher price than a competitive market. So the first problem to solve so that more supply is available at lower cost is to move toward a competitive market. The fact that OPEC is finding it hard to dictate a price in the face of shale producers is symptomatic that we are moving towards a more competitive market.

The second issue to deal with scarcity is to create alternative supply. This is precisely what all vehicle electrification leads to. By being able to plug your car in, you can now access every energy supply competing in the grid. This is already much cheaper than gasoline, even without renewables. But renewables will keep price pressure on all power generation to assure a low cost going forward.

So If wealthy countries like the US shift to EVs, this can lead to a reduction of demand that is highly insensitive to fuel prices. So yes, that could free up supply for the rest of the world, but there are two countervailing issues. This first is that as the price for fuels comes down, less quantity will be produced. That is, in a competitive market the marginal producer just breaks even at the market price. So as the market price falls more production is priced out of the market. So a reduction in demand leads to a reduction in available supply, even though the price may be more affordable by some. The second point is that the very electrification that satisfied demand in the US is also available to the developing world as well. In particular, segments that are the most price sensitive to fuels are likely to be the most motivated to seek lower cost alternatives. This is why the oil industry is fooling itself about the threat of EVs to demand. They think that EVs is just a toy for the wealthy and that they will find many willing buyers in developing countries to take their place. But what they are hoping is that replacing price insensitive consumers with price sensitive consumers will protect them from EVs which under cut on price. That is a completely illogical fantasy. One only needs to look at places like China where electrics scooters and electric buses are taking off. China as a nation probably has the most to gain economically from electrifying their transport system. On a volume basis, I expected EVs to displace fuel consumption much faster in China than in the US. What's necessary to grasp here is the distinction between compliance vehicles and competitive EVs. A certain measure of wealth may be needed for a government to dictate demand for compliance vehicles, and that is where we get this idea that wealthier countries will transition to EVs first. But as the cost of auto batteries approach $100/kWh, the economics kick in. We do not know how close Chinese battery makers are to $100/kWh, but as they get there, production of EVs will explode. I would submit that this is already happening with electric buses, which at 116k units in China was already a huge segment of the 777k unit EV market. If buses can keep doubling every year for a few more years, it will accelerate the whole EV market. Simply put, EVs will grow fastest where the need for lower cost alternatives to gasoline and diesel are greatest, not where EVs are a luxury. This is why the oil industry will get blindsided by EVs. They think of EVs as a luxury that developing countries cannot afford. But within ten years it should be clear that gasoline is a luxury that developing countries will sidestep with cheap EVs.
 
But oil used to be unique: if you wanted (individual) transport, if you wanted local economic activity, you literally couldn't do without. You can substitute coffee for tea, but you couldn't really do that with oil. For decades economic growth was growth in oil consumption. That's less true now: oil is about to experience that the "school teacher in China" has an alternative to using a fuel burning car. China is full of electric scooters, electric bikes and increasingly also electric cars. And it is not just China. It is all over Asia. I was in Myanmar the other day and found that every second bike was electric and there were many bikes. It really really really surprised me.

And that's the difference between the past 50 years and now. Yes, in the past, oil prices may have impacted on poorer nations oil consumption. But now poorer nations increasingly have alternatives. And just like many of them leapfrogged land-line telephony and adopted cellphones immediately, I see them jump to renewable alternatives quickly.
This is what I've been hammering on repeatedly: it used to be that there were no good substitutes for oil. Now there are superior substitutes for oil. This is a radical change in the economics; the "oilmen" have not figured it out which is why they're all losing their shirts. As soon as you start analyzing oil as a substitutable good, it all becomes quite clear.
 
This is what I've been hammering on repeatedly: it used to be that there were no good substitutes for oil. Now there are superior substitutes for oil. This is a radical change in the economics; the "oilmen" have not figured it out which is why they're all losing their shirts. As soon as you start analyzing oil as a substitutable good, it all becomes quite clear.
There's no way that Rex Tillerson and the heads at Aramco don't understand this. They must, otherwise they'd be clinically insane and that's unlikely. So what is the dynamic here? The big boys acquiesced years ago and are now simply squeezing out the last revenue(moderately sabotaging where needed). The biggest hedge fund guys are now invited to the OPEC meetings, so they must understand. Then who is the sucker? Medium sized frackers perhaps?

The big boys have shuttered off-shore expansion and are moving into fracking I assume because of the quick turnaround. Aramco is quite literally trying to sell itself. Hedge funds have been brought in to manage spin. Aren't these move obvious desperation and clear signs that the end is nearer than we think? Big oil isn't even willing to invest 18 months in off-shore development. Instead they're leveraging cash and tech to make money on $20 fracked barrels.

Medium operation American frackers like to tout their ingenuity and flexibility, but won't the big boys simply crush the entire industry with their cash/tech advantage? Some huge sector is going bankrupt soon, there's just too many operators scrambling in a quickly evaporating pond. And what do they care? The executives are all filthy rich and bankruptcy laws are just today looking to get even easier. All the Aubrey McClendon style operations are going busto soon, is that a major economic concern?
 
There's no way that Rex Tillerson and the heads at Aramco don't understand this.
Yeah, Rex spent 10 years losing money for Exxon and then sold all his restricted shares; he's absolutely figured it out by now. And this is why Aramco is trying to sell out (scam of the century!).

I'm not sure the current management of Exxon (after Rex left) understands, though. If you listen to the rosy pronouncements from Exxon and Chevron, I think they're walking straight off the cliff.

I think they understand some but not all of the consequences. Darren Woods, the new CEO of ExxonMobil, is from the refining side. I think they figured out that upstream was in big trouble, but they haven't spotted that it's going to hammer refining too.

The Chevron CEO looks like a fanatic (Chevron is known for having extremist oil-uber-alles CEOs) and they will probably have the hardest crash of the whole bunch.
 
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The biggest hedge fund guys are now invited to the OPEC meetings, so they must understand. Then who is the sucker? Medium sized frackers perhaps?
I'm guessing banks, smaller private equity, and individual investors. All the oil companies seem to be "talking their book", advertising that they can break even at very low oil prices... and if you look into it, they probably can't; they're excluding real costs and using rosy production projections in order to make these claims. So why are they shouting them so loudly? *To get investor money*, I figure. Which they will walk off with in the form of executive pay before the bankruptcy, I would guess.

Some huge sector is going bankrupt soon, there's just too many operators scrambling in a quickly evaporating pond. And what do they care? The executives are all filthy rich and bankruptcy laws are just today looking to get even easier.
Look at how much money the Peabody Coal executives made, even though they wiped out stockholders, bondholders, liabilities to governments, pensions, workers, etc....
All the Aubrey McClendon style operations are going busto soon, is that a major economic concern?
That's an interesting question. Will the wave of bankruptcies have a larger economic effect?

I don't know. That's why I'm heavily invested in an asset which is mostly uncorrelated with the broader markets and will definitely not be affected by a wave of bankruptcies in oil & gas. You know the one, it's the topic of this forum :)
 
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Asia’s Top LNG Players Forming Buyers Club | OilPrice.com

This is also interesting. Korea, Japan and China want to better terms on LNG import contracts. Specifically, they want to be able to re-export surplus. Honestly, suppliers should have already granted this without motivating these three biggest buyers to gang up on them. It is economically much less risky to sign a long-term supply agreement if you have recourse to deal with excess. Furthermore, it will help solidify a global price for LNG in stead of having a bunch of regional markets.

But a few things are telling here. One, these Asian buyers are recognizing that they have market power and are working on ways to extend that. This has consequences for oil and not just gas. As OPEC weakens, we could see Asia step in as the swing buyer with market power.

Two, Asian countries may recognize that renewables and batteries will soon give them ways to avoid using so much LNG. So they want flexible exits. Long-term contracts may not be so attractive.

All three of these countries are major battery makers. Increasingly, batteries compete with LNG and oil. One of the reasons why I pushed out my analysis of a GF as an oilfield was that I wanted to help people think about battery supply as alternative to LNG and oil supplies. As soon as Asia is producing a critical level of batteries, it will pretty much be able to dictate prices on both LNG and oil. That is they will have enough market power on both the demand side (for oil and gas) and supply side (for batteries and renewables) to command fossil prices.
 
U.S. Shale Could Peak Before 2025 | OilPrice.com

Ron Patterson does some modeling of US shale production. In his moderate and high oil price scenarios, where oil goes to $100/b or $120/b respectively by 2027, production peaks in 2021 or 2022. But in his low price scenario, where oil goes to $80/b, production peaks by 2019.

This is very interesting to consider with Tesla in mind. Firstly, I think only the low oil price is reasonable. (Who is going to spend more on a barrel of crude than a kWh of battery?) Second, by 2019 in any scenario, US shale will show signs of strain, even if peak production is still several years away.

So around 2019 the narrative around oil could once again return to geological constraints on production. Imagine how popular the Models 3 and Y could become, if popular sentiment was that peak oil production were just years away. Such a lovely fantasy for a Tesla investor.

If only we could bring back the fear of peak oil supply...
 
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Ron Patterson does some modeling of US shale production. In his moderate and high oil price scenarios, where oil goes to $100/b or $120/b respectively by 2027, production peaks in 2021 or 2022. But in his low price scenario, where oil goes to $80/b, production peaks by 2019.

Interesting modelling and might just be perfect timing! This is indeed very interesting to consider with Tesla in mind Firstly, I think only the low oil price is reasonable. (Who is going to spend more on a barrel of crude than a kWh of battery?) Second, by 2019 in any scenario, US shale will show signs of strain, even if peak production is still several years away.

Interesting indeed and it might just be perfect timing on our way to the perma-glut! From a Tesla perspective, I'm thinking that Adam Jonas has a point. Check this out: Analyst warns of Tesla’s Autopilot machine learning potentially rendering all other cars obsolete - if we take this serious, autonomy, not electrification will kill oil demand. I mean, autonomy of electric cars, will kill oil demand.

One of the biggest issues for Tesla right now is: how do you scale beyond the actual one car sold? There are so many millions of cars being sold every year, you really need to flex your production muscle to make an impact. But since cars are used less than 5% of the time, shared, electric autonomous cars will truly make a huge difference. Adam Jonas got it right warning the car industry and the finance industry. He should have added the oil industry:
If you assume that 1 autonomous electric car replaces 6 regular cars then 500k Model 3 could act like 3 million regular cars. That's half of your annual US car market right there. Now of course that's theoretic... But do this at a 1:3 ratio for 5 years and oil is pretty much toast - right?

EDIT: If the above mentioned will happen - Tesla would need less cars and could sell more TE products as I don't believe they are finding markets where batteries could scale beyond the actual power plant the same way autonomous cars can scale beyond the individual purchase. This means we might see a long-term adjustment to the 70:30 ratio we discussed earlier...
 
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What you are describing is scarcity. There is too much demand for the available supply.....

Its more than scarcity, its psychology

A core reason why electricity is regulated is because "maximum profit is not demonstrated until there is curtailment"
a market approach to electricity would result in locations having multiple power lines, single power lines and nil power lines.
In locations with single or perhaps 2 sets of power lines, maximum profit is not demonstrated until a significant number of users simply can not afford to even use the electricity. That is to bid up the price so only the rich can afford electricity.

Same with unions and car factories, unions price themselves out of the market until their car factories are closed down/employer bankrupt, that can only be demonstrated after the fact. maximum profit is not demonstrated until there is curtailment

Share owners demand poorly timed dividends which weaken the company until the car company is bankrupt. maximum profit is not demonstrated until there is curtailment

If the third world can afford oil, then it is priced too low to demonstrate maximum profit. maximum profit is not demonstrated until there is curtailment
 
Saudi tax cuts adds USD 1 trillion to corporate valuation of Saudi Aramco

Rystad revises Aramco IPO valuation after the Saudis reduce tax rate from 85% to 50%. That changes the valuation from $400B to $1400B. But that's not what interests me.

What I find curious is the assumption of oil at $75/b in 2018 and beyond.

“The total value of Saudi Aramco’s revenue after costs is around $3.4 trillion. With the old tax system, around 88% of the value went to the government through taxes and royalties, while with the new system around 60% of the profit goes the government. Oil price should be reaching 75 USD/bbl by the time of the public offering; this is also close to the long-term oil price needed to justify the share price of other large global oil companies”, comments Erlingsen.

I added the bold. While the futures curve put 2018 oil at $50/b, Rystad wants to use $75/b. So revenue may be inflated by more than 50% on the basis of this assumption. The rationalization is that such an assumption is also implied in the market value of the major global oil companies. Hmm...

So does this suggest that oil majors may likewise have revenue overstated by 50%. This is particularly troubling because overstating revenue does not likewise overstate costs and SG&A. Moreover, some oil reserves that are economic at $75/b may not be so at $50/b. So the overstatement could be much bigger than 50%, and the whole enterprise could be highly unprofitable at lower oil prices.

So what we learn here is that the market values oil majors under the assumption the oil prices will soon reach $75/b and remain high for many years. And all this is in contradiction to the futures markets that price oil at $49 to $55 for the next 9 years.

Moreover, elsewhere it was shown that while small and midsize oil companies are well hedged, the large ones are not. It well could be that if the majors were to hedge more, that this would undermine the optimistic valuations the market is giving them. That is, they would be seen as locking in a lower value if hedging at near $50/b compared to the assumed $75. If this is at all motivating a lack of hedging, then the oil majors are in very deep trouble should oil prices remain low.

So notice that a 35% tax difference for Aramco explains a $1T value difference. Eerily, going from $75 to $50 is about a 35% reduction in revenue. But this is enough to drive the valuation down 70%, from $1.4T to $0.4T. Is this indicative of what is in store for the oil majors if the futures market is calling it correctly?
 
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OK, this is bloody weird, because the entire article is about how peak demand is real and will happen very soon. And how most models are not predicting it correctly.

Who on earth wrote the headline?!?

Yea, the headline is way off - but the actual content was interesting I found. I guess the headline was required to get in on oilprice.com?!?

Ugh, that was so lame, I could not bring myself to comment on it. The author seems unaware that the argument for peak oil demand has to do with structural changes. So looking in the rearview mirror, you can't the the curve coming up in front of you. So intellectually weak.

I don't think it is that bad - it's oilprice.com and if the learning from this article is a) peak demand already happened in many developed markets and b) all predictive models about it were wrong - then I'm already happy.

The details of "when" and "why" non-OECD peak demand will happen I would not expect from that website :)
 
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I don't think it is that bad - it's oilprice.com and if the learning from this article is a) peak demand already happened in many developed markets and b) all predictive models about it were wrong - then I'm already happy.

The details of "when" and "why" non-OECD peak demand will happen I would not expect

Those are good points. Perhaps I was too tired and cranky when I read the article. It's actually very helpful to know that the standard models out there are ill prepared to anticipate a structural change of this sort. If they already failed predicting decline in OECD countries, why should they be trusted for non-OECD countries?

The basic problem is that these models are based on indicators of economic growth and not the expansion of energy efficiency and alternatives. Some economic growth is actually antagonistic to oil demand. For example, much of ecommerce and social mediate creates value for customers through minimizing the need to make trips to physical stores or social gathering. So as companies like Alibaba and Tencent grow in China, they are part of an economy that needs substantially less motor fuel per unit of economic activity. So oil demand growth is not simply a response to general economic growth. If low oil intensity segments of the economy grow faster than high oil intensity segments, the net effect will eventually be that growth in the economy has a negative impact of fuel consumption.

I believe this is what OECD countries have already discovered. Cutting oil consumption is key to growing these economies developed economies. At some point China will flip in the same way. It's already discovered that it can only grow economically by cutting coal consumption. Last year, China's economy grew 6.7% while CO2 emissions grew only 1%. So it is getting close to linking economic growth with declining emissions. Structural change is happening.
 
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I believe this is what OECD countries have already discovered. Cutting oil consumption is key to growing these economies developed economies. At some point China will flip in the same way. It's already discovered that it can only grow economically by cutting coal consumption. Last year, China's economy grew 6.7% while CO2 emissions grew only 1%. So it is getting close to linking economic growth with declining emissions. Structural change is happening.

This is an interesting way to put things. Based on the US President's recent executive orders, it appears that the US is proceeding down the well understood general economic relationship that economic growth is dependent on increased emissions. Oops.

I wonder what it would take for "lowering emissions are required to grow the economy" to become the belief system the US was operating from?
 
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