Should the Gen 3 to be a smaller version of the Model S but otherwise identical?

[stopcrazypp]

Given the Model S design (which is between 5 series and 7 series), I suspect the Gen 3 will be slotted in between the 3 series and 5 series (or equivalently the C-Class and E-Class) in size. It will definitely be in the EPA "mid-sized" class and not the "compact" class like the 3 series.

 

[Kevin Harney]

Given the Model S design (which is between 5 series and 7 series), I suspect the Gen 3 will be slotted in between the 3 series and 5 series (or equivalently the C-Class and E-Class) in size. It will definitely be in the EPA "mid-sized" class and not the "compact" class like the 3 series.

Interesting opinion as Tesla said it would compete with the 3 series and A4 and C class. I want more of a 3 series than a 5 series and since there is more of a skateboard approach and flat battery area even at the 3 series size it should have the interior room of a 5 series. All my wishes granted they will have a convertible version. Maybe a good gimmick is the first and only 4 door convertible. !!:biggrin:

 

[EVNow]

The largest car segment is the "family" car size - Camry/Accord/Altima - which are all larger than the 3 series, but a little smaller than the 5 - just looking at the length we have 189", 178", 193". S is 195" in length. Something like 185" looks good for Model 3.

 

[favo]

	Model ≡	3-Series	Model S
Width	74.5	41.3	77.3

Should that be 71.3" for 3-Series width?

- - - Updated - - -

The 3-Series does seem a bit small, especially the rear seats. I hope the Model 3 has a little more interior room. Note, this doesn't necessarily require a longer vehicle, given the lack of an engine and transmission tunnel which would constrain interior room in an ICE vehicle.

 

[Red Sage]

Thanks, favo! I must have slipped on the keyboard while transposing the numbers. I've fixed it now. ;-)

 

[Red Sage]

Given the Model S design (which is between 5 series and 7 series), I suspect the Gen 3 will be slotted in between the 3 series and 5 series (or equivalently the C-Class and E-Class) in size. It will definitely be in the EPA "mid-sized" class and not the "compact" class like the 3 series.

Unfortunately, the EPA uses some rather... strange, possibly arcane, means to determine the 'class' of a car. They use the height, width, length, wheelbase... But also use interior volume and storage space as determining factors. I have seen some cars classified as 'large' that didn't look all that big to me... I've seen some cars classified as 'compact' that seemed rather cavernous on the inside. Most cars that are classified as 'mid-size' are mis-classified in my opinion.

	Model S	BMW 3-Series	Toyota Camry
Length	196.0	182.5	189.2
Wheelbase	116.5	110.6	109.3
Height	56.5	56.3	57.9
Width	77.3	71.3	71.7
Track (front)	65.4	60.3	62.4
Track (rear)	66.9	60.3	62.0
Passenger Volume	94 cu ft (Hatchback)	96 cu ft (4 door)	103 cu ft (4 door)
Luggage Volume	26 cu ft (Hatchback)	13 cu ft (4 door)	15 cu ft (4 door)
Class	Large	Compact	Midsize

 

[EVNow]

The weird thing about passenger (I assume) and cargo volume is that it is not the entire volume. It is "usable" space and has a funny way of measuring using blocks of predefined size.

Interesting that Camry has almost the same passenger+cargo space as the much bigger S.

 

[favo]

Interesting that Camry has almost the same passenger+cargo space as the much bigger S.

Yeah, and the BMW 3 has essentially the same passenger volume as Model S. I guess that puts a damper on my theory about more space in Model 3. Luggage volume will presumably be greater, though. Perhaps with some body proportion changes, they may be able to increase rear head and leg room on Model 3.

 

[EVNow]

Yeah, and the BMW 3 has essentially the same passenger volume as Model S. I guess that puts a damper on my theory about more space in Model 3. Luggage volume will presumably be greater, though. Perhaps with some body proportion changes, they may be able to increase rear head and leg room on Model 3.

More rear headroom = less aero & more "boxy". Esp, in smaller cars. So, it will be interesting to see how Tesla solves this issue with Model 3.

 

[aronth5]

Yeah, and the BMW 3 has essentially the same passenger volume as Model S. I guess that puts a damper on my theory about more space in Model 3. Luggage volume will presumably be greater, though. Perhaps with some body proportion changes, they may be able to increase rear head and leg room on Model 3.

http://www.leftlanenews.com/new-car-buying/bmw/3-series/specifications/
Just looked at the 2015 BMW specs from this web site and a couple of updates to Red Sage's table
Passenger volume is 86 cu feet not 96 which makes more sense. Also total cargo space for the S is 31.6, BMW's is 17. Both are with the seats not folded down.

 

[EVNow]

http://www.leftlanenews.com/new-car-buying/bmw/3-series/specifications/
Just looked at the 2015 BMW specs from this web site and a couple of updates to Red Sage's table
Passenger volume is 86 cu feet not 96 which makes more sense. Also total cargo space for the S is 31.6, BMW's is 17. Both are with the seats not folded down.

But, are those EPA numbers ?

 

[aronth5]

But, are those EPA numbers ?

No, but are Tesla's posted numbers EPA, if they are then my mistake.

 

[Sunlight]

This is a very interesting and informative discussion.

Interestingly the Clay Model I posted a while back (Mk2 is underway...), has the following dimensions:-
Wheelbase - 113"
Length- 182"
Height - 58" - bit extra for the battery pack
Width - 74"

About....

Very close to the general consensus.

Also the head room in the front and rear would be better than the MS due to the raised roof line and the high rump. the frunk would be similar to the MS and the rear storage shorter but deeper.

Due to the lack of engine bay, rear underside paraphernalia and transmission tunnel, it would feel far larger inside than a BMW Series 3/Audi A4 etc etc. Especially as the cab-forward architecture would allow the front seats to move forward a bit and give acres of rear leg room!

What's there not to like?! Top of the range may poach some MS sales in the future as it would be nearly as useably big and more agile....

 

[EVNow]

No, but are Tesla's posted numbers EPA, if they are then my mistake.

95.1 and 36 are what I've for EPA volumes of S. Slightly different from what RedSage posted (which I'd assumed to be EPA).

update : from EPA website the correct number is 94 & 26.

 

[Red Sage]

FYI... The numbers I posted were probably from the Motor Trend website... Most other places I looked were not very consistent about having all dimensions. BMW has illustrations on their website, but don't seem to list all measurements separately from the drawings, for instance.

 

[EVNow]

Looks like se have higher passenger volume and lower cargo than hatches. BTW, BMW 3 series sports wagon has 97+28. Looks like S is smaller on the inside for its external dimensions.

This is directly from EPA.

Fuel Economy

 

[EricWayneAlbert]

Thanks for the link to the video.

http://www.zdf.de/ZDFmediathek/beit...deo/2015574/Tesla-Chef-Elon-Musk-im-Interview[/QUOTE]