Should you wait for 2023 Tesla Model Y Long Range with 4680 Battery or by Tesla now? [Jan 2023]

[James Cole]

1. No real benefits at this time other than being able to brag you have a car with the new batteries and the structural pack design, which could be seen as good or bad.

2. Negligible. Someone weighed it before vs 2170 LR and it’s like 20lbs lighter.

3. The 4680 cells have lower energy density than the 2170 cells currently so the battery pack just doesn’t store as much energy, hence lower range.

4. Basically yes.

And here I was thinking a 4680 battery car would have a stiffer chassis, weigh 500 lbs less and have better battery technology.

 

[E90alex]

And here I was thinking a 4680 battery car would have a stiffer chassis, weigh 500 lbs less and have better battery technology.

It could be stiffer due to the cast design but there’s no official numbers or measurements of torsional rigidity, and it’s not like the 2170 was a limp noodle to begin with. So while it might be “stiffer” in theory, it’s not in any very noticeable way to the end user.

 

[F_vo]

Anyone that actually owns a Tesla knows being first isn’t an advantage. It’s a big risk. The 2170 3/Y packs are well sorted at this point and have proven very reliable. No way I’d want one of the first 500k or so 4680 packs to come off the line.

I would wait.

 

[dhrivnak]

I have already ordered 2023 Tesla Model Y Long Range but wondering if I should wait for new Tesl Model Y with 4680 Battery. What do you guys think?

The 4680’ are for TESLA’s benefit. There is no measurable benefit to us. They enable cost reductions for Tesla that will hopefully be passed down at some point.

 

[GreenCoffee]

And here I was thinking a 4680 battery car would have a stiffer chassis

It drives like it does

 

[GreenCoffee]

it’s not in any very noticeable way to the end user.

Having driven both back to back I disagree, there is a noticeable difference in interior road noise, the structual pack car feels to me more refined in the handling and NVH is improved

 

[dvlsd]

How do I know what type of battery I have: 2170 v. 4680? My car is build at Austin and in transit.

 

[E90alex]

How do I know what type of battery I have: 2170 v. 4680? My car is build at Austin and in transit.

MYAWD = 4680

MYLR = 2170

 

[dvlsd]

MYAWD = 4680

MYLR = 2170

Thanks but mine is MYLR AWD and build in Texas. Is it 4680 battery? Tesla currently sell two MY models: MYLR AWD and MYP.

 

[E90alex]

Thanks but mine is MYLR AWD and build in Texas. Is it 4680 battery? Tesla currently sell two MY models: MYLR AWD and MYP.

What I said still stands. There are no LR with 4680.

There is an off menu MY AWD (some people call it standard range but that’s not what Tesla calls it).

 

[jcanoe]

How do I know what type of battery I have: 2170 v. 4680? My car is build at Austin and in transit.

Currently, the estimated range when battery is at 100% is 330 miles for the LRMY (2170 cells). The estimated range of the Austin built MY AWD with the 4680 cells when charged to 100% is 269 miles. Currently neither version of the Tesla Model Y is using LFP cells (should be regularly charged to 100%.) The 2170 cells (NMC) should only be charged to 100% if needed, just before driving. For daily use most Tesla Model Y owners follow the Tesla guideline to charge to between 50% and 90%. Using 70% that yields an estimated range for the LRMY for daily driving of 231 miles. For the MY AWD with the 4680 cells that works out to 188 miles; still plenty of range for daily driving for most purposes.

 

[advocate8]

It may or may not be stiffer. Even if someone can feel the difference it’s still probably not significant. There are no real advantages and many disadvantages so far to 4680. The battery simply isn’t as good.
As someone above said, the advantages are to Tesla for manufacturing ease and making batteries in-house. In short, more profit.
If Tesla called right now and offered 20K for me to take a 4680 vs my mid 2022, I wouldn’t take it.
This is the same discussion people were having in 2021 and the same myths appear to be still driving it.
Buy the car now, and enjoy life. It’s short.
And so are tax credits. Even if they’re still in place in say May, you never know what will happen in say October. Thee things aren’t forever.

 

[dvlsd]

What I said still stands. There are no LR with 4680.

There is an off menu MY AWD (some people call it standard range but that’s not what Tesla calls it).

Got it. Thanks for your help.

 

[dvlsd]

Currently, the estimated range when battery is at 100% is 330 miles for the LRMY (2170 cells). The estimated range of the Austin built MY AWD with the 4680 cells when charged to 100% is 269 miles. Currently neither version of the Tesla Model Y is using LFP cells (should be regularly charged to 100%.) The 2170 cells (NMC) should only be charged to 100% if needed, just before driving. For daily use most Tesla Model Y owners follow the Tesla guideline to charge to between 50% and 90%. Using 70% that yields an estimated range for the LRMY for daily driving of 231 miles. For the MY AWD with the 4680 cells that works out to 188 miles; still plenty of range for daily driving for most purposes.

Thanks for the information.

 

[GreenCoffee]

It may or may not be stiffer. Even if someone can feel the difference it’s still probably not significant. There are no real advantages and many disadvantages so far to 4680. The battery simply isn’t as good.
As someone above said, the advantages are to Tesla for manufacturing ease and making batteries in-house. In short, more profit.
If Tesla called right now and offered 20K for me to take a 4680 vs my mid 2022, I wouldn’t take it.
This is the same discussion people were having in 2021 and the same myths appear to be still driving it.
Buy the car now, and enjoy life. It’s short.
And so are tax credits. Even if they’re still in place in say May, you never know what will happen in say October. Thee things aren’t forever.

There are not any direct comparisons I can find other than this one from several months ago,

, at 6:15 there is a comparison of the interior noise, not a very scientific one! but one that shows part of what I experienced, an interior with less noise, I also noticed other traits that leads me to believe the car is a more rigid structure, it was significantly better to me, I understand that you think less range equates to a battery that simply isn't as good but for me I was willing to trade the range for a car that felt better to me, we do not know enough about the new battery as far as longevity goes, who knows? maybe it will age better, maybe worse?

 

[advocate8]

There are not any direct comparisons I can find other than this one from several months ago,

, at 6:15 there is a comparison of the interior noise, not a very scientific one! but one that shows part of what I experienced, an interior with less noise, I also noticed other traits that leads me to believe the car is a more rigid structure, it was significantly better to me, I understand that you think less range equates to a battery that simply isn't as good but for me I was willing to trade the range for a car that felt better to me, we do not know enough about the new battery as far as longevity goes, who knows? maybe it will age better, maybe worse?

If the main thing you want a car that feels slightly more solid, this makes sense. But that’s highly personal and specific to you.
That’s about number 20 on most people’s list of what they’re looking for in a car, esp given the MLYR is plenty stiff as it is.

... slower acceleration, more than 50 miles less range, less proven battery for roughly the same money isn’t an equation that works for me and clearly it doesn’t for most people. At no point in a MYLR normal lifespan is the range going to drop to anything like the 4680. And it’s extremely likely the 4680 will have the same or similar rate of decline. The form factor is different but the chemistry, not so much. We aren’t talking about an iron battery here.
And its not just range, its acceleration, it’s weight -- 4680 so far is looking heavier for same range -- and frankly its reliability. The smaller batteries are well proven. That’s real. Some imagined 4680 POTENTIAL attributes like longer life aren’t.
Im beginning to wonder what it will take for people to simply accept the 4680 isn’t going to be a better performing battery. The battery day spin effect is still running strong.
Anyway, my work on this thread is done. I’m surprised this all came up again.

 

[GreenCoffee]

If the main thing you want a car that feels slightly more solid, this makes sense. But that’s highly personal and specific to you.
That’s about number 20 on most people’s list of what they’re looking for in a car, esp given the MLYR is plenty stiff as it is.

... slower acceleration, more than 50 miles less range, less proven battery for roughly the same money isn’t an equation that works for me and clearly it doesn’t for most people. At no point in a MYLR normal lifespan is the range going to drop to anything like the 4680. And it’s extremely likely the 4680 will have the same or similar rate of decline. The form factor is different but the chemistry, not so much. We aren’t talking about an iron battery here.
And its not just range, its acceleration, it’s weight -- 4680 so far is looking heavier for same range -- and frankly its reliability. The smaller batteries are well proven. That’s real. Some imagined 4680 POTENTIAL attributes like longer life aren’t.
Im beginning to wonder what it will take for people to simply accept the 4680 isn’t going to be a better performing battery. The battery day spin effect is still running strong.
Anyway, my work on this thread is done. I’m surprised this all came up again.

I own a 2018 model 3 red, it has significant road noise, there are threads all over this forum referencing excessive road noise, also plenty of threads on ride quality, it seems that more people than myself are concerned with these things, the 4680 is most definitely not what was promised, I could feel that the car has slower acceleration but if acceleration is what I wanted then I would have ordered a MYP, there is no battery day spin here, I fully realize that this version of the 4680 has less energy per KG as has already been proven, I chose the MYAWD for the overall better car that I think it is for me as I am not concerned with a 15% range hit, that is all it is.

 

[ucmndd]

Having driven both back to back I disagree, there is a noticeable difference in interior road noise, the structual pack car feels to me more refined in the handling and NVH is improved

Was your back to back analysis done with two brand new cars on the same set of brand new wheels and tires?

 

[flai54]

Initially I was thinking it would be beneficial to have the 4680 battery packs for the MYLR but then the thing is that it is the same technology as the current 2170 batteries but just in a different form factor. What I want to see in addition to the 4680 battery factor size is an update to the battery technology that uses LFMP that can help extend the range. With the gen 1 4680 battery packs it seems like the battery efficiency is less than 2170 per kw so to me it tells me that it is not yet ready to be put into long range models and still achieve the realized efficiency that it claims.

 

[GreenCoffee]

Was your back to back analysis done with two brand new cars on the same set of brand new wheels and tires?

No, MYAWD was new and the MYLR was a dealer demo, I did not check the milage but I think the Vin was in the 49 range if I remember correctly, same wheels but did not look at tires.