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Sigh, smash and grab

Discussion in 'Model S' started by hqubic, Jan 11, 2019.

  1. hqubic

    hqubic Member

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    Went out for dinner a relatively well-lit, busy plaza in Cupertino, CA (Blaney & Bollinger), we were there for dinner for about an hour, came out and noticed my car's rear window looked funny, smaller one looked to have some kind of window decal that resembles a broken window, oh wait, it really was broken! The big one was all gone/smashed. Rear seats folded down and the thieve grabbed my work backpack in trunk.

    Police came and filed report, a good samaritan came and said he saw the whole thing went down (dude broke window, jumped in, and a few seconds later jumped out and got into a car and left) and even took a picture, unfortunately the picture was blurry but hopefully it helps the police.

    For anyone who has repaired smashed windows, is it better to get a third-party to repair or get a Tesla SC to repair it?

    BTW just ordered the enhanced anti-theft kit, was out of stock a couple of weeks back when I last checked, oh well.
     
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  2. TripleTrucker

    TripleTrucker Member

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    From previous posts, I assume it was black Mercedes? Sorry that happened to you, seems like it's beginning to be a common thing in your area.
     
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  3. electronblue

    electronblue Active Member

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    I wonder why Tesla chose not to include interior sensor in their cars in the USA? The crooks must know it is not in most Teslas and act accordingly?

    The interior alarm has been in an option and then a standard feature in other markets since early Model S days.
     
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  4. Jan Fiala

    Jan Fiala Member

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    Interior alarm would make zero difference.
     
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  5. electronblue

    electronblue Active Member

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    Zero you say? That is a bold claim.

    This particular epidemic seems to be especially large in the U.S. where interior alarm sensors are not as common as say in Europe where interior sensors have been standard, in Teslas too, for ages. It must at least add slightly to the appeal of Tesla’s in the U.S. as targets to know there is no interior alarm.

    Even Tesla now released the interior alarm as a retrofit and it is sold out so the feature certainly has some appeal it seems.
     
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  6. UnderCharged

    UnderCharged Member

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    Tesla needs to update the back seat latch with a locking one
     
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  7. electronblue

    electronblue Active Member

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    That would be especially useful with the Model 3 that has a ”hard” trunk and again something most premium cars from others markets do have as standard.

    Also one thing that can make a difference: Tesla interior alarm in other markets is connected to the mobile app. Alarm to your mobile can offer a chance to interrupt or shorten the time of someone going through the car. This part I believe is not even retrofittable in the U.S. yet?

    None of this helps with the quickest of smash and grabs, say a purse on the back seat, but pillaging through a packed trunk etc takes more time and an alarm sound combined with remote alarm and locked trunk can make a difference.

    It is all about layering defences to minimize harm... not imagining harm can be prevented entirely.
     
  8. rooter

    rooter Member

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    lol, are you British? That statement has a totally different meaning to Americans than British. (equiv. to "That is a very brave proposal")

    Ah, confirmed... "defences".
     
  9. electronblue

    electronblue Active Member

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    Interesting as linguistics may be, to be clear, my point to @Jan Fiala — who claims to be from Poland by the way — was that the claim ”Interior alarm would make zero difference.” seems to be an exaggeration.

    It is likely an interior alarm would make some difference in the statistical sense.

    Urban Dictionary: bold statement
     
  10. whitex

    whitex Active Member

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    I think @Jan Fiala statement meant it would make zero difference to the final outcome. Think someone falling out of an airplane at 25,000ft without a parachute, one could say "having an umbrella with you makes zero difference" even though it's clear that an umbrella might temporarily slow you down from 120mph to 119mph if deployed just right just before you hit the ground.

    Back to the original subject, with San Francisco officially not prosecuting such offenses and reducing max penalty to a citation (a.k.a. a ticket), a car alarm would make zero difference on the outcome of a smash and grab, which lasts 15-30 seconds.
     
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  11. TEG

    TEG TMC Moderator

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  12. electronblue

    electronblue Active Member

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    #12 electronblue, Jan 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
    I got the exact same impression from @Jan Fiala ’s post that it would make zero difference. I simply disagreed with him that it would make no difference and considered ”zero difference” an exaggerated stance. I am well aware of the legal changes behind the epidemic and agree they are one cause for sure.

    I belive an internal alarm would make some difference and especially the knowledge that all Teslas would be equipped with one overall would have made some difference ie result in some cases not happening at all and some cases being cut shorter than they have been. Especially given that Tesla’s factory alarm is connected to its mobile app in markets where it is a factory feature and this would quickly be known by all.
     
  13. hqubic

    hqubic Member

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    I’m hopeful just the dang window decal from the anti theft kit will deter some would-be thieves, even if they still decide to break the window, hopefully the attention from alarm would prevent them from cleaning me up.

    I’ve always been careful in not leaving anything visible in the car, I’m gonna start putting things in the lower part of the trunk, under the panel, so it’s not in view even with the seats folded down.
     
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  14. energy7

    energy7 Member

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    Sorry to hear this happened, same thing happened to me in SF. Happened to my loaner as well at the Mitsuwa shopping center off Saratoga/280. I'm surprised there was a witness and the best they could do was a blurry picture. About a week ago I stopped by Pruneridge golf course in the afternoon. I noticed an older gentleman who looked out of place so I kept an eye on him. He was walking around looking into cars, I think he saw me watching so he eventually left. People today are too afraid to get involved if you ask me, I'd have no problem getting involved if I see a crime being committed...that's enough of my rant.

    To answer your last question, I had Tesla in Palo Alto repair the big window and replace the interior door panel as well. Then I had Precision Auto Glass come out to my house to fix the little window. Tesla does not repair this little window anymore but they will refer you to a qualified installer, in this case Precision Auto. I prefer to have Tesla repair as much as possible but I will say I am extremely happy with the work Precision did on my little window.
     
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  15. RedMS

    RedMS Member

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    Bound to happen when the thieves know the odds of getting away with it are at 98%. Note to self. Stay out of the Bay Area.....
     
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  16. whitex

    whitex Active Member

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    If the thief knows nobody will pursue them, even when caught on video, then won't care if during the 15 second they are doing the smash and grab there is a car alarm in addition to the sound of the shattered glass. Look through TMC, a number of stories from the bay area, some even with videos of the thieves and police saying they are not allowed to pursue them. If the thieves are ok smashing glass in the middle of a crowded mall parking lot, they won't care about a little sound. As for the app notification, unless you are really within 15 seconds of your car, it's just telling you a little earlier that your car has been broken into because by the time you get there, the thief is gone. Heck, if you catch them in the act, that is even worse for you as you may get hurt trying to stop them - not worth it. As a side note, i live in the suburbs and there are car alarms going off a couple of times every day, nobody looks anymore. One of my neighbors daughters notoriously forgets to disarm the alarm before getting in the car, so it goes off every morning. Another teenager has their pimped car set to super sensitive, so it goes off every time the wind is >20mph and whenever a diesel delivery truck drives by. Nobody even goes to the windows when car alarms go off. I imagine in a big city, even more so.
     
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  17. electronblue

    electronblue Active Member

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    #17 electronblue, Jan 13, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2019
    First of all I completely agree the legislation turning car break-ins into misdemeanors is to blame here. Obviously. I also agree there exists certain nonchalance regarding car alarms going off somewhere unless it is your car (something the mobile app notification does change a bit in the equation because the owner wouild know it is their car).

    That said I believe a layered defence (interior alarm, mobile notifications, locked seatbacks in hard trunks like Model 3 etc) does in fact work by making a break-in less likely and damages from a break-in less overall.

    I think an interior alarm with mobile notifications will make a perp less likely to pick that car they know has the feature, will make some of those that do spend less time on the vehicle and finally make the perp less likely to target multiple such vehicles in close proximity. All of which would lessen the statistical likelihood of being a victim as well as lessening the likely damage (eg amount of stolen property).

    Here’s why:

    I do not think all smash and grabs take 15 seconds. This is not an epidemic of taking a handbag from the backseat which actually might happen in 15 seconds. Some of these people take their time. On TMC we have been reading about multiple cases where the perp has rummaged through bags looking for things, going through multiple layers of trunk content, entered the backseat themselves through a window, stopped their thing temporarily when they see someone coming and return to the car a bit later to continue and so forth. Incident like this may well take several minutes in fact, with only the initial noise of break-in to worry about and then silence.

    The other thing is the psychology of the perp. In many of these stories we have seen the perp stop and walk away if they see someone coming in the middle of the act, only to return to the car a bit later, so there clearly is some concern of being caught. Not all of them are equally brazen. So the point is not what will others think when the alarm goes off but what will the perp think compared to a situation where the alarm does not go off?

    I wager some perps will spend less time on a car with an interior alarm and thus lessen the chances of them finding something of value in there and the mobile notification allows the owner to return to the car and secure (drive it away for example) it with more haste to lessen the chance of returns, instead of the car standing there for hours perhaps with broken windows. It may be the difference of only the small window broken instead of small and large windows, it may be the difference of that laptop or camera not getting stolen. It may mean the difference of rain or further vandalism ruining the interior too.

    Finally there is the psychology of what targets will a perp choose. If they knew every Tesla has an interior alarm and mobile notification like they pretty much do say in Europe would they be so keen to target Teslas with smash and grabs? The relative silence allows them to knock open multiple Teslas in the same lot without attracting much attention. Same with multiple Teslas blaring and the risk of owners running in after mobile notifications to the scene is a very different scenario.

    Why not go after the other cars without interior alarms with mobile notifications...

    Again my point is not that an interior alarm (with mobile notifications) will stop the epidemic. My point is it would make a difference larger than zero especially were it a standard feature in most Teslas and thus this would be known to the perps.

    I find it unfortunate Tesla chose to leave out the interior alarm with mobile notifications feature in the USA when they already have implemented that for other markets as standard years ago. I do think this (cost-savings?) decision by Tesla back then adds to the number of messages on TMC about this today.
     
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  18. Tobyw

    Tobyw Member

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    You need an audible alarm, of course, but a phone-in to your cell and the police with a video of the perp in action and a traffic sensor that tells the direction in which he escaped along with acessessing his credit card microchip would help.
     
  19. Blacktess

    Blacktess Member

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    The thieves are randomly breaking the rear quarter window and folding the seat down just to see if anything is in the trunk.
    The only solution is to have nothing in the trunk and the seats folded down.
    So I told my wife to fold the seat down whenever she parks anywhere. The problem with her car, is the windows are tinted and you can't really see that the seats are folded down. So I purchased these window cling stickers and have her put them on whenever she parks anywhere. She can remove them anytime since it's a window cling. This does not guarantee that the thieves will not break the window. Maybe the thieves will see the sticker and see that the seats are down and they just move onto the next car.
    I also put a remote controlled light in the trunk. At night with tinted windows you can't see that the seats are folded down inside, with the light it illuminates the trunk showing that there is nothing in the truck.

    Crazy, the things we have to do to protect our personal property!

    IMG_0080.jpg
     
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  20. Rice&Curry

    Rice&Curry New Member

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    Well, car burglars are getting smarter. They wait at the parking lot and wait for a car to pull in and then as a matter of habit we take out our back pack or laptop bag and put it in the trunk to keep it secure. the burglar or thief is watching this and now gets the confirmation they are looking for - which is that there is something of potential value in the trunk. So the thief will make an attempt to break in as they are now sure that there is something of value to steal. ( they are simply increasing their probability of finding something of value by this method).
    So what should we do? put your items of value in the trunk when you start your journey not after you reach the destination where the thief is watching you. . This way you can simply walk off the car without opening the car trunk when you reach the destination and therefore reduce the chance of a car break-in. Hope this helps..
     

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