Signature P85+ Retrofit

[Elwood]

@lola: thanks for sharing your insights on dynamic matters. Read a lot you wrote.

At the moment I'm building a Ringtool out of a recently deceased BMW E30. Next are the bushings. Rubber goes out and PU comes back in. 15 Powerflex bushings do the whole car and come at 443,-Euros. Like you said, it could come a whole lot cheaper. And providing you do some yourself or know the right people to help you.. It isn't exactly rocketscience.

@Brainman: People on the phone here don't give you the impression that they are willing to do something like that. I asked for the bushings in my, to be delivered in december, car. (no vin yet) Couldn't be done. I don't tink they do specials. (And the P+ is no option for me. I'm spreading pretty thin with the normal P already..)

 

[Teriyaki88]

I recall Elon's service announcement regarding purchasing a loaner car in the fleet. Would your total upgrade cost be similar to car swap or significantly less? Thanks!

 

[lolachampcar]

Elwood,
I looked at plastic bushings when I did my upper links. Regretfully, the MS rear suspension has some rotational compliance built into the rear upright mounting. Putting solid plastic bushings in the upper link would have removed all upright rotational compliance from just that link. I feared that would put enormous stress on the plastic bushings and the arm itself so I dropped the idea.

 

[Grendal]

Well, that is not entirely true. I have a P85+ Signature. I even have parking sensors and the cold weather package ;-)

If you say the only P85+ Sig in North America then it is probably true. Besides Elon's maybe.

Ha. Typical self-centered American unaware of the rest of the world - that's me. :redface: :wink:

Congratulations to you too.

 

[Raven5000]

I'm happy to report that the Fremont Service Center successfully upgraded my Signature P85 with the Performance Plus suspension and I picked up the car today. I'm totally amazed at the transformation in the handling. All of my previous complaints about "floaty" freeway lane changes, understeer on freeway on-ramps, pitching and bucking on hard acceleration/deceleration, etc. are gone. They are replaced with a car that goes where you point it, is extremely predictable and forgiving and has more grip than you think is possible in a 4600 lb. large sedan. The sacrifice in ride quality is minimal - the only place I notice it is when driving on uneven pavement or over freeway lane divider dots.

I've been petitioning Tesla for at least 4 months to get this upgrade. They have been hampered by very limited availability of the P+ suspension parts. They are starting to do a few "learning" retrofits as the parts begin to be available, and I was fortunate that they picked me for one of the very limited slots. I chose to get a full upgrade (same parts as in a new P+) for two reasons:

1) The early VINs require the subframe bushings to be replaced, so I was already needing much of the labor required to do a full upgrade
2) Tesla does not have any partial retrofit (bushings and wheels/tires only, no swaybar or damper upgrades) cars available for test drives. So I was unsure if I would be happy with the partial retrofit, but I knew after 2 test drives that I would be delighted with the full P+

Tesla has asked me to not disclose the cost of the upgrade because it is not yet an announced product. They do plan to make P+ upgrades generally available as soon as they can. What I can say is that I am very happy, and the cost of the upgrade was definitely less than it would have cost me to sell my Signature P85 and buy a new P85+.

Last point. With my 2006 BMW M5, I used to routinely take my favorite freeway off ramp at 45 mph, with a personal best of 47mph. In my first attempt with the P+, I nailed it at 45 mph with no tire squeal or sliding, so I know there is more speed to be had. I can safely say that the P+ handles as well or better than a BMW M5. :biggrin:

Just out of curiosity did your car get noisier? Could you hear the motor more? And could you hear the road noise more? I have had 2 p85+ loaners and I have to say I was disappointed. The handling was better but it was much noisier? Any help greatly appreciated

 

[GDH]

When I had my test drive of an 85 I mentioned the floatyness of the car and I was told it was the winter tires. Guess I should do another test drive before I pay for the car.

 

[AnOutsider]

Excellent news! If they can do this and parking sensor retrofits, I'll sink the money into my sig instead if trading out.

 

[yobigd20]

Am I right in guessing that the P85+ tires will also probably only last between 5-10k before needing replacement?

FWIW I am at 24k on my 19s and I have 8.5/32" on my fronts and 6/32" on my rears and its actually at the queens service center right now getting tire rotation and its first service. (FYI I did have the tires rotated once at 6500).

My P85 loaner (not a +) has the 21s and I LOVE the look, I just wish the treads lasted longer and it didn't ride as harsh.

 

[simplesolar]

Am I right in guessing that the P85+ tires will also probably only last between 5-10k before needing replacement?

FWIW I am at 24k on my 19s and I have 8.5/32" on my fronts and 6/32" on my rears and its actually at the queens service center right now getting tire rotation and its first service. (FYI I did have the tires rotated once at 6500).

My P85 loaner (not a +) has the 21s and I LOVE the look, I just wish the treads lasted longer and it didn't ride as harsh.

I have 6'000 miles on my 21" P85+ tires and I am assuming they will wear out around 9-10k.

 

[dennis]

Just out of curiosity did your car get noisier? Could you hear the motor more? And could you hear the road noise more? I have had 2 p85+ loaners and I have to say I was disappointed. The handling was better but it was much noisier? Any help greatly appreciated

Actually my car got less noisy, because while it was there for the suspension upgrade Tesla performed a number of service campaigns that are in place for early VINs. One of them reduced the wind noise significantly and another stopped the pano roof from creaking.

Since I have always been driving a P85 with 21" wheels, I am most likely used to more motor and road noise. I've never driven a 60 or S85 for comparison. The bottom line is my P85+ is no noisier, and even if it was it wouldn't bother me because the handling is soooo much better.

 

[yobigd20]

I have 6'000 miles on my 21" P85+ tires and I am assuming they will wear out around 9-10k.

boo...too expensive since I drive 4-5k per month

Also, as I drive this loaner vehicle 200+ miles per day while my car is being serviced (my daily commute), I'm always "on guard" and trying to avoid potholes. It's actually kind of stressful. I'm afraid of a blowout on these tires. Damn they look good but just so impractical. If they had 20" grey turbines that had the tread-wear close to that of the 19s I would totally jump on that... as far as the handling difference between my 19s and these 21s though (the loaner has continentals, not michelins), I'm actually a little disappointed. I'm no pro race driver, but I really can't tell much of a "handling" difference between the two. The 21s slip just as much as my 19s do. I highlight "handling" because there are noticeably other differences (21s are louder and harsher in the sense that you can feel every bump, etc). Anywho I'm getting off topic. After I return the loaner I'll do a write up of my opinion of my P85 w\ 19" goodyears & air suspension VIN 05837 vs the loaner P85 w\ 21" conts standard suspension VIN 13k (there are a few subtle interior differences I've noticed, etc, so I'll write those up too and try to take comparison pics between the two).

 

[brianman]

service campaigns

I think your spell checker needs a service campaign.

 

[dennis]

I think your spell checker needs a service campaign.

Campaign - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
cam·paign
noun \(ˌ)kam-ˈpān\

: a series of activities designed to produce a particular result

What am I missing?

 

[Doug_G]

When I had my test drive of an 85 I mentioned the floatyness of the car and I was told it was the winter tires. Guess I should do another test drive before I pay for the car.

Winter tires definitely DO contribute to the feeling of floatyness.

 

[brianman]

What am I missing?

Mea culpa. Apparently that's actually what you meant. I thought you were meaning something else.

 

[dennis]

I just noticed the shiny card pictured below that Tesla placed in my glove box during the Perf + suspension upgrade. This should dispel any doubt about their plans to make the upgrade generally available at some point in the future.

 

[pimp-boy]

Dennis, just PM'ed you.

I just noticed the shiny card pictured below that Tesla placed in my glove box during the Perf + suspension upgrade. This should dispel any doubt about their

plans to make the upgrade generally available at some point in the future.

 

[dennis]

I just complemented the retrofit with an appropriate personalized plate:

 

[RoverS]

I'm afraid of a blowout on these 21" tires. Damn they look good but just so impractical. .

you are correct, sir. just 4 months into ownership, i hit a pothole and blew out the tire. also bent the rim and damaged the suspension.

my job sucks. but if i had a job where people's lives were at stake (doctor, trial lawyer) where I HAD to be places at certain times, i wouldn't be riding on 21's. hell i probably wouldn't be driving a Tesla.

 

[DIL]

boo...too expensive since I drive 4-5k per month

Also, as I drive this loaner vehicle 200+ miles per day while my car is being serviced (my daily commute), I'm always "on guard" and trying to avoid potholes. It's actually kind of stressful. I'm afraid of a blowout on these tires. Damn they look good but just so impractical. If they had 20" grey turbines that had the tread-wear close to that of the 19s I would totally jump on that... as far as the handling difference between my 19s and these 21s though (the loaner has continentals, not michelins), I'm actually a little disappointed. I'm no pro race driver, but I really can't tell much of a "handling" difference between the two. The 21s slip just as much as my 19s do. I highlight "handling" because there are noticeably other differences (21s are louder and harsher in the sense that you can feel every bump, etc). Anywho I'm getting off topic. After I return the loaner I'll do a write up of my opinion of my P85 w\ 19" goodyears & air suspension VIN 05837 vs the loaner P85 w\ 21" conts standard suspension VIN 13k (there are a few subtle interior differences I've noticed, etc, so I'll write those up too and try to take comparison pics between the two).

VERY interested in your write up @yobigd20, and perceived differences between your car and the loaner. I also have a long commute (100+ miles daily), but yours takes the cake.

For those of us who put that many miles on the car, I guess the 19's are a no brainer. Too bad, because I love the look of the 21's and keep getting seduced by the + package.

As far as suspension, I really prefer the coils. The air suspension just feels too disconnected and artificial for me.

Again, looking forward to your comparison review. Thanks for taking the time to post it.

- - - Updated - - -

I just complemented the retrofit with an appropriate personalized plate:

@dennis: Sweet. Expect some of us to come over and say hi randomly when we see you in a parking lot!