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Since the Falcon Wing Suppliers Suck, Give me Regular Doors and Roof Rack Hook Ups!!

MikeL

some guy
Jan 24, 2013
1,044
138
Hooray! another falconwingdoor thread. I'd expect at least a passing mention of snow on the roof, but there are no "Orange Counties" in snow country, so we'll just have to wait for the next one. Although these many many "give me regular doors, like a regular car" threads have provided so much diversion & entertainment over the years, (ha! I typed in "tears":rolleyes:) had I the power, I would delete this one. The supplier premise is flawed, the desire for a roof rack on this EV is misplaced, there will NEVER be a Model X with "regular" doors. That's simply a different car.

Ooo - what about sliding doors, right?! I can sell the OP a sweet 1996 Plymouth Grand Voyager w big sliders & a roof rack. All the seats are taken out, you can stack full sheets of plywood in the back, and still shut the back door! Different car
 

Mark Z

Active Member
Mar 12, 2013
1,842
1,300
North Orange County
Everyone is impressed with the Falcon Wing Doors. The opening they provide cannot be matched. The ability to step in and stand up was what impressed me back on Feb 9, 2012. That is the same impression I get now. It has to be demonstrated, the public still ducks their head when entering and that is not the most elegant way to enter the rear seats.

What helped with the two electric vehicle user groups was to purchase a $3 door mat at Home Depot and cut it in half. The thinness allowed the FWD to close with the mat in place. It provided protection of the door sill and decorative X plate plus provided extra traction for those who wanted to step on a "running board" to enter. Ruggedized surfaces like a thin door mat can help reduce scratches. While I used the mat temporarily, consider securing with Velcro if you want the mat to remain in place.
696182005973.jpg
 
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gavine

Petrol Head turned EV Enthusiast
Apr 1, 2014
2,562
2,096
Philadelphia, PA
The OP isn't saying the doors-themselves suck....he's saying the supplier sucks. Granted, he wants regular doors, but I don't think he meant to imply that the doors suck.
 

cbin97

Member
Feb 9, 2015
116
29
Orange County
Sorry guys, been swamped. Coming back to this I realize I let my marketing brain get the best of me during a hectic day. My title was a little sensational to say the least and I realize I should of posted this as a poll or a question. What it really comes down to is I love Tesla and my Model S has exceeded all expectations and it has made me want to be "100% Tesla for Life." What this post is really stemming from is I'm realizing that the X is not practical for me. I got kids, a dog, we take a lot of road trips and we use every inch of our Nissan Armada. I need my SUV to be heavy on the Utility. I love the FWD's I love that they are pushing the envelope I love that they will draw a lot of questions and awareness for Tesla, I just wish there was a Utility first version. This has more to do with me grappling with the thought that I am not the right demographic for an X as opposed to it "being wrong." I have my "meet the X" date scheduled I'm going hoping to be convinced. If not I'm going to have to buy a truck or something cheap for the utility needs or go ICE on our next SUV until Tesla has a bigger line up.

Apologize for for the hoopla. Really was curious how many of us would take a non Falcon version for extra utility.

Please forgive the grammar etc... On my Cell, wanted to respond
 

S'toon

Knows where his towel is
Apr 23, 2015
3,699
3,639
AB
Sorry guys, been swamped. Coming back to this I realize I let my marketing brain get the best of me during a hectic day. My title was a little sensational to say the least and I realize I should of posted this as a poll or a question. What it really comes down to is I love Tesla and my Model S has exceeded all expectations and it has made me want to be "100% Tesla for Life." What this post is really stemming from is I'm realizing that the X is not practical for me. I got kids, a dog, we take a lot of road trips and we use every inch of our Nissan Armada. I need my SUV to be heavy on the Utility. I love the FWD's I love that they are pushing the envelope I love that they will draw a lot of questions and awareness for Tesla, I just wish there was a Utility first version. This has more to do with me grappling with the thought that I am not the right demographic for an X as opposed to it "being wrong." I have my "meet the X" date scheduled I'm going hoping to be convinced. If not I'm going to have to buy a truck or something cheap for the utility needs or go ICE on our next SUV until Tesla has a bigger line up.

Apologize for for the hoopla. Really was curious how many of us would take a non Falcon version for extra utility.

Please forgive the grammar etc... On my Cell, wanted to respond
I think you know what you mean. The X has an emphasis on the aesthetics of the "soccer mom" rather than a general use hauler. Would someone prefer a more conventional folding seats conventional doors over the falcon wing moving seats?

If that's the question, then put me in that camp.
 

Marcos

Member
Aug 29, 2015
91
78
Oakland, CA
Apologize for for the hoopla. Really was curious how many of us would take a non Falcon version for extra utility.

I don't understand how you think the FWD reduce utility. By all indications, they increase utility by making it easier to access the interior. Now the lack of folding second-row seats? THAT reduces utility. But how can you say that about the doors?
 

CarlK

Active Member
Mar 23, 2013
1,919
1,235
SF Bay Area
Not sure what the point is. It's a done deal. As for me knowing that there is this falcon wing door I would never want to go back the regular one.
 

pvogel

Member
Jun 23, 2015
917
199
Santa Clara, CA
I don't understand how you think the FWD reduce utility. By all indications, they increase utility by making it easier to access the interior. Now the lack of folding second-row seats? THAT reduces utility. But how can you say that about the doors?

I think his point is that the falcon doors impose design constraints like the seatbelts can only anchor in the seat (where a traditional SUV/Minivan would anchor in the roof or side of the car) that, in turn, makes creating a folding seat much more problematic to maintain a 5-star rating.
 

CarlK

Active Member
Mar 23, 2013
1,919
1,235
SF Bay Area
I don't know what is your point. It's a done deal not to mention most people seem to like it. As for me knowing there is this falcon wing door I would never want to go back to the regular one. As I and many others have long been noticed this is designed as a people hualer, not a stuff hauler, and it's the greatest luxury people hualer by far that has ever existed.

Edit: Sorry I thought the first post did not go out.
 
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MiddKid

Member
Jan 3, 2014
305
257
Seattle
Sorry guys, been swamped. Coming back to this I realize I let my marketing brain get the best of me during a hectic day. My title was a little sensational to say the least and I realize I should of posted this as a poll or a question. What it really comes down to is I love Tesla and my Model S has exceeded all expectations and it has made me want to be "100% Tesla for Life." What this post is really stemming from is I'm realizing that the X is not practical for me. I got kids, a dog, we take a lot of road trips and we use every inch of our Nissan Armada. I need my SUV to be heavy on the Utility. I love the FWD's I love that they are pushing the envelope I love that they will draw a lot of questions and awareness for Tesla, I just wish there was a Utility first version. This has more to do with me grappling with the thought that I am not the right demographic for an X as opposed to it "being wrong." I have my "meet the X" date scheduled I'm going hoping to be convinced. If not I'm going to have to buy a truck or something cheap for the utility needs or go ICE on our next SUV until Tesla has a bigger line up.

Apologize for for the hoopla. Really was curious how many of us would take a non Falcon version for extra utility.

Please forgive the grammar etc... On my Cell, wanted to respond

This is why I'm replacing my Model S with an X (instead of keeping the S and doing both). 3 kids, dog, tons of gear. The Model X simply can't replace the family hauler (Toyota Sequoia). So the X becomes the family hauler 85% of the time but we need a full-size SUV for skiing, camping, biking, etc... I've lamented the the FWD a bit...I think that if I could simply get the Thule cargo box on the roof of the X it actually could replace the Sequoia...but alas, that's not going to happen.
 

hill

Active Member
Apr 21, 2015
1,308
649
Lake Forest, CA
The hitch is where our 5 bikes go...can't do both!
Is it me? Or is there a lot of hand-wringing going on
hitch-cargo-carrier-bike-rack.jpg

Same for the OP - whose thoughts were similarly constrained. The roof is not your only friend. Nevermind the fact that the rear of the car for luggage doesn't affect a cars CD nearly as much as the roof of the car. Yeah, I get it - the OP backpedaled to state things less inflammatory. But the issue of great complaint seemed to be storing junk on top. Any hand wringing necessary really needs to be about some other thing. Oh - btw the picture depicting storage for multiple things is not constrained to three bikes. A friend of mine is a metal fabricator and he said five or six bikes will be no more or less problematic than the advertised image. There's a bit of irony that folks that would consider the MX which is definitely a vehicle that appeals to out-of-the-box thinkers - that said folks would then be so easily stumbled over rooftop luggage.
.
 
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AudubonB

One can NOT induce accuracy with precision!
Mar 24, 2013
8,009
26,204
This is why I'm replacing my Model S with an X (instead of keeping the S and doing both). 3 kids, dog, tons of gear. The Model X simply can't replace the family hauler (Toyota Sequoia). So the X becomes the family hauler 85% of the time but we need a full-size SUV for skiing, camping, biking, etc... I've lamented the the FWD a bit...I think that if I could simply get the Thule cargo box on the roof of the X it actually could replace the Sequoia...but alas, that's not going to happen.
Sure you can, easily and safely, with these:
1002-1-4-80x80.jpg
Seasucker Vacuum Mounts (not suction cups). Each is good for 210 lbs and, according to Mr Musk, 130mph. You put them and the cargo box on one side of the X - and for the duration that it's there, that side's FWD does not open - for us, that's an acceptable compromise. He very briefly mentioned them in the 30 September Model X reveal. SeaSucker | Vacuum Mounting Systems
 

aesculus

Still Trying to Figure This All Out
May 31, 2015
4,321
2,466
Northern California
I think his point is that the falcon doors impose design constraints like the seatbelts can only anchor in the seat (where a traditional SUV/Minivan would anchor in the roof or side of the car) that, in turn, makes creating a folding seat much more problematic to maintain a 5-star rating.
Problematic, maybe. But not impossible. And certainly not as difficult a design problem as the FWDs (as we have already seen).

Any decent engineer could do both. I am of the opinion that there were other reasons they went with the fixed seats over folding than safety issues.:cursing:
 

MiddKid

Member
Jan 3, 2014
305
257
Seattle
Is it me? Or is there a lot of hand-wringing going on
hitch-cargo-carrier-bike-rack.jpg

Same for the OP - whose thoughts were similarly constrained. The roof is not your only friend. Nevermind the fact that the rear of the car for luggage doesn't affect a cars CD nearly as much as the roof of the car. Yeah, I get it - the OP backpedaled to state things less inflammatory. But the issue of great complaint seemed to be storing junk on top. Any hand wringing necessary really needs to be about some other thing. Oh - btw the picture depicting storage for multiple things is not constrained to three bikes. A friend of mine is a metal fabricator and he said five or six bikes will be no more or less problematic than the advertised image. There's a bit of irony that folks that would consider the MX which is definitely a vehicle that appeals to out-of-the-box thinkers - that said folks would then be so easily stumbled over rooftop luggage.
.

Seems you took some healthy conversation about challenges using the MX as a full-size SUV replacement a little far. Hand-wringing? Out-of-the-box thinkers? Constrained thoughts? Storing junk? Come on...don't be ridiculous.

The challenges I (and many others) see are not a result of me having "constrained thoughts"...they are facts of life. There is a reason Thule and Yakima are industry giants and I'm not interested in compromising just in order to force the MX to do something it is not designed to do. Let's take some use examples.

That hitch rack with the storage and bike rack. Let's say it actually can carry all 5 bikes I need:
- unlike a normal hitch bike rack it doesn't fold down/away when not in use to access the rear of the car
- if that thing is fully loaded, I'll need to unload it and remove it to use a supercharger. We don't have any pull through superchargers here.

Next week my family is driving to Whistler. Cargo area some stuff and the rest in the rooftop box with the skis. Have you taken a family of 5 on a weeklong ski trip? The amount of gear (let alone coolers, food, etc) is staggering.
- so now I have to use this hitch rack but still need a ski rack. Thule sells a ski rack that attaches to bike racks but in the years I've skied I've seen ONE. Why? Because first of all it's a Franken-rack. Secondly it's a pain in the butt to load a ski rack vertically. Lastly, and most importantly, skis get FILTHY behind your SUV rather than on the roof. Not good for the bases.
- not to again mention the challenges of having all this junk on my hitch and it not folding away...and again the supercharger challenge.

I'll skip the example I have my bikes on the hitch and my standup paddle boards on the roof. I'll assume that challenge is pretty obvious. ;-)

While not the OP I understand the challenge. I own a MS. I have a deposit to replace it with a MX. I'd LOVE to keep my MS and add the MX, but without a roof solution it doesn't work. I have to replace my MS and still rely on a an ICE SUV to do the hauling. I'm not bitter. It is what it is. If the MX didn't have FWD, I'd be much more inclined to figure out how to ditch the ICE, but for now it isn't to be. Oh well. But I agree with the OP...given an option of standard doors I'd choose it in a heartbeat!

Those vacuum seal mounts are interesting but again...not interested all the compromises involved. Not to mention that moment when my five year old forgets that Dad said not to open that one FWD and it opens and hits the rack. I assume the FWDs don't have sensors on that very middle/top part of the door?

So let's stop saying things like "constrained thinking" and get back to real discussions around this amazing vehicle.
 

AudubonB

One can NOT induce accuracy with precision!
Mar 24, 2013
8,009
26,204
My understanding is that the door would not open, as the sensors determine there's something up there.
 

pvogel

Member
Jun 23, 2015
917
199
Santa Clara, CA
Pretty sure the sensors wouldn't allow the FWD to open, they would detect an object overhead and refuse. An override of the obstruction alert would be required to cause a problem. So you'd have to tell the kids not to hold the button if the door beeps at them.
 

MiddKid

Member
Jan 3, 2014
305
257
Seattle
Pretty sure the sensors wouldn't allow the FWD to open, they would detect an object overhead and refuse. An override of the obstruction alert would be required to cause a problem. So you'd have to tell the kids not to hold the button if the door beeps at them.

That would be good news. I assumed there were only sensors on the sides of the door measuring the arc. I didn't think there were any on the top of the car. Because if I used those suction mounts and had a set of skis on the roof, the sensors would need to be right on top so that it doesn't lift up the roof piece. Would be even cooler if the roof piece didn't move but the door still swung out allowing access. Anyone know how that would work?
 

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