Slow supercharge speeds

[Cowpring]

Maybe this is a stupid question, but can the SR+ make use of full 150kw supercharge speeds?

I know there are factors involved in supercharging meaning you often won't get the top speeds, but I'm yet to get more than about 50kw after trying 3 different superchargers and a 150kw Polar.

Below is what I have tried:

Supercharger at West Drayton
Put it on the supercharger at West Drayton during pickup. There were a few other M3s in other bays which I guess cut the speeds down. I got up to 53kw for this charge.

Supercharger near Excel
I used a dual-bay supercharger near excel. Got about 25kw. The other adjacent bay was in use, and I know that bay 1B has been reported as faulty in the past.

Supercharger near Tower Bridge
Again another two bay. The other bay was plugged into a Model X but wasn't charging (no green light). I got about 43kw max.

Polar 150kw rapid
I tried the new Polar 150kw chargers by Hammersmith Flyover. There are 4 chargers there. When I plugged in, the other 3 bays were in use by eTaxis. I got 44kw max. Anyone know if those Polar 150kw ones have the same issue as the Tesla ones where your speed is cut if other people are using other bays at the same site?

Do these speeds seem normal in the above circumstances?

If I tried a semi-empty motorway supercharger bay do we think i'd get the full 150kw?

 

[Adopado]

Maybe this is a stupid question, but can the SR+ make use of full 150kw supercharge speeds?

No, it is currently rated for up to 100kW. The speeds will vary but without knowing the state of charge when you plugged in and whether you specifically set the car to navigate to the charger it's hard to know if you have a problem. Setting the car to navigate to the charger means that it prepares itself, raising battery temperature, ready to charge at optimum speeds. Your state of charge also affects the rate ... if you already have 70 percent plus then you are not going to see full speed. Having said all that your speeds do look low so worth keeping an eye on it. I am not a regular supercharger user but others on this forum have very detailed information to hand. (100kW is definitely possible as I have seen it when charging from 10 percent.) I understand that a software update is supposed to be increasing the max to 170kW for the SR+.

 

[Reddom]

Currently the SR+ is limited to 100kwh but a software update is rolling out to increase that to 170kwh. That is the maximum you would see, but much more important are:
1) your SoC high speeds only happen when the battery is low, by the time you get to 50% the charge speed will be tapering down.
2)The temperature of the battery, If you have been driving on the motorway for 2 hours the battery will be warm and charge much more quickly than if you rock up to a SC after the car has been sat outside in the cold. I think you can use the NAvigate to Supercharger to tell the car its going to charge soon and it will try to warm the battery before you get there.

 

[Cowpring]

Thanks for your replies.

The Supercharger that I tried near Tower Bridge was my main concern. I was at less than 40%, did navigate to it (and therefore the car did precondition the battery, this alert came up on the screen), and it didn't look like the other car in the ajascent bay was drawing any power, but yet I only got 40kw ish from that supercharger.

Good to know about the 100kw max for the Model 3, didn't know this at all. Hope the 170kw software update comes soon.

 

[Adopado]

Thanks for your replies.

The Supercharger that I tried near Tower Bridge was my main concern. I was at less than 40%, did navigate to it (and therefore the car did precondition the battery, this alert came up on the screen), and it didn't look like the other car in the ajascent bay was drawing any power, but yet I only got 40kw ish from that supercharger.

I presume you are aware of the power splitting issues of the 1A 2A 1B 2B scenario? You don't want anyone next to you if possible.

 

[Cowpring]

Yeah I was aware of that. The Model X next to me didn't seem to be charging though, there was no charge light on. Although it was plugged in. Perhaps it was charging and that's the reason for the slow chage.

One thing that kind of annoys me about charging is that you pay more money for a faster charge speed, but if the speed isn't faster, you still have to pay the same increased amount.

Why should I pay 25p per kWh for 150kw charger if I only get 40kw of draw.

 

[WannabeOwner]

The Model X next to me didn't seem to be charging though, there was no charge light on

I don't know if Supercharger is the same, but IIRC charging at home at night the Charging Light doesn't stay on (presumably so as not to draw attention to it). So if that is correct ... and applies to Supercharger ... then maybe Model-X had been charging for "some time" and the light went off.

Acid test would be a Supercharger where you are not paired, and your charge is somewhere down around the 10% mark, and preferably you have been driving far enough, and with SatNav set to that Supercharger destination so that it warms the battery.

Even if some of these things are not "ideal", if you charge from low enough by the time the charging gets from e.g. 10% to 20% the battery should be warm, and thus charging at "full pelt"

 

[Cowpring]

I don't know if Supercharger is the same, but IIRC charging at home at night the Charging Light doesn't stay on (presumably so as not to draw attention to it). So if that is correct ... and applies to Supercharger ... then maybe Model-X had been charging for "some time" and the light went off.

Acid test would be a Supercharger where you are not paired, and your charge is somewhere down around the 10% mark, and preferably you have been driving far enough, and with SatNav set to that Supercharger destination so that it warms the battery.

Even if some of these things are not "ideal", if you charge from low enough by the time the charging gets from e.g. 10% to 20% the battery should be warm, and thus charging at "full pelt"

Hmmm yeah perhaps the Model X was charging. Would defo explain the speed.

I think I might do a test as you said - get the perfect conditions and see if I can get the correct speeds.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I think I might do a test as you said - get the perfect conditions and see if I can get the correct speeds.

If you get the opportunity that would be worthwhile - its possible there is a fault on your car, and i so getting it fixed before you need it in earnest would be good

If you can get the car down to 10%, and if you have the time to let it charge to 90%, I would note the %age each 5 minutes so you then have a ready-reckoner for how long a charge from X% to Y% would take

 

[Adopado]

Why should I pay 25p per kWh for 150kw charger if I only get 40kw of draw.

kWh is a quantity. You pay exactly the same per kWh. If you get a slow pump putting petrol in your car the price doesn't change! You just pay for the quantity delivered.

 

[NorfolkMustard]

kWh is a quantity. You pay exactly the same per kWh. If you get a slow pump putting petrol in your car the price doesn't change! You just pay for the quantity delivered.

not with Polar. The higher kW the charger is capable of, the higher the price is per kWh

Polar network pricing and access changes from 5 August 2019

So, if you have >50% SoC, don't bother with a 150kW charger, use a 50kW variant instead and save a few pence

 

[Cowpring]

kWh is a quantity. You pay exactly the same per kWh. If you get a slow pump putting petrol in your car the price doesn't change! You just pay for the quantity delivered.

Yeah I know you get charged per kw. But pricing structures vary across charge points, and companies like Polar etc charge more for faster charge speeds like NorfolkMustard said.

Generally 50kw and higher costs more than slow 3kw or 7kw.

The petrol comparison is't quite comparable - the speed difference in petrol pumps would likely only be seconds, to maybe a minite or two difference. Currently for EV if you were charging at 20kw, but expecting 150kw the time difference would be huge. If I need those faster charge speeds and am willing to pay a premium for it, they I should get those speeds...or be charged less.

You get compensation when you pay extra for a fast rail ticket and the train company doesn't get you there on time. Same should be the case for EV charge speeds.

So, if you have >50% SoC, don't bother with a 150kW charger, use a 50kW variant instead and save a few pence

Good to know thanks. To be honest all of my charging is done on Polar 50kw chargers, they are the most conveinent for me. Would like to still use a supercharger on the rare occasions I go on the motorway so will test it next time I go.

 

[Adopado]

Yeah I know you get charged per kw. But pricing structures vary across charge points, and companies like Polar etc charge more for faster charge speeds like NorfolkMustard said.

Yep, I get the point. I wasn't clear from your initial post. My nearest 50kW charger is free so I don't think in those terms too much!

 

[Jason71]

I don't know if Supercharger is the same, but IIRC charging at home at night the Charging Light doesn't stay on (presumably so as not to draw attention to it). So if that is correct ... and applies to Supercharger ... then maybe Model-X had been charging for "some time" and the light went off.

Acid test would be a Supercharger where you are not paired, and your charge is somewhere down around the 10% mark, and preferably you have been driving far enough, and with SatNav set to that Supercharger destination so that it warms the battery.

Even if some of these things are not "ideal", if you charge from low enough by the time the charging gets from e.g. 10% to 20% the battery should be warm, and thus charging at "full pelt"

Model 3 manual says: "Note: If Model 3 is locked, the charge port light does not light up."
It does not make any distinction for supercharging. Assume the X is probably the same so charge port light is not a reliable way to tell anything if it is off.
Also if the light is activated then solid green rather than off indicates that charging is complete as far as I can tell the only time the light is ever off when plugged into a charger is as above when locked so off does not appear to tell you anything.
So like you figured now. X was probably charging hense your low speed

 

[WannabeOwner]

companies like Polar etc charge more for faster charge speeds

Unless it has changed recently the iPace hand-shake says "I can take fast charge" ... and then only takes 50kW ... so you pay the premium high-kW price, but then stay longer and charge at slower kW rate

 

[PilotD99]

Do the LR or P charge at a higher rate?

 

[Adopado]

Do the LR or P charge at a higher rate?

up to 250kW

 

[Cowpring]

Kinda annoying this slower charge speed. Tela arn't really upfront about this, there's no mention on the website, and when I place the order through the lease it wasn't on the spec sheet at all.

Not a deal-breaker for me as I don't supercharge at all really, but I feel like it should at least be mentioned on the Tesla website.

Isn't there a 'theoretical' limit for all Model 3s of 350kw (i.e. the hardware in them exists to get up to that much, but the software limits it)?

 

[WannabeOwner]

Do the LR or P charge at a higher rate?

Depends ...

SR+ used to charge a lot slower than LR ... but latest update is increasing SR+ charging sped significantly, not sure there will be any practical difference at that point (i.e. on currently available Superchargers / 3rd party chargers)

On model-S the 75 charged at lower voltage than the 100, so the 100 charged faster.

It might be that the bigger battery always charges faster? i.e. because there are more-cells-in-parallel, but I don't know if that is actually the case.

of course LR goes further before having to charge, and then needs less charge to get to destination (on like-for-like journey comparing SR+ and LR) ... and if the SR+ needs to charge above 80% into Taper, in order to complete the journey / next leg that takes a LOT longer ... so the fact that 10%-80% is more no the LR than the SR+ provides more flexibility.

The added range on LR may also make it possible to reach a more distant Supercharger en route, where a SR has to detour ... costing time and more distance / charge required.

So in general the LR will reduce long journey time.

Kinda annoying this slower charge speed

SR vs LR? Latest update is doing away with the slower rate on SR I think ?

 

[Cowpring]

Is charge speed increase on an upcoming update? Or the update just gone?