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So disapointed in Transport Minister

Discussion in 'Canada' started by agloutney, Sep 19, 2016.

  1. agloutney

    agloutney Member

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    Transport Minister Marc Garneau tweeted today that he was giving his colleagues a ride to parliament in a Toyota Mirai. For those unfamiliar with the Mirai, it's a hydrogen fuel cell car. Obviously someone has been lobbying the liberals and trying to sway them away from EVs. Maybe Tesla should set him up with a P100D for the weekend and see which one he thinks has a better future. A Supercharger in Ottawa wouldn't hurt either.
     
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  2. S'toon

    S'toon Knows where his towel is

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    Even politicians need education on green issues. Frustrating though.
     
  3. toto_48313

    toto_48313 CAN P #5

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    Toyota is making a huge effort to push hydrogen in Canada, but in Quebec they have no support at all as Hydro electric power makes EV much better at all level (efficiency and GHG emission).

    Regarding the supercharger at Ottawa, as I know Tesla team is working on it.
     
  4. RiverBrick

    RiverBrick Active Member

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    Sadly, the hydrogen lobby has had some success in Quebec, partly because there is a fuel cell research chair at the University of Quebec at Trois Rivieres.
     
  5. agloutney

    agloutney Member

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    I just hope they don't start handing out subsidies to build a network of hydrogen filling stations. They have done nothing for EVs as of yet so it would be a real slap in the face to the EV movement. He knows how much energy it takes to make hydrogen. The external center fuel tank on the Space Shuttle was liquid hydrogen, so of all people, I'd expect him to know it's a dead end technology as far as propelling a car goes. Pretty sure he also knows how explosive it is (Challenger disaster). It's political. I will be writing to my deputy Peter Shiefke (who drives an EV) to hopefully knock a little sense into our Transport Minister.
     
  6. S'toon

    S'toon Knows where his towel is

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  7. Lon12

    Lon12 Member

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    Wonder who said this: "And then they’ll say certain technologies like fuel cell … oh god … fuel cell is so bullsh*t. Except in a rocket.”
     
  8. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    It might also have something to do with the fact that Toyota has been building cars in Canada for many years. Tesla... nope.
     
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  9. RiverBrick

    RiverBrick Active Member

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  10. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    Sorry to hear a politician disappointed you. They are usually so dependable
     
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  11. blackscraper

    blackscraper Member

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    don't worry. once they know it costs millions of dollars to build a refilling station and Toyota is counting on the government to shed the money, they will back out:)
     
  12. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    The government is forever begging the automakers for more production in Canada. When the opportunity comes up to talk about EVs, they really have no choice but to talk-up the companies that have invested in their jurisdiction. So they will push Toyota, Honda, Ford, GM, Chrysler.

    Rule #1 - Never bite the hand that feeds.

    If Tesla / Solarcity had located that solar cell plant in Windsor instead of Buffalo, I think you'd see the politicians being more than happy to put on a Tesla hat.
     
  13. RiverBrick

    RiverBrick Active Member

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    Unfortunately, the other CA, California, isn't the slightest bit fazed by having to fund a hydrogen network.


    You have understand why Canadians are hoping for better from Transportation Minister Marc Garneau. The last last four US Secretaries of Transportation have degrees in History, Sociology, Law, and Business Administration. However, Minister Garneau has a B.S. in Engineering physics and a Doctorate in Electrical Engineering, as well as experience as an engineer and astronaut. Therefore, you'd hope he'd be better positioned to understand the huge downsides to hydrogen.
     
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  14. green1

    green1 Active Member

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    Downsides for the environment, the budget, and the citizens, but nothing but upsides for his campaign finances.... Or were you expecting him to care about the first 3 items on the list?
     
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  15. Chopr147

    Chopr147 Active Member

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    I had a look up close and personal with the Toyota Mirai. It was interesting. Some of you know these things but I will state them anyway:

    1) Not a bad looking car and almost as big as the Model S. Plenty of rear leg room and nicer than most econo-boxes.
    2) Under the hood is a full engine that burns fuel cells and no emissions. It has a water tank for the vapor burnoff which is emptied with a valve by the owner.
    3) According to the rep. 350 mile range
    4) He said Toyota is/will put in hydrogen fill stations all along the East coast ( Have not seen any yet)
    5)Counts towards Fed tax credit
    6) Turn wheel for the gear shift (hate that)
    7) $58,000 before credits
    Toyota is "all in " on the hydrogen train and spending hundreds of millions for a concept Elon calls "just dumb". I tend to agree but I assume Toyota believes this will be the future. Sort of like the Sony Blueray/ HD DVD format wars :)
    I think Toyota is destined to be the HD DVD cousin :eek: and may bring Canada down with them?
     
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  16. green1

    green1 Active Member

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    I love that they still claim 350 miles range despite the fact that no fueling station can actually put enough pressure in the tank to achieve anywhere near that...

    They claim they're building fueling stations, but the truth is they're trying to get the government to do it fort then because they're so expensive. I also hope there is never an H2 station or car within many miles of anywhere I am, just wait until the first one explodes, a car will take out several houses. A station will take out a couple city blocks.
     
  17. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Seems to be a common misconception that Challenger exploded. It did not. It broke apart due to aerodynamic pressure when the stack failed. The fuel and oxidizer did burn quite dramatically, but it did not "explode". The SRBs exploded when ground controllers executed the self destruct command before they careened into danger.
     
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  18. decibel

    decibel Member

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  19. scottm

    scottm Active Member

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    #19 scottm, Sep 26, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2016
    Marc Garneau.. astronaut... love in for H2. Go figure.

    Ya, I'll just fill 'er up with H2 in my garage overnight !?

    How convenient is that?

    Iceland and Shell put up a H2 filling station on the island in 2003.. I saw it in 2009-ish, fueling all the H2 cars there.. I think 14 cars at the time. Great investment for the government and Shell. Free abundant geothermal generation of H2.

    I guess Quebec and B.C. can use all their hyrdo electric power to make H2 to burn in cars in Canada. Or, we could just use the electricity directly. Just a tad more efficient.

    But it's been a very popular choice with the Icelandic natives... really catching on. I think there's now maybe 3 more cars there that use H2. Still no line ups at the H2 pumps, life is awesome!
     
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