Posts on several threads on TMC seem to argue that AP is dangerous and should be outlawed because people can do stupid things against the advice of Tesla. I don't see that that is any different than making a car stable enough that people can generally text and drive and get away with it till... well, till they can't. If these people were consistent in their logic they would be pushing for cars to have built in instabilities so that you had to keep both hands on the steering wheel just to stay in the lane. That would prevent texting while driving along with holding a cell phone.
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Posts on several threads on TMC seem to argue that AP is dangerous and should be outlawed because people can do stupid things against the advice of Tesla. I don't see that that is any different than making a car stable enough that people can generally text and drive and get away with it till... well, till they can't. If these people were consistent in their logic they would be pushing for cars to have built in instabilities so that you had to keep both hands on the steering wheel just to stay in the lane. That would prevent texting while driving along with holding a cell phone.
I don't think it needs to be on a closed course per se. But I think it would be great if (a) professional training was required, (b) the driver's license exam actually tested skills, and (c) the practical driving exam had to be retaken every 5 years. But it would be a good start if drivers who have *already been ticketed repeatedly* for unsafe driving of one sort or another *actually lost their licenses*. Right now they typically don't lose their licenses; at worst the license is "suspended". This is not OK.
I also have taken multiple defensive driving courses, and I did about 2 years of driver training before getting my license. I have successfully pulled out of skids on ice and avoided a fallen tree on the Interstate and so on and so on. I don't speed and I don't tailgate. Most drivers on US roads are *terrible* drivers and need to learn a lot more and have a lot more practice before they should be allowed on public roads.
It sort of has to be off-road. Locking up the brakes while swerving will probably get you a DUI on the street.
As a group, no. But if you as a pilot eliminate certain types of flying then it does become quite safe (ie don't fly a piston plane at night over the mountains, don't buzz houses, don't fly single pilot, single engine in the clouds etc. etc.). Also some airplanes are far safer than others. The safest GA plane has no parachute but it is almost impossible to stall and spin - the Diamond DA40.
Things I do that are more dangerous than AP.
1 - Electric longboards that can go 25mph up hill.
2 - Mountain biking
3 - Pedal Assist ebike for commuting. I'm going to modify it to assist up to 28mph.
4 - All the chocolate I eat
What other people are doing that's more dangerous than AP
Playing Pokemon Go while driving.
1 - Electric longboards that can go 25mph up hill.
2 - Mountain biking
3 - Pedal Assist ebike for commuting. I'm going to modify it to assist up to 28mph.
4 - All the chocolate I eat
What other people are doing that's more dangerous than AP
Playing Pokemon Go while driving.
The best way to view airplanes is to think of motorcycles. They have a lot in common. Small planes have fewer accidents per mile than automobiles. The problem is that a much higher percentage are fatal. If a car runs off the road at 35 and hits a tree the driver likely lives. Not so in a motorcycle. Similarly, in a plane, if you hit something at 200 mph, airbags and seat belts don't help.
I agree with much of what you have to say about the deficiencies of many car drivers. It is a great argument in favor of autopilot features, which make the roads safer and are only going to get better.
Two additional points. First, regardless of who is at fault, the fact remains that for each mile driven motorcyclists are 25 times more likely to be killed than those in a car.
Second, although many motorcyclists ride safely it turns out that many are not as careful as you might think -- in 29% of US motorcycle fatalities the motorcyclist was legally intoxicated, in 34% the motorcyclist was speeding and in 25% the motorcyclist was not even licensed. All of these figures are significantly higher than for fatal automobile accidents. Motorcycle Crashes
It seems likely that motorcycles, like cars, could become safer by adopting more automated driver assist features.
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A drunken, unlicensed, speeding motorcyclist is still less of a threat to your life than a sober. licensed, legal velocity sedan driver.
Yes, the Second Childhood wave of MC weekend warriors is killing themselves off a record clip. Today, a 50 year old MC rider is far more likely to punch their own ticket than an 18 year old. Wow.
But the fact remains, the number #1 safety threat on American roads today is inexperienced drivers. Not airbags, TACC, steel radials, ABS, etc, etc. Our driving skills are falling almost as fast as technology is trying to save us.
Case in point, a guy running into a truck with digital safety equipment engaged. Published info indicates that was absolutely a bad driver that caused their own death, not the safety equipment.
If you're intent on this line of reasoning we should make special categories:
-ultralights;
-piston helicopters;
-Cessna 411;
-homebuilt anything;
-40 hour private pilots carrying passengers; VFR only pilots of anything;
- motorcycles ( special award to the 'no helmet required' laws (known as "organ transplant donor encouragement" law).
As a one-time libertarian I have come to realize there is such a thing as the 'public good' that may trump a few personal 'freedoms'
You had to show a Cirrus didn't you. Ouch!
Heh. I'm jealous - SR22 is on my acquisitions list.
I don't know, have you seen the people who keep running their Tesla into buildings via Summon? I could totally see one of these same kind of users running themselves over with their Tesla while cleaning it.
Jokes aside, I agree that AP is a tool... possibly Tesla could do a better job educating, advertising/promoting, and/or registering an owner's understanding of the technology before use; however, at the end of the day it's a tool if used incorrectly is dangerous... but overall I think this iterative approach towards autonomy will still make the roads safer in general.
Agreed. And recall that when cars first came out the windshields were plate glass. And seat belts hadn't even been invented yet.
Somehow we managed to not only survive, but arguably go on to overpopulate the planet. So I'm going out on a limb and betting that the human race is going to be just fine.
McHoffa
CyberOwners
You'd also need to somehow make sure the drivers take what they've learned and apply it in the real world. From my experience, most people don't even apply the basics learned in drivers' ed class.
Yeah, I was ranting a little. I started driving in 1975 and have watched the parade for a long time, over a million miles.
Yes, if all people did was pay attention to the road, and follow their basic driver's instruction, the world would be a much better place.
But you will get a wakeup call riding in a car in a defensive driving school as a passenger. I'd say only 10% of people push the brakes hard enough to get the ABS to kick on, and they don't know you can steering quickly while your brake is mashed to the floor in modern cars without any race training. Just mash and steer, that's it. It would stop most collisions.
dweeks
Member
...but only the 411 had those infamous GTSIO-520's that failed so often. As an even more relevant aside I once owned a Beagle 206S, one of the tiny number of aircraft that used those engines. Under anything other than the gentlest of touches those engines are lethal; but pretty good under gentle touches. How many piston twin drivers have gentle touches?
No, the press isn't losing their minds. They are reporting an event.
The people who are losing their minds are the fanboys who can't stand that the press is doing what the press does.
The people who are losing their minds are the fanboys who can't stand that the press is doing what the press does.
They are doing a horrid job of reporting an event, Forbes posted an article yesterday that initially read that the Tesla's 4 cameras failed to prevent the recent tragedy, when there is only 1 camera with AP 1.0. They've since corrected it, but it seems to me based on most of the press I've read that the reporters aren't taking the time to even look up simple details about the technology they are writing about, let alone bothering to research how the technology works. It's simply lazy reporting and shows how the modern media cycle plays an impact in accurate reporting.
I think Tesla has done a poor job marketing what Autopilot can actually do and has oversold the capabilities of the technology it currently provides. But the tech it's currently selling isn't unique to Tesla it's just one of the best implementations of all of it put together out there currently.
