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So with Elon Repeatedly saying how adding a second motor improves efficiency...

Discussion in 'Future Cars' started by gizmo84, Oct 10, 2014.

  1. gizmo84

    gizmo84 New Member

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    So with Elon Repeatedly saying how adding a second motor improves efficiency...... does anyone think this may be something they use to get the Model 3 to 200+ mile range? adding a second motor to the S is $4000 retail price. My hope is that they learned 2 motors is much more efficient than 1 and that the model 3 will come standard or at least have an option to get 2 motors. if they really want to sell 500,000 cars a year; it really needs AWD. hopefully in designing the awd setup for the X and the S they had the model 3 in the back of there minds..... just thinking outloud.
     
  2. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    I cant think of a single mass market vehicle that comes standard AWD/4WD. I would think that mandatory AWD would actually lower volume, as it would push price up. AWD as an option sure. But not standard.

    Accord
    Camry
    CR-V
    RAV4
    Civic
    Escape
    Fusion
    Altima
    Corolla
    Elantra
    Cruze
    Equinox

    and if you want to count pickups they also aren't standard 4WD

    F-150
    Silverado
    Ram 1500

    (those were the highest volume cars from September: The Hottest Selling Cars In America)
     
  3. MacroP

    MacroP Member

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    What about Subaru?. Standard AWD is their claim to fame for all of their vehicles*

    * except for their BRZ
     
  4. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    Right Subaru doesn't sell nearly as many vehicles as say Honda sells Civics. OP was implying that AWD would be necessary for 500,000 cars (a pipe dream for current Subaru). I was pointing out that AWD isn't standard on ANY mass market (>100,000 units) vehicle.
     
  5. techmaven

    techmaven Active Member

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    There is an interesting cross over point between adding a second motor with weight penalty or adding more battery capacity with its weight penalty. I'm sure Tesla has those calculations and knows exactly where the cross over points are any number of scenarios. It'll be a fun exercise to figure out in advance if AWD makes more sense or say, an additional 5 kWh of battery.
     
  6. art

    art Member

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    go to the tesla order site, and the new 85d without performance now gets 295 miles of range at 65 mph verses the old s85 two weel drive 265 miles of range at 55 mph. quit an improvement. no other car or truck in the world gets better efficiency with 4wd over 2wd except tesla. now the fastest four door sedan in the world and by far the most efficient four 4wd in the world.
     
  7. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    Your question is flawed. Tesla has always stated very clearly the MINIMUM range of the Model 3 will be 200+ miles. I fully expect the MAX RANGE of the Model 3 to be capable of 300-400 miles. They aren't going to show all their cards up front....
     
  8. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    In the USA through September.:
    Forester is at 117,940 (2013 total was 123,592)
    Outback is at 97,266 (2013 total was 118,049, 2012 was 117,553, 2011 was 104,405)

    Ner.
     
  9. green1

    green1 Active Member

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    Interestingly enough, the Canadian Tesla site is the reverse, 502km for the s85, and only 475km for the s85d. So I'm a little confused as to which is accurate, or why the Canadian car would have more of an issue than the American version?
     
  10. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

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    Because you're using limited test cycles that ignore higher speed highway driving?
     
  11. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    Ok so Forester and Outback sell 1/5 or 1/4 of what OP was stating.And significantly less than many models from Ford, GM, Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Hundai/Kia. That happen to have standard AWD. I don't think that changes my point much. It does change my 'don't know any' to 'only know a couple'. Or my 100,000 to 150,000.
     
  12. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Since we're talking about future cars...

    Do you think the entire Tesla automotive product line going forward will have dual motor at least as an option? My gut is Model3 yes, Roadster yes, Truck maybe.
     
  13. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    Most certainly Model 3 will have AWD as an option. How else will it get to 3.X 0-60? But it won't be standard. The whole point is to get the base price down. And adding some complexity to the front suspension, and additional VFD/Inverter motor cost is counterproductive to getting price down.
     
  14. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    My question wasn't about standard, ElSupreme, and you didn't answer it. ;)
     
  15. art

    art Member

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    brianman yes they will. i think the model 3 will use less cells for an 85 kwh auto. smaller frontal area less weight = 300 + miles of range. thats with the newer upgraded cells.
     
  16. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    I thought I did.

    Most certainly Model 3 will have AWD as an option. I would expect that going forward future skateboard like platforms will all have AWD as an option eventually, as it should be easy to implement space wise.
     
  17. charliestyr

    charliestyr EVangelist

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    I'm fairly sure the S85 got 300 miles on the old Tesla "55mph test". 265 miles is EPA and much closer to reality. This new "65mph test" is different again and so not really comparable. There used to be a range calculator somewhere on the TM site, I don't know but you could probably specify 65mph and see what it spits out.

    Charlie -
     
  18. tom66

    tom66 Member

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    http://www.teslamotors.com/goelectric#range
     
  19. art

    art Member

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    sorry my memory failed me at the 55mph range. still pretty good with 4wd.
     
  20. MassModel3

    MassModel3 Member

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    I certainly can't imagine why AWD wouldn't at least be an option on all models going forward. The goal is to sell more cars, so anything that can potentially aid in that endeavor is certainly going to be on the table. At an additional cost? Without a doubt. Hopefully at a cost of less than four grand -- the Model 3 will be a smaller car and will not require as large a second motor, so maybe 2.5 or 3K instead. Hoping...
     

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