TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Solar City and So Cal Edison

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by smilepak, Jun 10, 2015.

  1. smilepak

    smilepak Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2015
    Messages:
    705
    Location:
    Eastvale, CA
    Hi,

    from og what I research on this forum, I could call So Cal Edison for a special EV plan where if I charge the Tesla off peak it is at a reduced rate.

    For or those who went with Solar, specially Solar City leasing, during the day charging will be via Solar.

    My questions are:

    1. During the day with Solar City Lease, unused power does it go back to SCE grid and you get a credit or discount?

    2. At night during off peak, I assume the charging will be through SCE special EV plan, even though you have solar panel?

    anyone who have experienced this combo or have solar leasing can give insight?

    thx
     
  2. ddimit

    ddimit Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2013
    Messages:
    258
    Location:
    Sacramento, California, United States
    if you lease Solar City gets all the benefit. I strongly urge if you are capable to buy instead of lease. You capture the fed tax credit and you own they system. the lease can become problematic if you sell your house and the buyer doesn't want to assume. An owned system becomes an asset and adds value if you ever sell.
     
  3. rage_777

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
    Messages:
    157
    Location:
    US
    I don't have Solar City and I don't lease my panels, but I do have SCE.

    1. You are partly correct in that the power goes to SCE, but with Solar City I don't think you get the credit, Solar City does.
    2. Yes, if your solar panels are not making any power, then you are using SCE's grid to power your house and charge the car.

    I would also suggest you trying to buy your panels. I only have a 3kW system, but I usually break even at the end of the year with SCE. Last year, SCE gave me a check for $70, but the year before that I had to pay them $7. Also, my monthly bills with SCE are always less than $2, one time it was $0.25.
     
  4. smilepak

    smilepak Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2015
    Messages:
    705
    Location:
    Eastvale, CA
    Interesting. So with a BUY your own panel, you can sell extra power back to the grid for SCE. How much was your panel installed and with whom did you do that with?
     
  5. brucet999

    brucet999 Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2015
    Messages:
    1,315
    Location:
    Huntington Beach, CA
    #5 brucet999, Jun 11, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2015
    I have researched solar panel options in SCE area rather extensively and here is what I have found:

    SCE EV rate is available only with a second meter dedicated to EV use. The off-peak EV rate (10pm to 8am I think) is presently $0.1175/kWh Peak rate is at least twice that. Cost to install a second meter and 50A wiring to my garage was quoted at $2700.

    Solar panels on your roof are connected to SCE by their Net Metering program. SCE tracks usage over 12 months vs power put back onto the grid and they charge you for your net usage at tiered rates. During summer you might generate more from your panels than you consume; in winter less than you use. If your net annual usage is negative, you will see a credit for x number of kWh on your annual bill reconciliation. You may opt to receive a check from SCE for the balance at a rate of about $0.045/kWh or use it up during the next year.

    Do not expect to make money selling power back to SCE. Besides the low rate they pay, they will not permit you to build a solar array that projects to produce more than you used in the previous 12 months. To build a system with enough excess to offset the increased usage of an EV, you have to either wait a year or appeal the permit limitation, after they disallow your larger system, with an explanation of the projected additional load for EV charging.

    My usage is pretty low, so on tiered rates I pay about $60 per month. Even so, a solar panel array that exactly offset my bills would $720; about 13% tax-free return on a self-installed system, about 8% tax free on a commercially installed system. Since EV charging would push me into tier 3 and 4 rates, its 4,000 kWh per year would come at $0.29/kWh on average, so the rate of return on solar for the EV would be more like 24%. Since California is demanding that utilities increase the share of renewable energy to 50% by 2030 or whenever, we can assume that the cost of electricity will increase dramatically and rate payers will have to cover that, so your rate of return on investment will increase every year. Should you sell your home, you will be able to get at least as much premium over similar non-solar houses as your system cost; maybe more if Federal tax incentives are no longer available.

    If you choose to lease a solar array, Solar City will own the system and the net metering power it generates. They will charge you a lower rate for your usage than SCE and pocket the difference for the life of the lease. As SCE rates increase, I don't know whether Solar City will hold their rate to you or raise it.

    My conclusion: if you have the money available, buy a good system and look at it as a very good investment. If you can borrow on a home equity loan from your credit union, the rate will be low and tax deductible and the return much greater, so it probably would still end up something like 6% tax-free. If you can't afford to buy a system, then the Solar City lease would still save you a lot of money without much up-front outlay.
     
  6. rage_777

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
    Messages:
    157
    Location:
    US
    I think I paid about $25k for it after State and SCE rebates, but before the Federal Tax Credit. This was 4 years ago and I asked my installer how much it would cost now (this was last year) and he said about half that. I also have an Enphase System (micro inverters) which made the price go up. I went with Empire Solar Solutions in Pasadena, Joe is really nice and very knowledgeable. I tried Solar City, but they didn't come out they just looked at Google Maps (or something similar) and came up with an estimate. The problem is I have a two tiered roof (one partially over the first floor, and the second story roof) and they just put the system over both roofs which is illogical.

    I also agree with everything brucet999 said. SCE will try their hardest to make your system not output extra energy, but it isn't really worth it anyway. I did change to more LED lights, newer frig, and switched my projection TV to an LED TV so my usage went down which is why I got money back.
     
  7. Ampster

    Ampster Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2012
    Messages:
    614
    Location:
    Hermosa Beach CA USA
    I am also a fan of buying. I am in SCE territory so my comments relate to their rate plans. The cost of an extra meter hasn't been worth it for most people. Those who have solar and a electric vehicle pick one of the TOU (time of use) plans especially if they can shift their charging to the super off peak rates. There isn't a big payoff for over building because the end of the year reconciliation nets any over generation only $0.04/kWhr. The sweet spot is if you can load shift it is possible to be a net user of power but have a negative $ amount on you bill. That has happened to me and is the optimum balace of capacity and usage. The result of that is that the net usage washes out the $ credit.
     
  8. smilepak

    smilepak Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2015
    Messages:
    705
    Location:
    Eastvale, CA
    Thanks for the info. Here is what I found about SCE EV rate from a thread around here

    Electricity Rates for So Cal Edison (not good)

     
  9. Ampster

    Ampster Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2012
    Messages:
    614
    Location:
    Hermosa Beach CA USA
    Yes that pretty much covers it. FWIW, I have solar, live in an all electric home and have 3 electric cars. I am on TOU DB.
     

Share This Page