Solved: Road Noise & Front Wind Noise

Through the last few months, I have been watching and reading up the various posts regarding the many ways many of you all have attempted, as well as the various kits available online, to reduce if not eliminate road noise and wind noise from the Model3. After reviewing all those posts and review of the kits, I figured that since none of you have been able to achieve that elusive goal, let alone even come close to reducing the noise, made me ask the question: What are we missing?

So as I kept driving my M3, I attempted to focus on finding those missing sources ie where is the noise emanating into the cabin from. Turns out they are the 4 corners of the cabin ie the A-Pillars and C-pillars. More specifically, the A-Pillars for wind noise and C-Pillars for road noise.

#1 - The solution for wind noise is the following - Z Weatherstrip down inside the leading edge of the front door, and foam block at the top triangle where the front fender, windshield and door meet.

Z-Weatherstrip

Foam at the junction

#2 - The solution for road noise is the following - 2" Fiber insulation behind the rear seat side panels that cover the rear wheel wells.

I hope this helps everyone who have been pursuing this goal. Thanks for all the contributions and many thanks to @XPsionic for his constant engagement and interest.

 

[aspec818]

My journey with 2020 M3P sound deadening.
Tires are 235/35R20 PS4S.

Here is the summary of measurements, some pictures below.

Measurements taken with a decibel meter at the middle of front seats area on head level, no radio or AC blowing, speed 80km/h or 50mph, same road etc.
- Stand still: 38db
- Stock: 68-69db
- Sound deadening inside fenders: 68-70db
- Sound deadening trunk: 67-68db
- Sound deadening front floor: 67-68db
- Sound deadening front doors: 65-66db
- Sound deadening rear doors: 65-66db
- Additional door seals: 65-66db

After all above was done, I took some measurements from here and there, on a different road (higher db)
- From the original measuring spot: 67db
- At the middle of side front window: 72db
- Top back corner of the front window seal: 72db
- Front floor: 72db
- Windshield: 72db
- Middle of the front door: 74db
- Middle head level backseat: 68db
- Middle of the door: 73db
- Middle of window: 73db
- Back seat floor: 74db
- Under the back seat: 72db
- Back triangle window: 78db

After these I actually added some more sound deadening to the back/trunk and door seals, but did not re-measure as I could not hear the difference.

Sound deadening inside of the fenders:
In my previous cars, typically biggest gains have come with sound deadening the fenders with underbody coating.
Tesla has non-existing rust prevention, so I started by going through the seams with a zinc paint, then rust protecting cavity wax and finally thick underbody coating to kill the noise (~1kg per fender).
View attachment 957946 View attachment 957947 View attachment 957948 View attachment 957949

Next sound deadening the trunk, front and rear floors, rear fenders from inside, doors:
Materials used were CTK brand as that was locally available.
I added 2.2 millimeter Butyl mat to all straight surfaces in body, avoiding to add over the seams as that would collect moisture in Finland conditions and I wanted to avoid rusting.
On top of butyl I added some felt type of blanket in dry locations (Caimat) and in doors and locations whetre i expected to have moisture or water (Wavefix) which is not absorbing water.

This is not the final stage of trunk, as I added some more material, but gives the idea.
View attachment 957951 View attachment 957952 View attachment 957953

Trunk roof.
View attachment 957954 View attachment 957955 View attachment 957956

Back floor, front floor, doors, trunk lid and pane, sound block from a-pillar to door. (also added some butyl to frunk, but did not notice any difference)
.. seems like there is a 10 photos max limit, but followed the similar practices inside of the cabin, inside of the doors and also added more sound deadening to the door panels.

Overall I managed half the sound energy (-3db), which is ok, but was honestly expecting more improvement when original sound deadening was so bad.
I could not identify any single source of problem and sound dropped rather gradually as I made progress.

Btw butyl doesn’t do much for sound blocking. It just prevents resonance. You need MLV if you want sound blocking

 

[XPsionic]

A few months after installing the fireproof mats, road noise just feels normal like before, now what bothers me are all the small ticking noises from the rear seats rubbing on each other over bumps, and the general noise from the suspension and wheels over sharp bumps, mostly from the rear of the car.

 

[enemji]

A few months after installing the fireproof mats, road noise just feels normal like before, now what bothers me are all the small ticking noises from the rear seats rubbing on each other over bumps, and the general noise from the suspension and wheels over sharp bumps, mostly from the rear of the car.

I have a fix for that too. Wanna look at it?

 

[XPsionic]

I have a fix for that too. Wanna look at it

Of course Post in a new thread?

 

[enemji]

Of course Post in a new thread?

Lol. No here you go!

Use this rubber tape to make sure the seat closes tight. No movement.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Z4RDM8T

 

[XPsionic]

Lol. No here you go!
Use this rubber tape to make sure the seat closes tight. No movement.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Z4RDM8T

I was gonna get some foam rubber tape like what you linked, but then I found a big piece of unused foam instead. Gonna see if this makes a difference. Also cut up some pieces of the same foam to fit the roof of the trunk and wedged them in there, lol. Will report back and see if this makes the seat squeak even more or not. When I used a phone app to measure noise levels, this 2" foam seem to absorb about 3db or so. And yes, the seats latches securely no problem at all.

 

[enemji]

I was gonna get some foam rubber tape like what you linked, but then I found a big piece of unused foam instead. Gonna see if this makes a difference. Also cut up some pieces of the same foam to fit the roof of the trunk and wedged them in there, lol. Will report back and see if this makes the seat squeak even more or not. When I used a phone app to measure noise levels, this 2" foam seem to absorb about 3db or so. And yes, the seats latches securely no problem at all.

View attachment 959336

As long as it provides a positive pressure such that the latch is always tight, it will work.

I went with the tape as it is not intrusive when I have to fold the seats down for a full trunk load.

 

[XPsionic]

As long as it provides a positive pressure such that the latch is always tight, it will work.

I went with the tape as it is not intrusive when I have to fold the seats down for a full trunk load.

Happy to report back that it worked amazingly well. All the little clicks and rattles disappeared after the giant foam piece was installed. The car definitely feels quieter on top of the missing clicks and rattles, I'm guessing a bit of the trunk reverb is being absorbed by the foam, the car simply sounds different while rolling on a flat surface with no bumps (and thus, no rattles). However the overall feeling of tire noise in the cabin remains more or less the same.

It takes 3 seconds to take the foam off of the latches if I ever need to fold the seats forward, which I rarely ever do, so it's staying there for now. This would look a lot better if the foam is black in color.

 

[Ampre Sand]

Looking forward to a post trip update!

Indeed! Post trip update...

The wind noise is greatly improved with my adjustments to the gaskets, and perhaps the added z-gaskets and A-pillar foam. However, as the window seals heat up in the hot air and sun, they apparently soften and wind / traffic noise starts to leak in again.

Whether due to the new tires or the heavy ceramic fiber insulation, road rumble seems a little less harsh depending on the road surface quality. It's like it's been toned down a bit, but still not what you'd really want. My 2016 LEAF is quieter (and altogether less drama).

Unfortunately, I don't have before/after decibel readings, and besides, you can have relatively quiet / moderate sounds that are still annoying and fatiguing over time.

End result: meh. It's an excessively loud car for road trips. My other half is more sensitive to it than I am, but after the last two big trips even yours truly, the eternal optimist, must admit it is only second worse to our old Miata. It truly is exhausting after a day's driving. You just want to be a quiet room with an adult beverage. We didn't even listen to music while driving as it would just add to the noise.

My advice would be if you really love the car, go for it. You can chip away at the road noise as others have done... but other glaring deficiencies with the car (and the company behind it) are not so "user-serviceable." The only options then are to either put up with those negatives, or shop for a different brand. So, meh.

 

[XPsionic]

End result: meh. It's an excessively loud car for road trips. My other half is more sensitive to it than I am, but after the last two big trips even yours truly, the eternal optimist, must admit it is only second worse to our old Miata. It truly is exhausting after a day's driving. You just want to be a quiet room with an adult beverage. We didn't even listen to music while driving as it would just add to the noise.

My advice would be if you really love the car, go for it. You can chip away at the road noise as others have done... but other glaring deficiencies with the car (and the company behind it) are not so "user-serviceable." The only options then are to either put up with those negatives, or shop for a different brand. So, meh.

hmm I find that a bit surprising and that's too bad. The Model 3 to me started off louder than my 2015 3 series with summer performance tires before I did all the sound/foam/insulation mods, and now it's about the same as the BMW. Still quiet enough to have easy conversations on the highway unless the texture of the road is very coarse.

 

[enemji]

Indeed! Post trip update...

The wind noise is greatly improved with my adjustments to the gaskets, and perhaps the added z-gaskets and A-pillar foam. However, as the window seals heat up in the hot air and sun, they apparently soften and wind / traffic noise starts to leak in again.

Whether due to the new tires or the heavy ceramic fiber insulation, road rumble seems a little less harsh depending on the road surface quality. It's like it's been toned down a bit, but still not what you'd really want. My 2016 LEAF is quieter (and altogether less drama).

Unfortunately, I don't have before/after decibel readings, and besides, you can have relatively quiet / moderate sounds that are still annoying and fatiguing over time.

End result: meh. It's an excessively loud car for road trips. My other half is more sensitive to it than I am, but after the last two big trips even yours truly, the eternal optimist, must admit it is only second worse to our old Miata. It truly is exhausting after a day's driving. You just want to be a quiet room with an adult beverage. We didn't even listen to music while driving as it would just add to the noise.

My advice would be if you really love the car, go for it. You can chip away at the road noise as others have done... but other glaring deficiencies with the car (and the company behind it) are not so "user-serviceable." The only options then are to either put up with those negatives, or shop for a different brand. So, meh.

My road trip experience using the 18” Kinergy GT tires doing 80mph is very positive. The tire tread design makes a lot of difference, especially for what speed it’s pattern is tuned to be quietest. The Kinergy GT is quiet at 60mph and even quieter at 80mph.

Also remember- the firmer the suspension including the tire wall, the more noise it transfers to the body. The Kinergy GT is 94V vs others at 98W or 98Y

 

[Ampre Sand]

hmm I find that a bit surprising and that's too bad. The Model 3 to me started off louder than my 2015 3 series with summer performance tires before I did all the sound/foam/insulation mods, and now it's about the same as the BMW. Still quiet enough to have easy conversations on the highway unless the texture of the road is very coarse.

I'd love to have the car quieter for however much longer we choose to own it, which is why I thought it worth spending a Saturday evening doing these modifications. On smooth and relatively smooth roads, it seems like there's a perceptible improvement. On highways and interstates with just the right rough texture, it's still loud. Probably the worst was I-90 Eastbound up and over the Cascade Mountains. I mean, it was bad.

I think, at least for my copy of the Model 3, it would take some more work, either targeted sound reduction, or perhaps a broad spectrum effort throughout the interior. The rumble seems to come from everywhere, but I know that can be misleading in such a small space with a curved glass roof.

 

[enemji]

I'd love to have the car quieter for however much longer we choose to own it, which is why I thought it worth spending a Saturday evening doing these modifications. On smooth and relatively smooth roads, it seems like there's a perceptible improvement. On highways and interstates with just the right rough texture, it's still loud. Probably the worst was I-90 Eastbound up and over the Cascade Mountains. I mean, it was bad.

I think, at least for my copy of the Model 3, it would take some more work, either targeted sound reduction, or perhaps a broad spectrum effort throughout the interior. The rumble seems to come from everywhere, but I know that can be misleading in such a small space with a curved glass roof.

Which tires are you using?

 

[Ampre Sand]

Which tires are you using?

The original MXM4s were nearly down to the wear bars, so based on this thread, we decided to try the Hankook iON evo (on stock 18" wheels). The tires do seem a step quieter in day-to-day driving, but still no match for that segment of I-90 and similar surfaces. In retrospect we probably should have gone with a Model S or even an X. The latter was very impressive on test drive, but you just don't know until you drive across the country what's really in the cards.

 

[XPsionic]

The original MXM4s were nearly down to the wear bars, so based on this thread, we decided to try the Hankook iON evo (on stock 18" wheels). The tires do seem a step quieter in day-to-day driving, but still no match for that segment of I-90 and similar surfaces. In retrospect we probably should have gone with a Model S or even an X. The latter was very impressive on test drive, but you just don't know until you drive across the country what's really in the cards.

Yeah the S is a big step quieter on the highway than the 3.

 

[enemji]

The original MXM4s were nearly down to the wear bars, so based on this thread, we decided to try the Hankook iON evo (on stock 18" wheels). The tires do seem a step quieter in day-to-day driving, but still no match for that segment of I-90 and similar surfaces. In retrospect we probably should have gone with a Model S or even an X. The latter was very impressive on test drive, but you just don't know until you drive across the country what's really in the cards.

I have tested both the Hankook ION Evo and Hankook Kinergy GT. The Kinergy GT are way quieter.

 

[TM3Sup]

Why not use poly-fil instead of ceramic wool? Fire hazard? It is much safer and non-irritant.

 

[ICE5891]

Why not use poly-fil instead of ceramic wool? Fire hazard? It is much safer and non-irritant.

In the end of the day what block lower frequencies is a heavier mass. The ceramic wool is not as heavy of a MLV but if you stuff it in compressing it gets somehow dense, I believe that's why we have experienced a reasonable improvement.

 

[Tslylr]

I can see this turning into a VERY NICE cottage industry… come to your home or workplace, spend 2-3 hours and charge 600-1000$ and turn your Model 3/Y into a European luxury sedan (well, actually the Japanese luxury segments of the three large OEM are technically quieter and more serine than most European ((we really just mean JERRRMAN!)) sedans. I’d probably pay that, but would ask for a discount for coming up with the idea!

You mean like this? Vehicle insulation for Tesla Model S, 3, X and Y | Shop4Tesla

 

[atsimeri]

I found a very nice article from a a mechanic about the sources of road noise. It seems right to the point. No matter how much dynamat you add to the whole car, you may fight acoustic road noise, but the majority is the conductive road noise from the suspension coming to the chassis. Just before reading the article I was driving my model 3 on rough asphalt and the vibrations were felt to my feet, the pedals and the steering wheel. The whole car was dancing to the sound of the rough asphalt. THIS IS A LOST BATTLE.
the only thing that will save us is th right set of tyres. Whoever finds the tyres that are the most silent, literally saves the (tesla) planet.

A Crucial Element Needed For A Truly Quiet Car: Subframes

Guest post by Doug Tews Numerous posters on this site have expressed the desire for finding quiet, comfortable cars for driving

elevatingsound.com