TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Someone talk me out of my range anxiety

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by m3chhawk, Aug 8, 2016.

  1. m3chhawk

    m3chhawk Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    Good evening,

    I have been lurking for awhile and took delivery of my refreshed 90D MS in late June. I have ~2,500 miles on the car including a handful of trips at 180-185 miles.

    I am about to take my maiden voyage using the SC network and stretching the range out a bit. The first half of the trip will be 210 miles on a toll road with a 75 MPH speed limit. I will then hit the SC for full charge and make the next 210 miles on a primarily 65 MPH highway.

    Everything in my gut (and head) tells me I will be just fine, but the first leg at 75-80 MPH with a/c is beginning to keep me up at night. Once I start each leg, I will essentially be on an island with virtually no viable charging opportunities.

    The trip will be at night with headlights. The car has aftermarket 20" wheels, while I haven't weighed them, I likely sit somewhere between the 19" and 21" range numbers.

    Thoughts?

    Austin
     
  2. mmccord

    mmccord Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2014
    Messages:
    761
    Location:
    Pine Bush, NY
    Unless there is a large mountain or 25mph headwind, I wouldn't be the least bit concerned. You can always slow down for the second hundred miles if necessary.
     
    • Like x 1
    • Dislike x 1
  3. m3chhawk

    m3chhawk Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    Total elevation climb on the way out is 2,000 feet with a predicted 15-20 mph headwind
     
  4. Boourns

    Boourns Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2016
    Messages:
    657
    Location:
    Dallas
    Use evtriplanner.com. Drive slow until you are confident you can make it. You'll be fine. You learn to swim by jumping in the deep end.
     
  5. chillaban

    chillaban Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2016
    Messages:
    576
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    Always keep an eye on the trip projection energy graph, and if that falls too low for your likings, SLOW DOWN. The #1 thing you can do to dramatically increase your range is slow down. It might suck your pride a bit to be driving your fancy car at 60 or 65 in the slow lane while Priuses are whizzing past you, but hey, it's less humiliating than running out of juice.


    Most often I've found range anxiety to be largely made up. I've taken 3 long road trips now on the supercharger network and have always been within comfortable margin. The car's built-in tools are great!
     
  6. m3chhawk

    m3chhawk Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    Using EV Trip Planner and 1.05 speed multiplier, I come up with 270 rated miles used and 231 rated miles used respectively.
     
  7. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2015
    Messages:
    878
    Location:
    Boise, ID
    So....you are worried about this stretch, but it is a 75mph zone, and you are talking about going 75-80mph?! o_O
    How about...oh, I don't know...NOT speeding, if you're worried about the range?

    I've done a couple of routes of 230+ miles in my 85kwh. Slowing is your friend. Now I don't like how some people flip out, like there is no middle ground--as if not going 80+ mph means they have to poke along at 55mph. It's not that extreme, but going something like 70 or 72 in that 75mph speed limit zone would be within the speed limit, as you are supposed to do, and can save you some stress, as it will extend your range. Best tip I heard from someone was to save it up early, going slower in the first half to "put some miles in the bank". Later on, if it's going well, and you have margin, you can speed up and use them. That is way more fun than if you start off too fast, discover you have a problem, and then are trying to claw them back when you don't have them.
     
    • Like x 6
    • Dislike x 1
  8. Redmiata98

    Redmiata98 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2014
    Messages:
    129
    Location:
    Northern Virginia, USA
    You can trust the nav, it will tell you when and how long to stop. As said above, watch your energy graph for the projected miles. Set it to max, 30 miles average. I keep the energy graph and nav screen on the touchscreen on a long trip. You will not lose your range anxiety until you have made numerous long trips and become comfortable and understand how to decipher the data being presented by the car.

    We just got back from a round trip to Chicago from Virginia (1500 miles+) and everything worked fine. Just a note of caution, make sure you are paying attention to the energy graph and matching its projection against the distance to your next suoercharger.

    As you venture off the Supercharger Network you should become familiar with two apps: Chargepoint and Plugshare. They will help you find alternate chargers when you are off the net. Some of the chargers are free, others you pay for. Most of them are slow but it can help when you only need 30 or 40 miles to get back to the Network.
     
  9. m3chhawk

    m3chhawk Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    Haha, certainly not planning on driving 80, just using that to be a bit conservative and build in some headroom.
     
  10. m3chhawk

    m3chhawk Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    Kansas City, MO
    All good advice everyone, much appreciated. It's the same conversation I have been having in my head, but the inexperience still allows the doubt to creep in :)
     
  11. Moneesh

    Moneesh Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2016
    Messages:
    50
    Location:
    Yorba Linda, CA
    Drive under 65 anytime you feel range anxiety and stick to the plan using evtriplanner.com. I took delivery 1 month ago of a MS 90D as well, and have 2,000 miles on it as of today. Within 48 hours of picking up the car, I went on a 1,200 mile round trip road trip. I had similar range anxiety and planned well in advance, which made all the difference. I had zero experience with EV's prior to taking the trip. Everything worked out.

    What I learned very quickly is slow and steady wins the "range" race. The planning site is very accurate, IF you follow your plan. Last thing I learned is generative braking and going downhill is your friend. Don't try to be a rock start going up hills at a fast speeds, passing 18 wheelers, you will pay dearly in range. When going downhill, coast and watch your range increase in 3 mile increments, that will make you smile, as your anxiety dissipates.

    Good luck on your trip and enjoy it!
     
  12. mikeash

    mikeash Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2014
    Messages:
    1,107
    Location:
    Fairfax, VA, USA
    I just did Ohio to Virginia yesterday. The first segment was Columbus to the Triadelphia Supercharger. Most of that road is 70MPH, the second half is very hilly, and there's a decent climb. It was warm, the car was fully loaded with five people and lots of luggage, and to cap it all off I had to do a bunch of local driving before heading out, and wanted to avoid stopping to charge before leaving Columbus if at all possible. When we left, the car said we'd arrive with 8%. We arrived with 10%. If that had started to trend the other way, I would have gone from doing the speed limit plus 5MPH to just doing the speed limit exactly, and that probably would have solved it. If you really want to extend the range, find a big truck and sit behind him. They're usually slower, plus you'll get some benefit by drafting (there's some benefit even when at a decent, safe distance) and anybody who's annoyed at slowpokes will be annoyed at the truck rather than you.
     
    • Like x 1
  13. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2012
    Messages:
    12,743
    Location:
    Texas
    Start slow and watch the trip metre. The "dot" will either go above or below the projected line. Adjust speed accordingly.
     
  14. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2012
    Messages:
    4,491
    Location:
    Maine
    You should have anxiety for the trip you're doing. Headwinds, precipitation and temperature all lower efficiency and you can't control them. But you control your speed. Not only does slower driving lower energy demand, but it makes for smoother, more relaxed driving. Since you'll be driving at night the reduced traffic should allow you to drive at a lower speed more consistently without affecting traffic flow.
     
  15. Xenius

    Xenius Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2015
    Messages:
    402
    Location:
    Havertown, PA
    As someone who liked to game the mpg meter in my previous Civic Si, I plan to drafter where possible (at a safe distance, where I'd be visible to the truck).
     
  16. Btrflyl8e

    Btrflyl8e Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2013
    Messages:
    2,272
    Location:
    Seminole, Florida, United States
    You will be fine. I routinely skip savannah SC on my Tampa to Charlotte trips, which means a leg of about 210 miles in my 90D. I never charge to 100% even for that leg, and I make it just fine. I've done it in rain, with some headwinds, etc. I generally keep AP set around 75mph or so, usually bumping it up after the halfway point if the math is good.

    But previous posters are correct, if you see you're using more miles than expected just slow down (the car will even warn you, even telling you what speed you should be under).

    p.s. You are doing yourself a favor by making a road trip right away... It's the best way to get range anxiety out of your system!
     
    • Like x 1
  17. bob_p

    bob_p Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2012
    Messages:
    939
    I've got nearly 75K miles on my classic P85, making many road trips under 300 miles, and recently did a ~2500 mile road trip.

    It helps to pre-plan the charging before leaving, so you know which of the trip segments could be tight.

    It's also important to plan using the practical range of the car - not the rated range, since you want to avoid running the car too low on charge, which could be detrimental to the battery, and, except for the first leg after an overnight stop, you will typically not have more than 80-90% of a full charge when you leave a charger (since charging slows down considerably above 80% of charge). For planning purposes, we assume we'll only use 70-80% of the rated range for the car - and even then, we add a factor to account for weather, traffic, elevation, and highway speeds.

    What worked pretty well for us on our recent long road trip was a "30-30" rule. Before leaving the charger, we took the miles to the next charger, added 30%, and then added an extra 30 miles of cushion. For example, if we had 100 miles to the next charger, we'd wait until we had 160 miles of rated range before leaving the charger. We also used the trip planner to verify the charging level, looking at the projected charge at destination in the trip planner, and staying at the charger until we had at least 25% charge predicted at the destination.

    Doing that typically allowed us to drive at highway speeds, keeping up with the other traffic (up to 5MPH over the speed limit), and only had to slow down if we were facing heaving headwinds. Unfortunately, on our last day of driving, we were driving into sustained 25MPH headwinds - and even with using the above rules, we had to slow down on each leg in order to stretch the charge to the next SC.

    With planning and by monitoring the charge usage so we can slow down early enough to maintain reasonable speeds, we don't have range anxiety. The only anxiety we've had on the trips - is dealing with the uncertainty of supercharger availability - and each time we approach an SC, we are relieved to see there is an open charging spot (except for one trip, when construction was blocking the supercharger). Since Tesla should have the real-time data on SC usage, and even the ability to do some prediction on near term likely usage, they could help alleviate the "supercharger anxiety" by providing real-time status of the upcoming supercharger.
     
  18. ABCCBA

    ABCCBA Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2015
    Messages:
    390
    Location:
    Somewhere
    #18 ABCCBA, Aug 9, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2016
    @m3chhawk I bought my MS 85D in Austin, TX and drove it home to Florida. I had one stretch on I-10 that is very similar to your stretch of 210 miles.

    Here are my comments and thoughts. The stretch was from Baton Rouge to Mobile. It was 199 miles. I fully charged to 100% in anticipation of the long stretch. I was excited to see how far I could run on the fully charged 272 estimated miles after a 100% charge. I left Baton Rouge late evening, about 11:00 p.m. When I got on the Interstate, traffic was flying and I was doing 75 MPH in the center lane, trying to stay safe and out of the way. I was using 360 to 385 Wh/mi. Then, once I got past New Orleans and on to I-10, it started raining. It was a chilly rain and I noticed that the energy usage was spiking every few minutes. I figured it had to be the battery heating itself as it was being cooled by the water splashing underneath the car. Additionally, the added friction of the tires pushing through the rain on the pavement. The battery charge percentage and estimated miles really started dropping quickly. I started slowing down to at the speed limit and then below the speed limit. I turned range mode on, turned off all cabin climate control, turned off the radio, turned down the brightness of the display, Disconnected my phone from the Bluetooth connect. I did everything I could to minimize power consumption and still be safe on the road. When I pulled into the Mobile SuC, I had 37 miles remaining. My 272 Rated Range, 100% charge got me 198 miles plus 37 in the battery, if that many. I can tell you that if I had not gone into the Conserve mode just outside of New Orleans, I would not have made it, period. No doubt.

    Will you make 210? Yes, probably, but it depends. You are starting out with 5KWh more than my 85D. While my trip had virtually no elevation change, you stated you have over 2000 feet of change, which can be huge. Then, you are in a potentially stormy and windy area. So, I would say you are stretching it and will need to pay close attention during the first 50% usage of the battery and then take appropriate actions to save considerably during the last 50%.

    Others may drive your exact route, but my experience says be ready to shut the AC off, slow way down -10MPH below speed limit and know where some Level 2 Chargers are which are 190 to 200 miles from your starting point.

    Have fun on your trip. I learned an awful lot pushing the car to its limits in several areas.

    Mike
    2016-03-25 01.44.32.jpg 2016-03-25 01.45.02.jpg


     
    • Informative x 1
    • Like x 1
    • Dislike x 1
  19. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2015
    Messages:
    878
    Location:
    Boise, ID
    I think @MikeJr74 's travel story does have a few things that are learning points. It's a good example of why it's not a good idea to start out doing 75 on a leg of a trip that is going to be pushing the distance.

    Yep, I think that is quite correct. Most people are aware of "range mode" toning down the climate control, but the other thing it does, which is not necessarily widely known, is that it does not turn on the battery heating as much unless it is really badly needed. That will turn off those higher energy spikes in colder weather. And yeah, I hadn't thought as much about the cold water under the car sucking heat out of the battery faster. It may have been good to have range mode on from the start.

    None of that does anything noticeable at all. It's not even fractions of a percent compared to the motor and climate control, so don't stress about any of those.
     
    • Like x 2
  20. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2015
    Messages:
    878
    Location:
    Boise, ID
    Wow, people on this board are touchy. Someone just threw a dislike on my recommendation comment from yesterday. And a good day to you too, sir!
     
    • Funny x 2

Share This Page